WRX
Thanks, been up half the night. Ideas going through the skull.
ClioSport.net
Register a free account today to become a member!
Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!
-
When you purchase through links on our site, we may earn an affiliate commission. Read more here.
182cup & 172 racecar
Plenty more about.
182cup & 172 racecar
Yes and yes.
WRX
How will the engine power be restricted ?
Will there be a minimium weight ?
Will there be a restriction on how many tyres for the season ?
Can you buff tyres ?
What restrictions on the gearbox and gear shift ?
If minimium weight can shell be dipped and ballast to weight ?
If standard suspension will there be a restriction on the quantity you can purchase ?
What wheel restrictions will there be ?
Steve
Will there be a minimium weight ?
Will there be a restriction on how many tyres for the season ?
Can you buff tyres ?
What restrictions on the gearbox and gear shift ?
If minimium weight can shell be dipped and ballast to weight ?
If standard suspension will there be a restriction on the quantity you can purchase ?
What wheel restrictions will there be ?
Steve
Rob
ClioSport Moderator
Here comes the winning with pounds crew. Boooya.
Sir_Dave
ClioSport Trader
I like this thread, purely because it reminds me that 99% of people have absolutely no idea on how much it costs to go racing.
Buying/prepping the car is the cheap bit (even if you spend £15k, as you will get most of that back when you sell), its the ongoing costs that get you. This series is a brilliant idea for those that dont have the initial capital for a full-on race car build, but the actual raceday costs probably wont be that much lower than Tony's.
The latter is unfortunately the reason why as much as i love to do it, i probably wont be, cant afford to just chuck the money away lol.
Buying/prepping the car is the cheap bit (even if you spend £15k, as you will get most of that back when you sell), its the ongoing costs that get you. This series is a brilliant idea for those that dont have the initial capital for a full-on race car build, but the actual raceday costs probably wont be that much lower than Tony's.
The latter is unfortunately the reason why as much as i love to do it, i probably wont be, cant afford to just chuck the money away lol.
Bluebeard
ClioSport Moderator
Whichever has fuel
Wtf?!
That is what happens when people want to win and they have the budget.
In one of the other tin top series you will find ex-touring car drivers driving a couple of year old touring cars without the sequential gearbox, but with all the trick suspensions and brakes etc.
the best way to restrict power is with an air restrictor and have a minimium weight.
Steve
Bluebeard
ClioSport Moderator
Whichever has fuel
If you 'have the budget' then why not race in a better series, with tony ash and Ian instead of polluting the pool of people that just want cheap racing?
Bluebeard
ClioSport Moderator
Whichever has fuel
I've just read that back and it comes across as rude/aggressive. It's not meant that way at all.
WRX
But there's not a great deal to gain in standard parts and ECU Steve.
That's why we're trying to keep it as standard as possible. So you can probably answer most of your questions in a negative way and be close to what we're trying here.The idea is to keep the cars as close to standard and just give them the bare essential mods that we consider necessary. The more options you have, the greater the budget has to be. Which in turn will reduce the amount of entrants.
We want the maximum cars out there, not necessarily the fastest. So surely giving more options will be detrimental to the idea. If you suddenly make it so that we need another 4k on the budget then you've probably lost us all. The series is just supposed to be a competitive track day kind of thing for a bit of competitive fun. At 40, I've missed the boat for F1 now.
That's why we're trying to keep it as standard as possible. So you can probably answer most of your questions in a negative way and be close to what we're trying here.The idea is to keep the cars as close to standard and just give them the bare essential mods that we consider necessary. The more options you have, the greater the budget has to be. Which in turn will reduce the amount of entrants.
We want the maximum cars out there, not necessarily the fastest. So surely giving more options will be detrimental to the idea. If you suddenly make it so that we need another 4k on the budget then you've probably lost us all. The series is just supposed to be a competitive track day kind of thing for a bit of competitive fun. At 40, I've missed the boat for F1 now.
Bluebeard
ClioSport Moderator
Whichever has fuel
Exactly! I'd rather have 10 standard cars in a race than 3 fast ones. The more people out there, the more fun we'll all have.
WRX
edited for my outlook.
Some people just like punching hard in a category below their weight.
Bit like the integra in tintops, why doesnt he go and do something more serious instead? Answer : he does but still likes popping into tintops and wiping the floor with everyone in his big budget race car which leaves it unfair for others.
You would be AMAZED at what goes on in "cheap series" I suspect Daniel, some of the stuff I know of people doing in other similar classes is mental.
