Clio 172 Cup buying advice

Cl1oman · Monday at 10:10 PM

I realise there may be info on this perhaps tucked away in the Guides section (?). I don't have access to that right now and about to embark on a long journey to take a look at a 172 Cup.

For the car in question, the sill jacking points appear a little out of shape, is this a common issue? Easily rectified / straightened out? Or does it point to something other than poor jacking?

Any useful pointers on what to look out for would be well received. Thanks!

Chocice · Monday at 10:51 PM

It’s Very common, if they are rotten it could need some welding and paint as rust tends to grow like a fungus once it starts, most enthusiast owners tend to look after this area, so I would say as with any car look through the MOT history online and then visually inspect the areas raised by the MOT tester.

photo_ed · Monday at 11:03 PM

Cl1oman said:
I realise there may be info on this perhaps tucked away in the Guides section (?). I don't have access to that right now and about to embark on a long journey to take a look at a 172 Cup.

For the car in question, the sill jacking points appear a little out of shape, is this a common issue? Easily rectified / straightened out? Or does it point to something other than poor jacking?

Any useful pointers on what to look out for would be well received. Thanks!

It's pretty common sadly, usually on the front in my experience, less so on the rears. They can be repaired, is it all 4 which are damaged on the Cup you're viewing?

Cl1oman · Tuesday at 8:55 AM

photo_ed said:
It's pretty common sadly, usually on the front in my experience, less so on the rears. They can be repaired, is it all 4 which are damaged on the Cup you're viewing?

Just the fronts yes. What sort of repair costs might be involved? I realise that could be quite variable, the seller is insistent the sills are solid so hopefully would be straightening out the flattened jack points only

Chocice · Tuesday at 9:00 AM

If they are solid you could ask a garage to bend them into shape if your not confident around cars, if you are a diy kind of person and they are simply bent you can do it yourself with some mole grips and stubby pliers in a couple of minutes.

Matt Cup · Tuesday at 9:03 AM

Easy to fix yourself if they aren’t too badly crushed.

I bent mine back and bolted some 1” box section behind them to give them a bit more strength.

photo_ed · Tuesday at 9:28 AM

Cl1oman said:
Just the fronts yes. What sort of repair costs might be involved? I realise that could be quite variable, the seller is insistent the sills are solid so hopefully would be straightening out the flattened jack points only

Any pics? It sometimes can lead on to further issues if the corrosion has got in. Another hotspot to look at just in case you’re not aware are the rear 3quarter panels, look for bubbling/rusting around the rear arches & inside the filler flap. Can be up to £2k per side to fix this properly depending on what’s found.

Cl1oman · Tuesday at 9:29 AM

Matt Cup said:
Easy to fix yourself if they aren’t too badly crushed.

I bent mine back and bolted some 1” box section behind them to give them a bit more strength.

View attachment 1776045 View attachment 1776046

Thanks guys, I'm commited now, train booked, it could be a long journey for nothing but it sounds generally good with a fresh MOT, no rust noted on any previous MOTs, recent belts and water pump, alternator, tie rod ends, Cup suspension refreshed 6 years ago with less than 4k miles on them and Eibach springs, OE top mounts

cat171 · Tuesday at 9:31 AM

Cl1oman said:
Thanks guys, I'm commited now, train booked, it could be a long journey for nothing but it sounds generally good with a fresh MOT, no rust noted on any previous MOTs, recent belts and water pump, alternator, tie rod ends, Cup suspension refreshed 6 years ago with less than 4k miles on them and Eibach springs, OE top mounts

You should put the reg up on here, that way a previous owner might be on and recognise it

Chocice · Tuesday at 9:35 AM

Cl1oman said:
Thanks guys, I'm commited now, train booked, it could be a long journey for nothing but it sounds generally good with a fresh MOT, no rust noted on any previous MOTs, recent belts and water pump, alternator, tie rod ends, Cup suspension refreshed 6 years ago with less than 4k miles on them and Eibach springs, OE top mounts

Treat the purchase the same as buying any normal car, do a V check, make sure the vin numbers haven't been altered and the usual things you would do if buying a car and you will be fine, ensure you cold start it and hot start it, look for mayo under the oil filler cap, leaks of oil etc etc.

