Rolling Road Results (SHOCKIN)

[Eddie_Ph1]

mate using two different rolling roads is a completly pointless excersize.

The only way to see real improvements is to go to the same rolling road everytime.

With those mods you will be lucky to see 180bhp. i had exactly the same, and my car was generally a bit of a freak and only made 179.9 bhp at TDF.

It then had cams fitted and was mapped again on the same rollers, 193 bhp. At surrey rolling road it made 188 bhp!

Its since had ITB's fitted, and on the same rollers before 192.7 bhp after 210.3 bhp.

So i can see consistent gains as ive used the same rolling road throughout.

I know what your saying mate but 161 bhp lol come on thats just not right at all and it aint just the bhp diffrents its the fact they showed me it was running way to rich about as rich as a turbo'd car and it shouldnt be after having it mapped.

 

[Dave.]

unfortunatly thats always the way, theres only two places in the country id trust to custom map it. TDF and RS Tuning TBH

Jamsport are great with RS Turbo's, but prob not the georgie best with the F4R

 

[Vicky.]

In that case your figures weren't majorly bad. The majority of the 182's at our recent dyno day made high 150's low 160's (mine made 164 ATH) admittedly with matched inlets and a map you should have maybe got a few more but that might be lost through using a different dyno. Once the 10-12% drive train loss figure is added then your flywheel bhp figures shouldn't be that far off the mark at all.

 

[Dan]

unfortunatly thats always the way, theres only two places in the country id trust to custom map it. TDF and RS Tuning TBH

Jamsport are great with RS Turbo's, but prob not the georgie best with the F4R

2nd that RS is the only place I would take mine but never looked at TDF

 

[172Ben]

unfortunatly thats always the way, theres only two places in the country id trust to custom map it. TDF and RS Tuning TBH

Jamsport are great with RS Turbo's, but prob not the georgie best with the F4R

They were awesome with mine

 

[Eddie_Ph1]

In that case your figures weren't majorly bad. The majority of the 182's at our recent dyno day made high 150's low 160's (mine made 164 ATH) admittedly with matched inlets and a map you should have maybe got a few more but that might be lost through using a different dyno. Once the 10-12% drive train loss figure is added then your flywheel bhp figures shouldn't be that far off the mark at all.

With the mods iv got thou it should make more then 161 bhp and its a massive 27 bhp down to what jamsport said and its running rich what is not right not considering its been maped.

 

[Pete.M]

I was there today with some of the RTOC guys, I spoke to you briefly about the car just after you had the results.

They did essentially say to every single one of the guys with a 5 that there car was running rich so I not sure what you can deduce from that but it may mean there was a fault somewhere with there stuff. It may also mean that they were all running rich. As others have said the change is more than likely due to the use of two different dynos.

Personally I say if your happy with the car it does its job then why worry too much.
Here is a video of my mates R5 on the dyno from today.

 

[Dave.]

unfortunatly thats always the way, theres only two places in the country id trust to custom map it. TDF and RS Tuning TBH

Jamsport are great with RS Turbo's, but prob not the georgie best with the F4R

I meant the above with the standard management

 

[Eddie_Ph1]

I was there today with some of the RTOC guys, I spoke to you briefly about the car just after you had the results.

They did essentially say to every single one of the guys with a 5 that there car was running rich so I not sure what you can deduce from that but it may mean there was a fault somewhere with there stuff. It may also mean that they were all running rich. As others have said the change is more than likely due to the use of two different dynos.

Personally I say if your happy with the car it does its job then why worry too much.
Here is a video of my mates R5 on the dyno from today.

I thought some of the R5's were running too lean??

 

[Pete.M]

I thought some of the R5's were running too lean??

All the guys I knew/spoke to were too rich... perhaps I'm was wrong though.

The trophy looked good though!

Did you stay to see the R5 drag car?

 

[Eddie_Ph1]

All the guys I knew/spoke to were too rich... perhaps I'm was wrong though.

The trophy looked good though!

Did you stay to see the R5 drag car?

I spoke to two guys with R5's and they said theres were running too lean :S and yh i try keep it clean . Yh that car seems an animal shame there was sumat up with it.

 

[gti6steve]

My 182 made 163 bhp at Ktech with same mods mate and 184 bhp at powetstation in tewkesbury 3 hours later
Dyno lottery I'm afraid

 

[Eddie_Ph1]

My 182 made 163 bhp at Ktech with same mods mate and 184 bhp at powetstation in tewkesbury 3 hours later
Dyno lottery I'm afraid

thats mad but im a bit concerned with them saying its running rich and that im loseing power.

 

[gti6steve]

Yeah but are you though how does it feel on the road I would not worry if it feels ok my mates rs turbo was to rich up there and they did all the work to it work that out

 

[Eddie_Ph1]

Yeah but are you though how does it feel on the road I would not worry if it feels ok my mates rs turbo was to rich up there and they did all the work to it work that out

It does seem to go well enuf just seems to have a flat spot between 6500 rpm and 7000 rpm and i dunno what think i could do with taking it back jamsport and having the map look at again as it cost me over £500 to get the inlets done and maped..

