Valvers - Fuckin awesome!!!!! :D

[2 live]

Re: Valvers - f**kin awesome!!!!!

Valvers are awesome cars and that one looks stunning. Grrr you could almost tempt me back to getting another one. Such a cool looking car.

Shame they're a complete tw*t to work on and have a tendency to eat your wallet.

they arent as bad to work on as a lot of people would have you believe. owt for a few extra labour fees huh lol.


compared to a LOT of modern cars they are relatively easy to work on.

 

[northy]

eye - alot of it is knowing how to work on them in the first place.

 

[MarkCup]

I love being on track with them - very hard to get by, needs focus and effort.

Can't wait for FCS - I'm expecting to get properly owned on track by northy's lot.

 

[TheJesus]

Re: Valvers - f**kin awesome!!!!!

It's the weight (or rather lack of it), that makes the difference, not the engine. The F7R is by no means a special engine.

never said it was special, but what people fail to realise is that most 172 engines make less than the 169bhp they should be and at the same time most well looked after F7R's will happily make around 160bhp+... so take the weight into consideration then and that's the reason the Mk1's always ARE (not seem, but ARE) quicker in the real world, both in gear and down the SQM.

It's been proven time and time and time again...

 

[2 live]

Re: Valvers - f**kin awesome!!!!!

I love being on track with them - very hard to get by, needs focus and effort.

Can't wait for FCS - I'm expecting to get properly owned on track by northy's lot.

is there any of em on track??


you doing spa? hehe

 

[Lagerlout]

Re: Valvers - f**kin awesome!!!!!

It's the weight (or rather lack of it), that makes the difference, not the engine. The F7R is by no means a special engine.

never said it was special, but what people fail to realise is that most 172 engines make less than the 169bhp they should be and at the same time most well looked after F7R's will happily make around 160bhp+... so take the weight into consideration then and that's the reason the Mk1's always ARE (not seem, but ARE) quicker in the real world, both in gear and down the SQM.

It's been proven time and time and time again...

You said the F7R was 'better' than the F4R.... I fail to see how. And that's not what Nick Hill said when I asked him about it. Although 2Live probably knows better.

There does seem to be a concentration of fast mk1's in the NW but it would be silly to assume that is the norm up and down the country.

and I'd love to know just exactly how many STANDARD F7R's have been rolling roaded at 160+.... that's a very bold claim, and very close to pub talk, which I have to say is unusual for you. (And that's not sarcasm btw. Which is unusual for me lol)

 

[TheJesus]

Re: Valvers - f**kin awesome!!!!!

never said it was special, but what people fail to realise is that most 172 engines make less than the 169bhp they should be and at the same time most well looked after F7R's will happily make around 160bhp+... so take the weight into consideration then and that's the reason the Mk1's always ARE (not seem, but ARE) quicker in the real world, both in gear and down the SQM.

It's been proven time and time and time again...

You said the F7R was 'better' than the F4R.... I fail to see how. And that's not what Nick Hill said when I asked him about it. Although 2Live probably knows better.

There does seem to be a concentration of fast mk1's in the NW but it would be silly to assume that is the norm up and down the country.

and I'd love to know just exactly how many STANDARD F7R's have been rolling roaded at 160+.... that's a very bold claim, and very close to pub talk, which I have to say is unusual for you. (And that's not sarcasm btw. Which is unusual for me lol)

With all due resect to Nick Hill he's not exactly at the forefront of Clio tuning these days is he? Don't think his website or services offered have ever changed, development and things have moved on, but tune both engines and while the F4 will make more peak power the powerband wont be as usable. Compare my torque and power curve against the white one, I'll have more peak power yeah, but that will make better power overall (well, assuming mapping is spot on). Andy, Ben, Ric Wood have all said the same, the 1/4 mile results say the same.

My Williams had a diesel gearbox that created a flat spot and still made 158bhp absolutely bone stock, on the same day 172's, valvers and Williams were there.

 

[northy]

Re: Valvers - f**kin awesome!!!!!