Cl1oman · Tuesday at 9:42 AM

cat171 said:
You should put the reg up on here, that way a previous owner might be on and recognise it

MK03TWC

Any info known on this Cup?

Cheers

Cl1oman · Tuesday at 10:07 AM

Looks a little ugly at the front, I'm told solid all around it. Rear jack point appears more superficial perhaps needing a clean up and rust preventative treatment?

Chocice · Tuesday at 10:30 AM

Don’t panic but it Looks quite rusty to me, the rear beam and exhaust look a bit brown as well, not catastrophic but I would say that’s years of road salt. So under the plastic trim running across the sill might be unsightly and also check behind the plastic arch covers in case road salt has sat there munching away the metal. this was mine as you can see it looked like nothing: https://cliosport.net/threads/what-have-you-done-to-your-car-today.635775/page-241#post-12348850

Cl1oman · Tuesday at 11:02 AM

Chocice said:
Don’t panic but it Looks quite rusty to me, the rear beam and exhaust look a bit brown as well, not catastrophic but I would say that’s years of road salt. So under the plastic trim running across the sill might be unsightly and also check behind the plastic arch covers in case road salt has sat there munching away the metal. this was mine as you can see it looked like nothing: https://cliosport.net/threads/what-have-you-done-to-your-car-today.635775/page-241#post-12348850

Oh dear, starting to feel this is all a bad idea!

I guess that resulted in outer sill section cut out and new sill section welded in place or was there inner sill rust too?

Chocice · Tuesday at 11:16 AM

Yes it was inner, outer, when i took the rear fabric panel of to look in the cavity I started crying. Anyhow I insisted on having it strengthened so it could be used as a jacking point, all my other jacking points just needed to be bent back but what I noticed was they still had paint on them so rust hadn’t attacked yet. All in all the car has been good I did have the rear beam powder coated on a previous 172 and that was fairly cheap but you have to catch it early so give it a good poke about to make sure it’s just surface rust.

MAXRUNDOWN · Tuesday at 11:26 AM

Sills look pretty standard for most MK2 clios, they're definitely going to need doing before long.. can you weld/paint? You can expect £500-1000 a side to sort it out depending on the extent of the rot and the level of repair you're happy with

Cl1oman · Tuesday at 11:26 AM

Chocice said:
Yes it was inner, outer, when i took the rear fabric panel of to look in the cavity I started crying. Anyhow I insisted on having it strengthened so it could be used as a jacking point, all my other jacking points just needed to be bent back but what I noticed was they still had paint on them so rust hadn’t attacked yet. All in all the car has been good I did have the rear beam powder coated on a previous 172 and that was fairly cheap but you have to catch it early so give it a good poke about to make sure it’s just surface rust.

How easy is it remove the plastic sills? I guess some plastic fixings may break on removal so spare likely needed?
And the plastic arch covers - to check behind them means removing some trim?

Chocice · Tuesday at 11:29 AM

As it’s not your car you’ll just have to look and feel through the gaps, the side skirt is held on with rivets unfortunately.

Cl1oman · Tuesday at 11:51 AM

I'm not a welder nor a painter, maybe it's time to learn!

I suppose decision on purchase comes down to everything else and overall condition and of course price. It's done very few miles last 10 years really so maybe longer term exposure to salt that's done it's corrosive nastiness.
So what's is worth I wonder??? Car is on 80k

MAXRUNDOWN said:
Sills look pretty standard for most MK2 clios, they're definitely going to need doing before long.. can you weld/paint? You can expect £500-1000 a side to sort it out depending on the extent of the rot and the level of repair you're happy with

Chocice · Tuesday at 12:12 PM

Without seeing the car it’s hard to say, a rust free example would be around £5k but the mileage on the one you like is below 100,000 so maybe that’s worth more to most people, just as a guide one that needs work with 100k miles+ probably £3k -4k a mint one with over 100k probably £5k-£6k. Low mileage ones always fetch good prices and you see them advertised for £8k+ but that’s with any car really. If you don’t buy this one look on the forums classified section and buy one from a member who is active, I have done this a few times before and the cars were great value and you could read through old posts to see some of the car’s history.

dann2707 · Tuesday at 12:29 PM

For nearly what 20 years old plus I'd say that's pretty good going

J'aime les voitures · Tuesday at 12:34 PM

Is this one a track car?