 

[gti6steve]

Ktech was cheaper than that for mine how long you had this problem for since jamsport mapped it ?

 

[john lloyd]

It could be a sensor has started playing up since you custom map which is giving your higher afr but from what I remember I thought 12.1 afr was ok but not got any of my results to hand. What's your mpg like?

 

[Eddie_Ph1]

Ktech was cheaper than that for mine how long you had this problem for since jamsport mapped it ?

I know mate but a had a custom map and k-tec do the the group n remap witch is cheaper and yes since iv had it back from jamsport it seems to have a flat spot after 6500 rpm like the power drops of alot then comes back in at 7000 rpm.

 

[gti6steve]

as i said mate dyno lottery look at my graphs

 

[unfortunately_french]

i dunno how it's worked out tbh any1 know what % u loose as it goes to the wheels???

The loss is called the transmission loss as the power at the flywheel spins through the gearbox it has to spin the gears of course and go through the viscosity of the oil. Transmission losses are different on all cars, it's totally down to the gearbox. The only way you can truely know is by doing mechanical engineering calculations based on the physics and components of the gearbox(which are above my current level of intelligence lol) or by using TWO reliable rolling roads, getting the readings for BHP at fly and BHP at the wheels and then seeing if the percentages work out about the same. For example if the first rolling road said it was 200 at the fly and 180 at the wheels (10% loss) and the second rolling road said it was 180 at the fly and 160 at the wheels (12% loss) you'd know that the exact loss is between those 2 numbers.

 

[gti6steve]

mine was a custom map dont know what your on about group n

 

[Eddie_Ph1]

mine was a custom map dont know what your on about group n

Its basicaly a basic map wheres a custom map is maped to your mods and looking at your graphs your car holds its power good as mine when it gets too 6500 rpm the graph reading just drops off.

 

[Eddie_Ph1]

 

[Eddie_Ph1]

As you can see from the graph the power dissapears at 6500 rpm what isnt right.

 

[unfortunately_french]

As you can see from the graph the power dissapears at 6500 rpm what isnt right.

Has it occurred to you that peak power is at 6500rpm then? That's why your seeing a drop off after that. Just because you car revs up to 7,250 or whatever it doesn't mean it will produce peak power at the highest revs, hardly any cars do in fact (at the limiter).

 

[172Ben]

My graph

Makes peak power at 7283rpm

Type r makes peak power way up near the limiter as well

 

[Eddie_Ph1]

Has it occurred to you that peak power is at 6500rpm then? That's why your seeing a drop off after that. Just because you car revs up to 7,250 or whatever it doesn't mean it will produce peak power at the highest revs, hardly any cars do in fact (at the limiter).

Yes the peak power is at 6500 rpm but when it hits it peak power it doesnt mean that all the power goes away it should hold power more just like gti6steve graphs what hes posted on here just look at the diffrents between his and mine lol.

 

[gti6steve]

i see what you mean with yours it drops off quite bad you must feel that on the road

 

[Eddie_Ph1]

i see what you mean with yours it drops off quite bad you must feel that on the road

Yes mate thats what im on about and yeah i feel it alot like the power has gone after 6500 rpm and its only since iv had the inlets and maped done.

 

[popie]

I love powerstations rr.......they always add 20/30 bhp.
And how they work out the whp?????

 

[Eddie_Ph1]

This is my graph from JAM - sport when i had the inlets and custom remap as you can see the power drops off too soon.

 

[gti6steve]

my graphs aint like that at all take it back to jamsport

 

[gti6steve]

I love powerstations rr.......they always add 20/30 bhp.
And how they work out the whp?????

allways used powerstations rollers and quite a few of us belive them to be about right ktech rollers are knackard thats why they are having new ones installed im going to back to ktech in april to have my map adjusted and to see what i it gets on there new rr

 

[Dave.]

Should be a bit more like this

 

[Eddie_Ph1]

Yh im going take it back to jamsport cause it defo aint right at all and after spending over £500 on having inlets and remap done i want it right.

 

[Eddie_Ph1]

Should be a bit more like this

Yeah your power doesnt drop off so sudden like mine as mine just before 7000 rpm it drops off to about 137 bhp wheres yours holds its power alot better so just shows it aint right at all.

 

[172Ben]

Mine drops off at the end, as above, and it was fine

 

[Eddie_Ph1]

Mine drops off at the end, as above, and it was fine

I know just looked at yours mines not right at all then is it? as you can feel the power loss after 6500 rpm.

 

[172Ben]

No idea, speak to Mark, he will sort you out

 

[Eddie_Ph1]

No idea, speak to Mark, he will sort you out

Yeah going speak to him monday as i need it sorting cause i go nurburgring in 5 week.