All this 172/cup/182 bickering

[matt the cat]

i just thought Id cough up my opinion on all the 182/172/cup arguments

At the end of the day they are 3 very similar cars. maybe ones got a spare missing, or ones got twin exhausts, or another is 15mm lower.

But these slight differences can only be effective in a head to head if all conditions are the same. There are so many variables that can affect cars that are so closley matched. The 172 may be driven by a small guy/ girl weighing 20KG less than some guy in a 182 or some meatball in a cup. Fuel - someone could have more in than another - weight advantage then gone blah blah

I guess the point I am trying to make is that people should not be taken in by mag stats and marketing blurb and pay loads for the latest model for that reason or argue about wether their 182 is faster 0-60 than a cup. I mean a willy 3 on paper is slower than all three but on the road theres hardly anything in it!!

Enjoy your cars peeps!

 

[JillyB]

Exactly, its the colour of your car that matters!

If your cars not black then its sh*t

 

[172mgw]

agree totaly, but also re its so sad post, lets not get into another my cars better than yours, and im going to get u(for sl*gging off my car) type thing please!

 

[Lee]

What bickering, it stopped weeks ago?

 

[tunni]

Quote: Originally posted by JillyB on 29 March 2004


Exactly, its the colour of your car that matters!

If your cars not black then its sh*t

lmao

 

[TheCake]

Quote: Originally posted by JillyB on 29 March 2004


Exactly, its the colour of your car that matters!

If your cars not black then its sh*t

Looked at a Black Evo 7 yesterday..... I agree anything else just look sh*t.

 

[.:xTreme:.]

As far as Im concerned its banter and nothing more, Im happy driving my Cup and I would be happy driving a 172. In April im going to be driving a 182 and guess what........ im going to be happy driving that.

The banter between the Cup/172/182 is absaloutely essential to the forum as it gives rise to hundreds of funny threads. Its great that the Williams drivers put there 2p worth in claiming that they are still the Kings of the Clios. There are also people who are driving 1.2s that are scalping some bigger cars on the roads in Driving Tales, I mean; thats entertainment!!

We have to keep up the inner rivalry amongst us, as long as it stays healthy banter it can only help the Forum.

Lets put it this way, 182 is now the King of the Hatches. Im sure there are Cup and 172 owners itching to meet one at Santa Pod and you will. But for now be content with second place, Williams owners are nowhere to be seen anymore imaging how those poor sods feel......(The last paragraph was an example of friendly banter....nothing more , so chill )

.:xTreme:.

 

[172mgw]

but my cars not black! gonna sulk now,so there!

 

[Rich-D]

Quote: Originally posted by .:xTreme:. on 29 March 2004


Lets put it this way, 182 is now the King of the Hatches. Im sure there are Cup and 172 owners itching to meet one at Santa Pod and you will.

The Cup will still be quickest over the 1/4 mile IMO...

 

[Rich-D]

Quote: Originally posted by .:xTreme:. on 29 March 2004


As far as Im concerned its banter and nothing more, Im happy driving my Cup and I would be happy driving a 172. In April im going to be driving a 182 and guess what........ im going to be happy driving that.

The banter between the Cup/172/182 is absaloutely essential to the forum as it gives rise to hundreds of funny threads. Its great that the Williams drivers put there 2p worth in claiming that they are still the Kings of the Clios. There are also people who are driving 1.2s that are scalping some bigger cars on the roads in Driving Tales, I mean; thats entertainment!!

We have to keep up the inner rivalry amongst us, as long as it stays healthy banter it can only help the Forum.

Lets put it this way, 182 is now the King of the Hatches. Im sure there are Cup and 172 owners itching to meet one at Santa Pod and you will. But for now be content with second place, Williams owners are nowhere to be seen anymore imaging how those poor sods feel......(The last paragraph was an example of friendly banter....nothing more , so chill )

.:xTreme:.

 

[matt the cat]

Yeah, I understand the banter element, its just that its a bit samey plus a lot of the time people are really clinging on to 0.2 of a sec etc when as I highlighted in the real world these figures are nonsensical when you consider all factors

But yeah, i take your point.