My Cup has crushed front sills that I will be rectifying asap. I wouldn't be surprised if there's rust creep, but I'm happy I can fix any eventuality.

I've still yet to, but as many people say, you can pull the rear quarter interior panels off and look down into the arches and sills. Obviously I'm aware that's not easy to do before you've bought the car.

MAXRUNDOWN · Tuesday at 12:35 PM

Do you just want a 172 cup, or specifically that one.. spending £5-6k on a really nice one will be significantly quicker, easier and less hassle than buying one that needs work you can't do yourself. If you do buy that one then you need to value it on the worst case scenario of needing £1k a side to put right properly. Therefore it can only be worth £3k max, assuming all else is good and it's had the timing belt done fairly recently.

Cl1oman · Tuesday at 12:49 PM

MAXRUNDOWN said:
Do you just want a 172 cup, or specifically that one.. spending £5-6k on a really nice one will be significantly quicker, easier and less hassle than buying one that needs work you can't do yourself. If you do buy that one then you need to value it on the worst case scenario of needing £1k a side to put right properly. Therefore it can only be worth £3k max, assuming all else is good and it's had the timing belt done fairly recently.

A Cup, FF182, Trophy maybe, any Cup chassis variant is my want really.
I hear you, way less hassle to get a clean one that doesn't need work.
I jumped on this one I think a little prematurely as I missed out of FF182 deliberating too long when someone else got in before me. This one sounded good, looked good then I got the sill photos just this morning by which point I'd committed to the travel.
I may well be taking the train home again. Will see how it all looks and stacks up.

Chocice · Tuesday at 1:01 PM

Just noticed a shiny patch of oil under the car on one of the pics u uploaded, probably the gearbox seal, probably worth checking as well, you could knock some money off. Let us know how u get on good luck.

Cl1oman · Tuesday at 1:42 PM

J'aime les voitures said:
Is this one a track car?

My Cup has crushed front sills that I will be rectifying asap. I wouldn't be surprised if there's rust creep, but I'm happy I can fix any eventuality.

I've still yet to, but as many people say, you can pull the rear quarter interior panels off and look down into the arches and sills. Obviously I'm aware that's not easy to do before you've bought the car.

Not that I'm aware, is there something you've seen that makes you think it may have been?

It has full interior, would there be tell tale signs if it previously had a bolt in cage?

Matt Cup · Tuesday at 1:49 PM

Cl1oman said:
Not that I'm aware, is there something you've seen that makes you think it may have been?

It has full interior, would there be tell tale signs if it previously had a bolt in cage?

Holes in the rear arches. Holes in the floor. Eye bolts for harnesses under the rear seats.

Cl1oman · Tuesday at 3:11 PM

So,... It did previously have a bolt in cage.
One sill / jack pt a bit rough
No visible rust on rear quarters or fuel cap flap
A little mayo under the oil filler cap when cold before starting up...
Pulled to the right quite a lot on lift off throttle...
Went like stink, very involving little machine. I can see the appeal.
Straight thro K Tex exhaust was loud.
After short run but up to temperature, checked filler cap again. More mayo...
He was very sorry, didn't know about it.
Had another Cup on stands getting some work done on it. This one needs plenty too...
Thanks for all the pointers
Train home

cat171 · Tuesday at 3:30 PM

I think you did right to leave it, unless you were after a project car?

How much was it?

Cl1oman · Tuesday at 3:35 PM

cat171 said:
I think you did right to leave it, unless you were after a project car?

How much was it?

