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Thinking of selling the williams, what are 197's like to live with
Gearboxes definitely a common problem!
if its just the look of the 200 you dont like then fair enough, other than that they are pretty much the same car so you might not like the 197 either!
I had a 197 for a couple of year, i had no real issues with mine, people like to give out horror stories about MPG but 28mpg is easily doable in urban driving. Insurance is pretty good, and the build quality is good too. Overall i was happy with mine and would definitely recommend one!
I had a 197 for a couple of year, i had no real issues with mine, people like to give out horror stories about MPG but 28mpg is easily doable in urban driving. Insurance is pretty good, and the build quality is good too. Overall i was happy with mine and would definitely recommend one!
Love mine, really nice car to get on with. Shame I have to sell it, probably the one car I will miss.
LOL, you would think
Turbo LY R27
Most people throw it into gear with a hammer, mines done 74k and it's supercharged and (touch wood) its mint!! 200 boxes appear worse than 197 boxes. So e guy told me he went through 4 boxes in 46k, he clearly doesn't no Wat the clutch is for lol
Martin_172
ClioSport Club Member
nothing wrong with the boxes if you know how to treat a gearbox!
lol implying that it's the driver at fault - this just isn't true. I've had 5 cars and never had a single gearbox problem. I had my 197 for a 11k miles when the 4th syncro died...it is a definite problem with the boxes. I also know someone who had their's swapped out at 9k miles and then had to have another one 7k later because of the same issue. We aren't just talking about a handful of people that have had problems either, there have been numerous complaints to Renault, all related to syncro failure, the majority being crunching when shifting into 4th.
OP - there are a fair few write ups on this subject just search... but in summary as a weekend car or track car you'd struggle to find something better for the same money. However as a daily runner they're pretty tedious to be honest, Changing gear every 2 seconds, no power low down, poor economy, bits dropping off every few thousand miles. Not literally dropping off but you'll spend a fair bit of money maintaining it and the parts are not cheap. You'll also spend a fair bit of your time carting it to and from the garage. Unless you're mechanically minded of course. If you're willing to accept that then they are awesome to drive.
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gez 172
ClioSport Club Member
Defender 110
Hardly expensive...
17" wheels can still have conti tyres for £100 each.
And that one of the top spec road tyres. You can skimp out and have tyres as little as £50 each if your into that sort of thing.
Disks and pads expensive? £190 for 318mm brembo disks incl pads?
Thats quite cheap.
And the fuel isnt even as bad as people make out
I know a couple of people (3+) who had boxes fail early on from new, and on this forum when the 197's first came out there was a load of talk about how crap the boxes were.
Oh how people forget
Oh how people forget
The 197 suspension consumable bits and pieces to replace are quite dear compared to a 1*2, the mpg is a lot worse, the boxes are more fragile (or more its a case of heavier car and revvier engine puts them under more strain)
197 is a more modern looking car, but a lot dearer to run.
Personally I wouldnt want to swap the 172 for one to do many miles even though I do like them, so I guess it depends what you want to use it for and how far you drive a year etc.
197 is a more modern looking car, but a lot dearer to run.
Personally I wouldnt want to swap the 172 for one to do many miles even though I do like them, so I guess it depends what you want to use it for and how far you drive a year etc.
compare that to equivalent 172/182 costs though
One that sticks out for me is if a lower balljoint goes you need a new arm and these are £221 each. Balljoint on a 182 is under £20
Rob
ClioSport Moderator
Was just about to bring up the balljoints etc.
gez 172
ClioSport Club Member
Defender 110
Fair enough those,
But the parts that need replacing more regularly were mentioned, so I replied to those mentioned.
Apart from that, those ball joints are feckin expensive! Glad I've got warranty, and it'll probably be gone before the time it runs out
This is why I ended up buying new, pay 9K for a newer 197
with no warranty, chances are the box will go so there's 2K for a new one,
Wishbones £500 for the pair, full cambelt £500'ish and + the general wear stuff
That takes you up onto a new 200 money, 4 years warranty and servicing.
Peace of mind, and the general wear stuff is cheap to replace
disks pads etc
But the parts that need replacing more regularly were mentioned, so I replied to those mentioned.
Apart from that, those ball joints are feckin expensive! Glad I've got warranty, and it'll probably be gone before the time it runs out
This is why I ended up buying new, pay 9K for a newer 197
with no warranty, chances are the box will go so there's 2K for a new one,
Wishbones £500 for the pair, full cambelt £500'ish and + the general wear stuff
That takes you up onto a new 200 money, 4 years warranty and servicing.
Peace of mind, and the general wear stuff is cheap to replace
disks pads etc
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MarkCup
ClioSport Club Member
I had the balljoint issue after a day spent pounding the speedbumps (kerbs) at Llandow. Luckily it was last day of my 3yr warranty and I managed to just about squeeze 40% contribution from Renault.
Price before the 'discount' was an eye-watering £900 all in for both sides.
If you get one, make it your mission to avoid kerbs.
i'm pretty surprised at how expensive the parts are on a 197 compared to 182 to be honest, i didnt realise it was so much more to maintain? Are people also saying that the 197 is only as reliable as, or less reliable than a 182? I didnt have any probs with my 197 but then again i got shot of it when it was less than 2 years old so maybe i just didnt experience all these problems people bring up. Maybe i dodged a bullet.