And another thing...Black cars are crap!!

 

[TB11]

We know that Rich is going for the new Megane turbo ;o)

Your other option is to go out in my car and then decide?

Tony (far too hung over yesterday to go out to play ( )

 

[Rich-D]

Quote: Originally posted by TB11 on 29 March 2004


We know that Rich is going for the new Megane turbo ;o)

Your other option is to go out in my car and then decide?

Tony (far too hung over yesterday to go out to play ( )

LOL

I will be getting a drive in a Megane RS very soon actually...

Aint buying one though!

 

[Brazo]

To be honest all 3 are exactly the same cars (i.e a 172) with differnt pwr to weight ratios. Bearing in mind the pwr to weight ratios are so close the main differntiating factor partic between cup/182 is tyre choice - imho!

 

[Dave H]

Mines the best......a Cup

And its the best colour.

Sorted.Respect due!!!

 

[clio182]

but with out all the 172/cup/182 which one is best etc etc.

there would only be a few other topics on the board.

black is best by the way

he he

 

[Jon1978]

Quote: Originally posted by matt the cat on 29 March 2004


mag stats and marketing blurb and pay loads for the latest model for that reason or argue about wether their 182 is faster 0-60 than a cup.

As I have said a million times before, I love my Cup, regardless. I couldnt give a toss if your 182 or whatever is faster. As "matt the cat" says - enjoy your cars. But there is always time for a bit of banter.

However, on the point above, can I refer you all to page 44 of the latest Renault magazine:

"it was hard to imagine how the bigger Megane could match the lissome, sassy Clio on the track. Could its eager acceleration (0-60mph in 6.5 secs - 0.6 secs quicker than the Clio 182) prove advantageous....?"

 

[.:xTreme:.]

Im afraid this is something you are going to have to get used to. The 182 is a superior car to the Cup, its quicker and has better handling due to the uprated suspension, now take ya silly yellow letters to another forum where they are still unfamiliar with the facts

182 AutoCar 0-60 = 6.3

Cup AutoCar 0-60 = 6.5

If the 182 is lighter than the 172 with an extra 10 bhp and better suspension and god know what else, it aint going to be the same speed from 0-60 now is it.... Renault has the 182 at the same as the 172 yet you are unwilling to query that....I wonder why....

Its faster and its better........ get the feck over it people............

 

[.:xTreme:.]

Oh and by the way

The car in front.....thats a 182 !!!!

 

[visceral]

Tell u sommat folks, all these 10ths of a second mean fook all on the open road.

we went out in the peaks, with 172s Cups, a 182, valvers and 4 williams.

and too be totally honest u couldnt really tell any difference, within a small percentage they were all pretty well matched!

 

[Chins]

If you want bickering, go to Scoobynet. With more version of Imprezas than people in China it can be non stop.

The lastest crap Spec C vs WR1 ie Major Dereciation vs Great Limited Edition. Talk about people worrying about 0.2sec to 60.

Jonathan

 

[S2 PTH]

my dad just saw all these posts and said: "haha their all sad, comparing their clios...they wanna race some real cars! (ie- me!)" he was quick to forget that he bought mine for me recently and he thought it was the best little car at that time for the money!

-phil-

 

[.:xTreme:.]

lol ofcoarse they where.......

With all due respect... 90% of people who buy there Clio will not go an race anyone anyway, I couldnt give a sh!t if someones car is faster than mine.

If I want to thrash a car about on a circuit I will go banger racing. I would not take my car to a circuit and thrash the bollox out of it, ruin a perfectly good set of tyres to drive home knowing that my car was faster than yours.

They are so similar in performance its pathetic to think that 0.2 0.7 or even a whole yes a whole second would make that much difference on the open road.