I love being on track with them - very hard to get by, needs focus and effort.

Can't wait for FCS - I'm expecting to get properly owned on track by northy's lot.

Hope so too Mark - when is cliosports session ??? before wc's or after ?

 

[MarkCup]

Re: Valvers - f**kin awesome!!!!!

No idea.

I'm hoping we're out before you...at least I'll know which way it goes before you do :rasp:

 

[MarkCup]

Williamsclio.co.uk - 1300-1330
Cliosport.net - 1400-1430

Ack.

 

[Lagerlout]

Re: Valvers - f**kin awesome!!!!!

You said the F7R was 'better' than the F4R.... I fail to see how. And that's not what Nick Hill said when I asked him about it. Although 2Live probably knows better.

There does seem to be a concentration of fast mk1's in the NW but it would be silly to assume that is the norm up and down the country.

and I'd love to know just exactly how many STANDARD F7R's have been rolling roaded at 160+.... that's a very bold claim, and very close to pub talk, which I have to say is unusual for you. (And that's not sarcasm btw. Which is unusual for me lol)

With all due resect to Nick Hill he's not exactly at the forefront of Clio tuning these days is he? Don't think his website or services offered have ever changed, development and things have moved on, but tune both engines and while the F4 will make more peak power the powerband wont be as usable. Compare my torque and power curve against the white one, I'll have more peak power yeah, but that will make better power overall (well, assuming mapping is spot on). Andy, Ben, Ric Wood have all said the same, the 1/4 mile results say the same.

My Williams had a diesel gearbox that created a flat spot and still made 158bhp absolutely bone stock, on the same day 172's, valvers and Williams were there.

Not at the forefront these days? Is the F7 a new engine? :rasp:

1/4 mile isn't just about the engine - Although Has a Williams recorded a 14.1 with off the shelf chip decat and filter like Chris's Cup? No.

So because yours made 158bhp stock that means 'most' make 160+? Honestly mate, come on. You know as well as I do that some spotty r****d off here has just read that, taken it as gospel and gone and told all his mates down the pub when there is actually no real proof of it. Although it seems that most make nearer claimed power than 1*2's lol

The CTR engine is way superior to either of the Renault engines... yet they don't get better 1/4 mile times either. 1/4 mile involves more than just the engine - As I said - it's the lack of weight that makes the biggest difference between mk and mk2's imho.

I'm not saying the F7 is a bad engine btw - It can't be - There are certainly some very quick tuned Williams/Hybrids etc about.

 

[CLIOWILLIAMS]

Re: Valvers - f**kin awesome!!!!!

It makes me laugh this thread, because the people who have ACTUALLY owned both, say the mk1 is better, yet the 1*2 owners who havent driven a mk1 or owned 1 think that there 1*2 is quicker than everything on the road and more powerful than a bugatti veyron

Just admit that the mk1 is better value for money, faster and more fun in every way than a 1*2

 

[CLIOWILLIAMS]

Re: Valvers - f**kin awesome!!!!!

Nice one dan. I'll give you a shot of the vee...It pips the willy...but not by much! Love driving them both!

the vee just beats the willy, says it all

what is a vee like against a 1*2?

 

[big hp]

My williams has a exhaust, decat, supersprint manifold and a remap and makes 151 @ wheels. proven on 2 RR's one of them being hillpowers rollers

 

[big hp]

1/4 mile isn't just about the engine - Although Has a Williams recorded a 14.1 with off the shelf chip decat and filter like Chris's Cup? No.
--------------------------------------------------------

Martins old hybrid with above mods done a 13.9 IIRC

 

[TheJesus]

Re: Valvers - f**kin awesome!!!!!

With all due resect to Nick Hill he's not exactly at the forefront of Clio tuning these days is he? Don't think his website or services offered have ever changed, development and things have moved on, but tune both engines and while the F4 will make more peak power the powerband wont be as usable. Compare my torque and power curve against the white one, I'll have more peak power yeah, but that will make better power overall (well, assuming mapping is spot on). Andy, Ben, Ric Wood have all said the same, the 1/4 mile results say the same.