As for the MPG issue though, i cant say the petrol costs in a 197 crippled me or put me off, especially when prices for petrol go up all the time anyway, and the 182 is hardly an economical car if you are looking to chase fuel costs. Also i note that the people who waffle on about how poor the MPG is on a 197, are often the same ones who drive their 182s etc like a bunch of loons and mod the engines; again, hardly the talk of people who are worried about high fuel costs!!! You could save all of that wasted fuel that you'd have lost if you bought a 197 by driving normall in the 182 if it was that important.
Is the fuel consumption on a 197 any worse than a 200?
As for the MPG issue though, i cant say the petrol costs in a 197 crippled me or put me off, especially when prices for petrol go up all the time anyway, and the 182 is hardly an economical car if you are looking to chase fuel costs. Also i note that the people who waffle on about how poor the MPG is on a 197, are often the same ones who drive their 182s etc like a bunch of loons and mod the engines; again, hardly the talk of people who are worried about high fuel costs!!! You could save all of that wasted fuel that you'd have lost if you bought a 197 by driving normall in the 182 if it was that important.
Is the fuel consumption on a 197 any worse than a 200?
my pretty highly modded 172 was showing 41mpg on a trip back from dorset a couple of weeks ago, driving sensibly. A standard 197 will struggle to break 30mpg no matter how you drive it. 25% is a pretty big difference, especially when you consider a megane 225 will do the same mpg as the clio and is heavier and more powerful.
I fancy a 197 as the next project, I'm just seeing too many recently needing a lot of bits all at once, got the second one in a month in with split manifold flexi's which isn't a nice job. I'm not sure on the build quality Vs a 182 really, They're probably very similar but with a much bigger parts bill.
I can see used prices going through the floor when repair bills start hitting people unless the aftermarket releases some quality parts for more sensible prices as hardly anything is available non-genuine yet.
Martin_172
ClioSport Club Member
The problem is the box may not be quite as strong as some other manufacturers which can stand up to ejits that cant drive, the renault box wont last great if you are one of these ejits.
learn to heel and toe and you wont kill boxes, i stand by this statement and have done for years, ive yet to kill a gearbox in well over 100K hard hard miles in Clios and dont know anyone thats destroyed a box in one yet who i know heel and toe on a daily basis and these are all cars that are spanked round tracks regularly!
Getting 40+mpg out of a hot hatch is very good if you ask me
i understand that its not bad, but i dont for one minute think people chose a 172 or 182 for fuel economy, even those looking for a hot hatch. Its merely a convenience that it is relatively good, the 172 and 182 has such a strong following that even if these also did 30mpg like a 197, they would still be popular. I dont recall anyone starting a thread in here saying they are looking to buy a 182/172 because they are economical, or certainly its never a high priority requirement from what i've seen on here, its always "they are great track cars / they are great around the twisties, they handle amazing etc" Having owned a 172 and 182 for a number of years, i am also not entirely convinced the MPG reads true tbh.
It seems that the 197 isnt the well built car i though it was, shame Renault cant produce a car that doesnt fall to bits with faults within 5 years!!
But the again my BMW has had its share of problems, it can happen to most cars to an extent.
It doesnt IME, Ive checked it on 3 seperate cars by taking note of the number of gallons used on the trip computer over several tank fulls (to eliminate errors) versus the number of gallons actually used at the pump and on all 3 it read about 10-15% low on the dash, with the fuel economy figures also out by the same percentage.
Starlet_gt
ClioSport Club Member
VW T5.1
tbh, when I bought my 197, MPG wasn't exactly what I was worried about.... I'd have bought a diesel if I was that bothered.
Megane r26
Well I've not long just got rid of mine an gone back to a 1*2 (trophy to be precise). Well cracking car, alot more refined than the 1*2's but the mpg is crap, most I saw was 35mpg an that was doin 56mph up the m1 which is naff, where I reguarly see 40+mpg in my 182. Don't feel as raw as the 1*2 due to be heavier car I would of thought but they are a awesome handling car as standard an stop on a sixpence. I replaced my standard pads with ds2500 which were awesome but had to replace the brake pins which are 60 quid from renault but luckily I got a set of revised pins off a chap on 197.net. Then the parts costs, well as danny (519) said the lower arm/ balljoint arangement will be dear to replace an seeing as there knocking on they'll be wanting replacing due to wear eventually. But they are a great car, I'd suggest you test drive one an no doubt you will fall in love with it.
gez 172
ClioSport Club Member
Defender 110
Too many tight people on this forum IMO.
I had a 172, now got the 200
Ive only noticed 20-25 miles difference to a tank.
And I can see no issue with that as the 200 is a much nicer place to be.
The right foot needs to be tamed if your getting those 25mpg figures
I had a 172, now got the 200
Ive only noticed 20-25 miles difference to a tank.
And I can see no issue with that as the 200 is a much nicer place to be.
The right foot needs to be tamed if your getting those 25mpg figures
Agreed. You bought a 2ltr hot hatch, and your moaning about petrol. f**k off and buy a prius or diesel if you want economy.
The 200 tank is bigger though isn't it?