IF this series takes off, I can guarentee in a few years time someone will start throwing big bucks at their car.
Adam, steve is WELL aware of the INTENTION of the rules, he is just trying to use his considerable experience of how people prep cars in other similar series to enable some clarity of the letter of the rules.
If the rules dont ban dipping shells, or there is no way to check it hasnt happened, then at some point it will, thats racing for you!
Sir_Dave
ClioSport Trader
Thats because people like to win, racing is fun, but not if you are constantly floating around at the bottom of the grid.
Hence people will cheat, as i said to Nick & Ollie the other day, i look forwards to hearing about you fitting secret cams & a mappable standard ecu with various maps/power limits to your car, Josh Cook boffing a sadev into a standard gearbox casing and Sam Mowle revalving his standard dampers with Nitron components.
Yes it will start off as a 'cheap' series, but people will find ways to improve their cars over others ...
If people want to go that mad then let them, same goes for people wanting to do a full suspension/gearbox/engine refresh after every event. The jokes on them...
Lol, those are all the sort of mods that I had already been thinking "people will do this" about.
There there is the more basic stuff like for example you are only allowed camber bolts to adjust camber, but I guarentee you that whatever camber people want, there are plenty of other ways of getting it that I can think of
It will end up costing 20K+ to build a competitive car for this series in a few years time if it really takes off!
When you race in a one make championship any advantage is worth while, that is £4k blueprinted engines come from, with dipped lightweight bodyshells, £3k carbon fibre seats, £2.5k T45 cages etc.
The problem in policing the car specification.
Steve
after every event? Ive heard of other series where people swap between engine bits like cylinder head between qualifying and racing to make sure they have perfect valve seal for both, lol.
But agreed, I'd still happily go out in a genuinely standard car and enjoy competing with others in the middle of the pack that I felt were fair competition for me, you just have to accept that everyone will think you are rubbish if you are the one not cheating and be prepared to live with that, lol.
172 Race Car
I got my enjoyment from pushing myself to get the best out of what we had, minimising mistakes and occasional door handle to door handle racing. If someone 'thinks' they need to beat everyone and dissapear into the distance by having a car thats costing them three times as much as the rest of the grid to 'optimise' just to win a cheap plastic pot then thats up to them. I'd find that very boring if it was me.
Bluebeard
ClioSport Moderator
Whichever has fuel
And at that point I will be off. As soon as people start cheating, I will no doubt end up in the back of a police car again once I've smashed their teeth out then I'll go and find somewhere else to race.
People cheating/spending £15k on a car for this series sounds like a 15 year old going to junior school to be the toughest in his class. Because deep down he knows he's a pussy and can't compete with the big boys in the class above.
f**k me, it hasn't even started yet and I'm getting fucked off with people already.
banther
ClioSport Club Member
God you would think sportsmanship is dead reading this thread.
I certainly wouldnt feel right racing with my "friends" knowing I'm cheating. Where's the fun?
There's no prize - money just pride at stake. But surely coming 1st on the podium knowing youve raced against regs makes it a hollow victory?
Maybe some people dont have scruples. Its a great idea. Good luck Tony and Daniel.
I certainly wouldnt feel right racing with my "friends" knowing I'm cheating. Where's the fun?
There's no prize - money just pride at stake. But surely coming 1st on the podium knowing youve raced against regs makes it a hollow victory?
Maybe some people dont have scruples. Its a great idea. Good luck Tony and Daniel.
Sir_Dave
ClioSport Trader
Unfortunately Daniel, wherever there is competition, there is cheating. Thats how it works.
Those that win the most, are quite often not the best competitors, but the best cheats lol.
Those that win the most, are quite often not the best competitors, but the best cheats lol.
Indeed, but if they are quicker and still within the rules but have just spent a lot of money on their car all within those rules, then what happens then?
Change the rules to now ban the car that the person built in good faith and alienate them from the series
Accept that everyone else is now going to also have to dip their shell or whatever, if they want to compete
Not just cheating too, but spending within the rules.
For example, if you ban any lightening of the conrods for balancing purposes, people will just end up buying 5 engines to strip instead of 1, weigh all the rods, and pick the best matched ones, which is then perfectly within the rules but will put people who havent done so at a disadvantage.
What's with the running theme of punching people out/brawling in the car park?
I think Daniel is just an angry little man who got bullied at school, lol.
Its only him talking punch ups so far.
I must confess that I do think racing is better with fisticuffs in the carpark and some real hatred than with all this nice friendly nonsense tony and james do etc, far more likely to be interesting for the spectators if the entrants hate each other!