4.5k Optimistic given all the work needed
If clean and no rusty sills, squashed jack points, no HG issue and just the tyres it needed maybe closer to the mark perhaps

Cl1oman · Tuesday at 3:40 PM

cat171 said:
I think you did right to leave it, unless you were after a project car?

How much was it?

I said that to him, it felt like a track car that should be that kind of budget rather than trying to present it as a nice road car. I get it they are lightweight and not fancy exec cruisers, they are raw and sure a little work required that ain't cutting out metal, welding in new, repainting etc. is what I'm hoping for unless up front about work needing doing.
Some basic maintenance jobs I'm prepared for, but goes to show even though I asked loads of questions up front it was too few...!

R3k1355 · Tuesday at 3:47 PM

It's tough to say it's a headgasket issue on just abit of mayo, if it's been infrequently run recently I wouldn't expect it to clear immediately.
Sniff test or a coolant pressure test would tell for sure, granted not something you wanna be doing when you go to view.

Generally speaking, they don't blow headgaskets for fun. Someone has to f**k something up to make it pop.

Chocice · Tuesday at 4:06 PM

Sounds like a lemon

cat171 · Tuesday at 4:10 PM

Cl1oman said:
I said that to him, it felt like a track car that should be that kind of budget rather than trying to present it as a nice road car. I get it they are lightweight and not fancy exec cruisers, they are raw and sure a little work required that ain't cutting out metal, welding in new, repainting etc. is what I'm hoping for unless up front about work needing doing.
Some basic maintenance jobs I'm prepared for, but goes to show even though I asked loads of questions up front it was too few...!

Keep looking, but decent ones are fetching good money.

Aside from bodywork / condition of the car, the service history is really important. Mileage not so much as long as it has been regularly serviced etc and the big jobs have been done (if not, they'll need doing, a cambelt on a 172 cup is less than a normal, full fat car so that's good) You can always check MOT history online.

npt · Wednesday at 8:26 AM

Cl1oman said:
I said that to him, it felt like a track car that should be that kind of budget rather than trying to present it as a nice road car. I get it they are lightweight and not fancy exec cruisers, they are raw and sure a little work required that ain't cutting out metal, welding in new, repainting etc. is what I'm hoping for unless up front about work needing doing.
Some basic maintenance jobs I'm prepared for, but goes to show even though I asked loads of questions up front it was too few...!

Where are you in the country, I've a good 172cup in the garage i could potentially sell

Cl1oman · Wednesday at 8:48 AM

npt said:
Where are you in the country, I've a good 172cup in the garage i could potentially sell

Hi, I'm just outside Glasgow. Yesterday was a return journey to Conwy on a train..!

Cl1oman · Wednesday at 9:39 AM

On reflection after a whole days travelling to see a car that transpired to have past life as a track car with a previously fitted bolt in roll cage, that information should be really be shared up front.

It's up to the seller of course how they choose to sell the car but that is attempting to conceal it's past as a track car therefore changes value.

Just shows the potential minefield of buying a car like this. So want a good one now though!

npt · Wednesday at 10:05 AM

Yes he should of told you, also depends on what your looking for, track car, road car, collectors item etc.
Many out there have been used on track in the past and then put back to standard as they sell for more.
You'll need to ask for loads of pictures prior to going to view.
What is it your looking for, track car/daily/ something to tinker with?

npt · Wednesday at 10:06 AM

Cl1oman said:
Hi, I'm just outside Glasgow. Yesterday was a return journey to Conwy on a train..!

Im up in Aberdeen but the car has a cage which might not be to your taste 😂

Cl1oman · Wednesday at 11:40 AM

npt said:
Im up in Aberdeen but the car has a cage which might not be to your taste 😂

Well that's a whole lot closer and I do visit up your way occasionally.

I was looking for a weekend blast car, I guess half cage would still be viable for that. My want is just a good honest car that's straight up is what it is. I know Renault offered upgrade Track pack kit including a half cage specifically for the Cup so I get it many went that direction.

Happy to find out more if you want to share photos and further info and idea of price.

Cheers

Clio 172 Cup buying advice

Attachments

Similar threads