 

[Ben H]

Agree as above ^^^^^

My Williams is hardly any quicker in daily driving than my 16V was, which in turn was the same pace as a Ph1 172 that is local to me. I cant be arsed with quotes and claims of 0-60, 0-100 etc. Its so close that its stupid to call any of these cars clearly better than the other. Yes, the 182 is the most modern, the Williams the most iconic and the 16V the street sleepers choice - but as for better? Nah, cant call that one.

Most of it comes down to image, how much youre willing to spend, how raw you want your hot hatch etc. People are understandably protective over their choices (especially when its nearly bankrupting them), but theres a natural tendency to justify your selection of car anyway.

If this was a conversation about a Mk4 Golf GTi and a Renault hot hatch then Id have some crushing argument why one was better than the other, but in this situation its really a waste of words!!

All Ill say its that Im glad that theres a clear and pure bloodline from the GT Turbo onwards - unlike the Peugeot and VW hot hatches, which have dulled over time.

 

[Brazo]

Quote: Originally posted by .:xTreme:. on 29 March 2004


Im afraid this is something you are going to have to get used to. The 182 is a superior car to the Cup, its quicker and has better handling due to the uprated suspension, now take ya silly yellow letters to another forum where they are still unfamiliar with the facts

182 AutoCar 0-60 = 6.3

Cup AutoCar 0-60 = 6.5

If the 182 is lighter than the 172 with an extra 10 bhp and better suspension and god know what else, it aint going to be the same speed from 0-60 now is it.... Renault has the 182 at the same as the 172 yet you are unwilling to query that....I wonder why....

Its faster and its better........ get the feck over it people............

172 cup and 182 are exactly the same cars but with the cup having a slightly better power to weight ratio, it is therefore impossible for 182 to be faster!



As stated before the 182 in the test had grippier tyres on the front!

 

[dk]

Brazo - so why cant it be faster then, its not impossible, if it gets off the line quicker and gets to 60 quicker because of better traction, then its bloody quicker! And it didnt have special tyres, its just the STANDARD Michelins are a better tyre for the car!

Why cant some of you cup owners get over the fact that the 182 can actually be the same speed as your supercar! Get over it....

 

[Brazo]

Dave 182 the fact is they are all exactly the same cars with differing power to weight ratios, if the std michelins are better then what 0-60 will the car with the highest power to weight ratio achieve?

 

[dk]

what, the 172 cup has a 1 bhp per tonne advantage, thats nothing, as we have seen in F1 in the past few years, a tyre can win a race and I dont think anyone will dispute that the Michelin Exalto 2s are better than the contis!

 

[Brazo]

Totally agree with you Dave, I dont really want to get into a big row as no car could smoke each other, but if you had two cars exactly the same, same shape same tyres and but with differing power to weight ratios............ then I need go no further!

Perhaps be getting some Exalto 2s then

 

[Klang1.6]

its funny how pepole with 182s only quote AutoCar for there 6.3 secs they never said a thing untill it was published, i dont see them quoting the renault figures. Yes its a nice car, yes its fast but.....this 6.3 secs is getting thrown around alot. Im sure (and its not because im a cup owner) the cup could get 6.3 and i,m sure the 172 could get a lower 0-60 on a good launch and the other factors involved.



<-----waits to have stuff bombarded in my direction smile!

 

[Neil82]

Quote: Originally posted by dave182 on 29 March 2004


Brazo - so why cant it be faster then, its not impossible, if it gets off the line quicker and gets to 60 quicker because of better traction, then its bloody quicker! And it didnt have special tyres, its just the STANDARD Michelins are a better tyre for the car!

Why cant some of you cup owners get over the fact that the 182 can actually be the same speed as your supercar! Get over it....






Ive said it b4, just because a someone got 6.3 to 60 doesnt mean every could achieve that.

Going by the Evo figures 6.3 to 60 and 17.0 to 100 vs 6.5 to 60 and 16.9 to 100. Do the math and 10.7 60-100 vs 10.4 for Cup I know what increment id rather be faster in.