My Williams had a diesel gearbox that created a flat spot and still made 158bhp absolutely bone stock, on the same day 172's, valvers and Williams were there.

Not at the forefront these days? Is the F7 a new engine? :rasp:

1/4 mile isn't just about the engine - Although Has a Williams recorded a 14.1 with off the shelf chip decat and filter like Chris's Cup? No.

So because yours made 158bhp stock that means 'most' make 160+? Honestly mate, come on. You know as well as I do that some spotty r****d off here has just read that, taken it as gospel and gone and told all his mates down the pub when there is actually no real proof of it. Although it seems that most make nearer claimed power than 1*2's lol

The CTR engine is way superior to either of the Renault engines... yet they don't get better 1/4 mile times either. 1/4 mile involves more than just the engine - As I said - it's the lack of weight that makes the biggest difference between mk and mk2's imho.

I'm not saying the F7 is a bad engine btw - It can't be - There are certainly some very quick tuned Williams/Hybrids etc about.

you know what I mean, yeah they are old engines but lets face it, they dont have many tuning goodies compares to Ford and Vauxhall's, tuning Renault's is still in it's relative infancy... the prices prove that, just look at how much a turbo kit costs, you can get a pre turbo'd stronger better engine for less on a ford, vauxhall etc.

Martin ran a 13.8 dude :rasp: Competely stock BE and head, interior levels were about the same as when TimO ran his 13.9 or 14.0 whatever it was.

Mine made 158bhp, others were making more. Not saying ALL make this, but from the Williams I have seen and the hybrids etc that were there, over stock power is certainly the norm, 172/182's running under quoted power also being the norm. If I was asked which to recommend to a friend I'd say the 172 everyday and twice on a Tuesday, but that's based on how reliable my Williams wasn't. Fact is that stock for stock it was faster, handled better (miles better too...), was comfier and imo looked better. They only stay that way with a lot of money thrown at them or just pure luck, but overall they are deffo the quicker car in any circumstance.

CTR engine is miles better yeah, but the power delivery sucks for getting it off the line and added weight doesn't help. Power to weight the Williams and 1*2's are similar with the theoretical edge to the 1*2's, but all that goes out the window when the 1*2 usually loses. CTR's dont hit I-VTEC (yo!) in neutral either, so once you get off the line they lag onto cam from driving my mates (hard!).

Weight is the main difference between the Mk1 and Mk2 aye, but that's why they are nearly always quicker as engine power there is next to no difference.

 

[_Tom]

My F7R with a mani, filter, hp chip and exhaust made 152bhp atw on 3 different RR's. So thats 185bhp+ @ the fly just from breathing mods. Its also ran a 14 sec 1/4...

 

[Ali]

Re: Valvers - f**kin awesome!!!!!

Bloody Mk1 owners!

Look...The williams is not as fast or as quick as the 172/182/cup/trophy end of story!!

Std for std the RS2 will win! FFS

Yes sure if you tinker with them you'll cane a 172, but strip a cup further and tinker with them and your humper.

Whats the fastest willy 1/4 mile - 14.1??
Faster Cup - 13.9??

Yeh thought so.

 

[Ali]

Re: Valvers - f**kin awesome!!!!!

Nice one dan. I'll give you a shot of the vee...It pips the willy...but not by much! Love driving them both!

the vee just beats the willy, says it all

what is a vee like against a 1*2?

I meant from a driving point of view! Vee would destoy the willy! It's Very fast! With a 7700Rpm limit i reckon 165 is possible...autobahn time!

 

[CLIOWILLIAMS]

Re: Valvers - f**kin awesome!!!!!

Bloody Mk1 owners!

Look...The williams is not as fast or as quick as the 172/182/cup/trophy end of story!!

Std for std the RS2 will win! FFS

Yes sure if you tinker with them you'll cane a 172, but strip a cup further and tinker with them and your humper.

