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172 Ph1 cooling probs help (long)



  Ph1 172
Hey there,

Posting again :-( Long post.....

Have a weird problem where the coolant comes out of the expansion tank when the car gets really hot (not overheated, just say maintaining 100mph+ (runway) or sat in traffic for ages). I don't understand why it is doing it when it isn't getting hot enough to boil.

One thing - when I got a new expansion cap from renault it was white with a kind of brown centre bit. Looking at engine bay pics on here, everyone has a black one. Is the white one rated to a lower pressure? Also, if I pop the bonnet after driving for a while it is making a hissing noise, only very quietly.

Also, the system somehow gets air in it. So I bled it properly as stated in the guide, and it is fine for a few weeks, then I get the thing where the thermostat isn't opening because there is too much air by the thermostat. I open the cap when it is hot (i.e. when I notice the temp gauge is too high) and it gurgles and bubbles, loads of air goes up the top pipe to the expansion tank, the coolant goes down to replace the air and then it is fine again for weeks.

I have also noticed I have the tiniest coolant leak (only seen coolant there once) down by the bottom right (from front of car) of the radiator. I wonder whether this is letting the coolant out slowly, and then sucking air back in when the car cools down? Still doesn't explain why it gets forced out the expansion tank - it is that which most worries me.

Thanks in advance for your help! And for reading such a long post! I have springs, brake discs and pads and a throttle body sat in the corner of the living room waiting for me to fit! Do I need to add a load of other stuff to the pile???
 
  Ph1 172
Did it again for my gf, she was not impressed when I told her to open the expansion tank.

Spoke to renault and they reckon it is the head gasket. I'm not so sure having no mayonnaise, and no other issues. Although it will be if i can't stop it overheating. Does anyone have any other ideas?

Thanks
 
  172 Race Car
thermostat sticking closed?

the cap is superseeded so the white one is correct. thats what i was given at Renault
 
  PH1 172 Sport
Yeah I highly doubt its the head gasket. I would edge bets at the radiator or one of the pipes having a hole in it. let us know how it goes.
 
  Sunflower & Golf Mk6 BMT
Head gasket would be a last resort!

Do what your doing and replace other parts of the cooling system

-fix leak
-new thermo stat
-bleed system
-new radiator
-new coolant pipes
- water pump?
 
  Ph1 172
Still doing it!

More info:

It is definitely only from cold first start up.

It is definitely the thermostat not opening.

And it is almost certainly because air is collecting in the top rad pipe and behind the thermostat causing it not to respond quick enough, so I'm getting temperature overshoot.

After the thermostat has opened once it will not do it again until the car has cooled completely.

Turning the engine off after the temp light has come on and leaving (presumably) the thermostat to heat soak for 30seconds to a minute sorts it out, I can then start it and the temperature shoots down to normal/below normal again. It is then fine to drive as far as you like.

I have changed so far:
Rad
Expansion tank cap twice
Rad top and bottom hose
Thermostat (on 3rd one now!)
Coolant, twice

Bled several times following this:
Open bleed screw till coolant and no air comes out, shut.
Run engine at 2.5k rpm for 4 minutes maintaining level in exp tank
Run for a further 25 minutes@2.5k RPM top up and put cap on.

So during this time, the expansion tank fizzes and bubbles. Eventually(~20 minutes?) liquid stopped coming out the top hose into the tank, which I didn't understand.

I don't understand how air collects in the top rad pipe when surely it should go up into the expansion tank through the top expansion tank pipe as it is lighter than water!!!

Please please help! I'm completely stumped with this one!

Thanks
Ed


Head gasket would be a last resort!

Do what your doing and replace other parts of the cooling system

-fix leak
-new thermo stat
-bleed system
-new radiator
-new coolant pipes
- water pump?
 
  BMW M135i
Something strange is happening when your bleeding the system for sure, mine didn't fizz and bubble and had a constant stream of coolant coming up the return from the thermostat housing. The only major thing it did was the level drop like fvck when the thermostat opened and that happened very drastically had to be quick to fill it up over the level of the bottom pipe before it drew any air in.
 

mgoode180566

ClioSport Club Member
  172 Sunflower
i think you may find that the thermo stat opens at pressure as well as temp. if you are losing pressure from the system then this couls stop it from opening.

is it possible to do a leak down test ? i think this should detect a head gasket problem. any leaks from around the pump ? is the pump noisy ?
 
  Ph1 172
Yeah, so just had the thermostat off again and the top rad hose and the thermostat were bone dry - no coolant came out when I undid the three bolts to the thermo housing. This is despite putting in over 5 litres of coolant (5.5ish?) at the weekend when I did the rad.

Bled it again when back together and this time the top expansion tank hose kept flowing the whole time. However there was definite frothing like loads of tiny bubbles whilst it was running. This subsided after 10 minutes or so and I had assumed it was part of the degassing process.

If this doesn't fix it I'll take it to the garage friday for a compression and coolant system pressure check - presumably that could unequivocably diagnose head gasket failure? In my case, if it is head gasket failure it a combustion chamber linked to the coolant system. There is no mayo in the oil.

Thanks for your help! I'm going to cry if it is the hg, I just replaced the one on my gf's corsa.
 


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