Rough geo setup

[sam JFM]

Morning,

I have put some rough setting onto the clio and am after some feedback, (i will adjust when i have tyre temp info)

Front ride height (hub center to bottom of wheel arch) 407mm (level bottom arms to try to reduce roll center and bump steer issues)

frontn Camber: 1 degree negitive

front tow: 2mm out total

Rake (measured from the top of the jack point holes to the floor): 20mm back to front

Any comments?

 

[MG cup]

Is it track setup or for road? How much does that make your car lowered by? what suspension? what wheels and tyres? What car?

Level bottom arms isnt any use really, bump and roll centres will be well off. From the bottom arms being level the suspension is only ever going to go into + camber from that point on.

 

[sam JFM]

Its a tarmac rally car,

Leda coilovers , standard arms etc , 400lb rear springs in standard position (not sure about front springs)

172 (stripped)

2118's and 195/50/15 V70a's


I thought that level bottom arms was a good starting point (as apposed to arms and steering rods pointing at the sky) , i couldnt tell you how much its lowered by as i dont know what it started from but it "looks" about standard ish certainly not slammed.

 

[MG cup]

I would want more camber on the front and rear for a start with some toe out maybe on the rear depending if you prefer it loose or tight. I don't think you would want as an aggressive setup as a track car but close.

It all depends what kind of Tarmac you are likely to come across, I can't comment on poundages as they are preferential really and conditions dependant, most like to have a softer front end than rear in these cars. I'm not saying softer front springs on the front compared to rear but less roll resistance on the front compared to rear.

Leda know their onions and could advise you on best springs, having seperate spring and shocker on the rear makes a big difference for poundages. Rally boys almost always have 3-way adjustables as its needed to soak up them rough back road's on compression and not throw you into the scenery on rebound.

Re wishbones- you can only pi** with the c**k you have and would need to do a bit of work on the front setup to get geomatery right, ideally wishbones should be pointing down then your suspension will go - before it levels out and starts to go +

 

[sam JFM]

At somepoint I will get round to modding the front wishbones, but to have them pointing down now would mean you have sky high ride height

I am hoping for a shakedown at oulton so will monitor tyre temps and try to adjust whilst keeping compliance in mind.

Its not easy to find recommended settings

 

[Alex Conway]

I would want more camber on the front and rear for a start with some toe out maybe on the rear depending if you prefer it loose or tight. I don't think you would want as an aggressive setup as a track car but close.

It all depends what kind of Tarmac you are likely to come across, I can't comment on poundages as they are preferential really and conditions dependant, most like to have a softer front end than rear in these cars. I'm not saying softer front springs on the front compared to rear but less roll resistance on the front compared to rear.

Leda know their onions and could advise you on best springs, having seperate spring and shocker on the rear makes a big difference for poundages. Rally boys almost always have 3-way adjustables as its needed to soak up them rough back road's on compression and not throw you into the scenery on rebound.

Re wishbones- you can only pi** with the c**k you have and would need to do a bit of work on the front setup to get geomatery right, ideally wishbones should be pointing down then your suspension will go - before it levels out and starts to go +

My advice would be never run toe out on the rear!

 

[MG cup]

My advice would be never run toe out on the rear!

But raracecar!!!

it's done all the time.

 

[Tony Hunter]

But raracecar!!!

it's done all the time.

Indeed.

 

[Alex Conway]

Everything I've ever read/been told recommends against it :S. I've heard of quite a few cases that use dynamic toe out on the rear (just a smidge) but never really seen static toe out.

Noted though!

 

[MG cup]

You have to be carefull wether its FWD or RWD for front and back settings. FWD saloon cars quite often have toe out on the rear, look up some Tom chiton footage from the BTCC(thruxton in particular) he was famous for loving the car set up to spin round the front, some high, high speed tail outs from that man.

 

[Alex Conway]

I'm learnt set up on rear wheel drive so that will be it then. I would have thought it would add a lot of unpredictability in the transients and you'd be better off trying to destabilise the rear with other methods.

 

[NorthloopCup]

A bit of toe out on the rear helps with turn in on a Clio. I've run it on mine, but currently running a small amount of toe in. Have to keep it safe for when my wife drives the car on track!

You'll only have big handling issues if you put a lot of toe out on the rear as well. Iirc mine was set to about 10 minutes which equates to roughly about 0.5mm per wheel, so 1mm total. Made for a real fun car to drive.

 

[philevo6]

Sorry for my total lack of knowledge on this but i thought you couldnt adjust the camber on the rear???

Got bilstein shocks and springs on the back...how do you go about doing the camber?...as im getting the front done very soon.

 

[Tony Hunter]

Shims behind the hubs, not a 5min job.

 

[philevo6]

Shims behind the hubs, not a 5min job.

Thanks mate.

We got some adjusters with the new bilstein coilovers for the rear,which adjusts the ride height....do these go at the top or bottom of the spring??

 

[MG cup]

Bottom if they are separate springs to the shock absorber.

 

[philevo6]

Bottom if they are separate springs to the shock absorber.

Thanks very much....learning as i go along.

We are not going to fit rear camber shims....but -2 deg camber on the front and just lower the rear down a bit on the coilovers should be ok for a track/tarmac car?

 

[Alex Conway]

If your aiming for ok I'm sure it will be , you could just play with it and see what your want more or less of.