Whats the fastest willy 1/4 mile - 14.1??
Faster Cup - 13.9??

Yeh thought so.

nope not 14.1 its 13.8 by martin read above

 

[Ali]

Re: Valvers - f**kin awesome!!!!!

Bloody Mk1 owners!

Look...The williams is not as fast or as quick as the 172/182/cup/trophy end of story!!

Std for std the RS2 will win! FFS

Yes sure if you tinker with them you'll cane a 172, but strip a cup further and tinker with them and your humper.

Whats the fastest willy 1/4 mile - 14.1??
Faster Cup - 13.9??

Yeh thought so.

nope not 14.1 its 13.8 by martin read above

In std trim??? I find that hard to believe!

Martin doesn't do the non modin thing...

 

[Ian_182]

has anyone seen the film dejavu.
I could search and find a thread from 4 years ago i reckon and it would read almost the same as this one.Its so fuckin lame,
OOOh ive got no back seat,yeh but i got 2bhp from my air filter.Yeh but my engine was made in the era of maggy thatcher.blahblahblahblahblahblah

Shut up,all of you

ian

 

[Ali]

Re: Valvers - f**kin awesome!!!!!

has anyone seen the film dejavu.
I could search and find a thread from 4 years ago i reckon and it would read almost the same as this one.Its so f**kin lame,
OOOh ive got no back seat,yeh but i got 2bhp from my air filter.Yeh but my engine was made in the era of maggy thatcher.blahblahblahblahblahblah

Shut up,all of you

ian

Woooosa!!

 

[northy]

Re: Valvers - f**kin awesome!!!!!

Williamsclio.co.uk - 1300-1330
Cliosport.net - 1400-1430

Ack.

unlucky son....no cheating for you lol

 

[northy]

From my experiance 1/4miling - 172's with light breathing mods i can keep up with just beat.

cups - no chance. especially chris and nic's and timo's

Williams needs cams for seeing them off.

My best 1/4mile time is 14.8 - with rear seats out.

 

[TheJesus]

Re: Valvers - f**kin awesome!!!!!

nope not 14.1 its 13.8 by martin read above

In std trim??? I find that hard to believe!

Martin doesn't do the non modin thing...

TimO's wasn't standard either, completely stripped, exhaust, decat, filter, ECU... got a time never to be repeated again.

... and no one cares about your Vee... slow with dangerous handling

 

[Lagerlout]

lol @ slow with dangerous handling. I thought that was my 172. lol

Back on topic, the pictures of Dans vlaver have made me want one. It's undeniably f**king cool. lol.

 

[TheJesus]

lol, 172's are just slower with 'poor' handling

yeah... I want my Williams back but with this engine... lol

 

[donsrno1]

Just to add to the argument, the internals of my engine are standard but with a full exhaust system, induction kit and off the shelf chip it was rolling roaded at 172bhp and 174bhp at two different places. I'm not going to say one is quicker that the other outright, but I would say that a lot of mk1's seem to make a lot more power than the book figure while tbh I've not really heard of any mk2's making more than the book figure. At the end of the day they are both good hot hatch's, and both a williams and 172/182 seem to be pretty similar speed wise but from the opinion of people who have had both a Mk1 is much better/more fun in terms of handling and drivability.

 

[CLIOWILLIAMS]

Re: Valvers - f**kin awesome!!!!!

Just to add to the argument, the internals of my engine are standard but with a full exhaust system, induction kit and off the shelf chip it was rolling roaded at 172bhp and 174bhp at two different places. I'm not going to say one is quicker that the other outright, but I would say that a lot of mk1's seem to make a lot more power than the book figure while tbh I've not really heard of any mk2's making more than the book figure. At the end of the day they are both good hot hatch's, and both a williams and 172/182 seem to be pretty similar speed wise but from the opinion of people who have had both a Mk1 is much better/more fun in terms of handling and drivability.

SPOT ON!!!