 

[dk]

the reason we use the autocar time is because they are one of the few to actually test the car properly and as a matter of fact, the figure that all CUP owners quote is also the Autocar figure of 6.5 as I think the Renault time was 6.9! And we never said a thing before it was published because no-one had tested it and were using Renaults figures (except Evo who were the first and they clocked it at 6.6!)

Im not trying to say the 182 is faster, I am saying they are on a par with each other now but it just seems that some cup owners are finding it hard to come to terms with the fact!

 

[Neil82]

I am not finding it hard to accept as I know what my Cup would do to a standard 182, but please dont think a standard Cup with the right launch/conditions/driver couldnt do 6.3 also.....

 

[Brazo]

Leave you to it guys.... early start and ive gotta walk the dog!

 

[Rich-D]

Quote: Originally posted by .:xTreme:. on 29 March 2004


Im afraid this is something you are going to have to get used to. The 182 is a superior car to the Cup, its quicker and has better handling due to the uprated suspension,

Thing is though that in reality the 182 is NOT any faster than a Cup...

Sure its 0.2secs faster 0-60, but 0.1secs slower 0-100 and only in the case of the 2 individual cars that Autocar tested, with those drivers and those conditions, not every car in every case!

In the real world line a Cup and a 182 up next to each other and there will be f*ck all to seperate them on the road and its all down to the driver!



Now I am selling my Cup and most likely getting a 182, but I am not getting it because its any quicker or handles amazingly better, as this just aint the case.

I like the idea of what I have now but with all the extras, and thats all the 182 is... a Cup with toys!

 

[Klang1.6]

182 owners cant live with the fact ither, Also Evo quoted 6.5 for the cup so thats at least two I care to remember. AutoCar is one !

Define Properly.

As a base point and if we was to use the Renault figures the cup is clocked faster and i would have this view even if i had a fiesta!

 

[dk]

Quote: Originally posted by Neil82cup on 29 March 2004

Quote: Originally posted by dave182 on 29 March 2004


Brazo - so why cant it be faster then, its not impossible, if it gets off the line quicker and gets to 60 quicker because of better traction, then its bloody quicker! And it didnt have special tyres, its just the STANDARD Michelins are a better tyre for the car!

Why cant some of you cup owners get over the fact that the 182 can actually be the same speed as your supercar! Get over it....






Ive said it b4, just because a someone got 6.3 to 60 doesnt mean every could achieve that.

Going by the Evo figures 6.3 to 60 and 17.0 to 100 vs 6.5 to 60 and 16.9 to 100. Do the math and 10.7 60-100 vs 10.4 for Cup I know what increment id rather be faster in.

well mate, to me it seems those figures are really too close to call, we are talking tenths of seconds and as you keep saying that is purley going to be down to driver, unfortunately, when quoting performance figures we can not take into account the ability of the driver, therefore we have to quote the figures by a professional and if both cars wers tested by a professional, especially by the same magazine then the figures are relevant.

You cup guys seriously do have a complex!

Theres a new boy in town (and hell be cooler come summer!)

This banter will never stop, in 12+ months we will be talking about whats going to take over the 182 and be better, if I like it better then I will buy it, not dwell on the fact that my car has been improved and is now better for new buyers, its called evolution.

 

[Rich-D]

Quote: Originally posted by dave182 on 29 March 2004


Why cant some of you cup owners get over the fact that the 182 can actually be the same speed as your supercar! Get over it....

Deja vu

 

[dk]

Quote: Originally posted by Klang1.6 on 29 March 2004


182 owners cant live with the fact ither, Also Evo quoted 6.5 for the cup so thats at least two I care to remember. AutoCar is one !

Define Properly.

As a base point and if we was to use the Renault figures the cup is clocked faster and i would have this view even if i had a fiesta!






cant live with what fact, my car is as fast as yours but with more luxury, in what way am i losing out here????

and we shouldnt use renaults figures as they are the same as for the 172 and we are not arguing the fact that the 182 is quicker than the 172 and it has a higher power to weight ratio, better handling and better tyres!

and by properly i mean not just quoting the manufacturers figures!

 

[Neil82]

Can I quote a figure 0-98 in 14.1.