 

[JayR]

Re: Valvers - f**kin awesome!!!!!

It makes me laugh this thread, because the people who have ACTUALLY owned both, say the mk1 is better, yet the 1*2 owners who havent driven a mk1 or owned 1 think that there 1*2 is quicker than everything on the road and more powerful than a bugatti veyron

Just admit that the mk1 is better value for money, faster and more fun in every way than a 1*2

Lol.....Iv owned both, Ali's owned both......See the posts we've made in this thread??

Out of intrest have you owned both??

Even Northy, a dedicated mk1 enthusiast for years now has openly stated in this thread that the Willams doesnt 'beat' the RS standard for standard.

 

[TheJesus]

Ali's is a shitter that's done about 100 miles all on the back of a recovery truck and he's comparing it to a 172 with inlet, filter, exhaust, decat, chip and god knows what else.

I've owned both, have a Mk2 now, the missus has a Mk2 and it wouldn't touch the Williams mod for mod... bridge tests are the real world benchmark I use, no skill required, rolling start, foot down and 2 gear changes at most.

And don't listen to Northy, his is slow

 

[JayR]

Lmao....Jesus you are soooooooo f*!?ing biased sometimes, your unreal!!!

I had a 48k 2.0 in my valver, only mods being an ik and full system. Now have a 182 with a BMC and chip and it is MUCH quicker than the hybrid without a doubt especially from 60 onwards.

Had a few comparisons recently with a pals 170bhp civic vti (which are supposedly light) and pulled nicely everytime, i also had a 3rd/4th gear run against a focus st and i wouldnt be lying by saying he wasnt going passed until i slowed and pulled in. I would have no confidence of the hybrid being able to do the same to either car.

 

[Ian_182]

Try reading evo.They tested the willy against the "new"172 years ago and prefered the feel of the willy and crowned it hatch of all time or something.
However in proven tests the 172 mk 2 outhandled it and was faster round bedford and pulled more lateral G in the twisties,it also braked better from 100-0.
The willy they used was a mint one aswell being a show car winner or something....
I think evo got it spot on and said the willy was the better drivers car,even though the cars they tested on the day meant the 172 was quicker.And no they didnt cam it or strip anything out of either car.lol

ian

 

[_Tom]

My valver used to leave my mates VTi! lol No word of a lie!

 

[JayR]

^^^Lol sure it did Tom!!!

But this particular one which is modified supposedly go's past vts's relativly easy but iv read on here a few times now that good vts's are more in the Williams league than one of the valver!!!

Go on tell me im wrong.....You know you want to.

 

[_Tom]

My old valver was modded as was the VTi. I'm not saying your car isnt quick or a valvers quicker just that beating a VTi is nothing special. My old valver only had 156bhp i think it was?!

If it supposedly goes past VTS's it would have enough power to stay with any 1*2.

 

[JayR]

Re: Valvers - f**kin awesome!!!!!

If it supposedly goes past VTS's it would have enough power to stay with any 1*2.

I know first hand it does mate. Owner of the VTS never denied it anyway.

I dunno perhaps its a bad engine eh!?

 

[_Tom]

Re: Valvers - f**kin awesome!!!!!

If it supposedly goes past VTS's it would have enough power to stay with any 1*2.

I know first hand it does mate. Owner of the VTS never denied it anyway.

I dunno perhaps its a bad engine eh!?

Maybe. I'm not trying to argue. I couldnt care if a mk1 or mk2 is faster...lol

Just saying that VTi's arent very quick for big bhp claims and if that flys past VTS's and yours leaves the VTi something seems a bit suspect to me. As you must be able to pull on VTS like its going backwards which i know that 1*2's dont. They are quicker yes but the gap isnt massive and alot would be down to the driver.

 

[JayR]

Tom im not tryna argue either mate but when did go's past relativly easy mean fly past!? Lol

Im not one for blagging im just saying it as it is but my point was the vts is supposedly in a similar league to the Williams rather than Valver......All gone abit off topic now anyway!!!