BIGASH/FF-Racing X85 Clio Cup Racer Project

[Cup_Phil]

I just want to say - you're a VERY bad influence on me

I've been out this week and bought a Passat TDi 4 motion as a tow car - and tomorrow I start stripping the Clio
Bilsteins are getting sold, 2118's sold for lighter alloys, windows are getting binned for plexi, stereo and speakers getting binned, standard loom getting binned. Gonna be a bloody busy winter!!

Impressed how much you've got done in such a short time!!!

 

[Tony Hunter]

Mm, not a lot of thought put into that one then.

 

[BIGASH]

I just want to say - you're a VERY bad influence on me

I've been out this week and bought a Passat TDi 4 motion as a tow car - and tomorrow I start stripping the Clio
Bilsteins are getting sold, 2118's sold for lighter alloys, windows are getting binned for plexi, stereo and speakers getting binned, standard loom getting binned. Gonna be a bloody busy winter!!

Impressed how much you've got done in such a short time!!!

Haha sorry Phil but you'll thank me in the long run

Sounds like a good plan to me! What are you going to do for the wiring loom then?

Thanks I have only spent a couple of evenings on it I'm looking forward to getting the welding done and then I can crack on with my stuff!

Mm, not a lot of thought put into that one then.

No just like fitting the battery so it can't be changed without removing the engine lol

 

[chrispy.clio]

Does anyone one know which pins on the fuel pump are + and - as there are 4 and I don't want to put 12v through the sensor for obvious reasons

I need to drain the tank as it's nearly full and need to then drop the tank before rolling the car to work on the underside

Thanks

Theres only 3 wires, When i did it to mind i just tryed connecting the wires until the fuel pump ran! Really simple!


I'm no expert but that wiring looks a mess!


What are you wanting from your wiring looms? Mine is really really simple! but i don't use the orginal key or ecu at all. I have no locks etc! Just fuel, ecu, starter motor = engine runing!


And then just indicators, brake lights, side lights/rain light! Nice and simple!

 

[BIGASH]

Mmm that is odd Chris my one has four! Thanks I have just worked it out by tracing the wires back from the old loom Will try and empty it tomorrow

Yeah just a tad, It was spec'd as the minimum amount of wires required and was told it would be fine to use in Britcar etc! Very kindly they must of been thinking of me getting bored in the car on a 4 hour stint and kindly left all the sound system wiring in so I could of still had some tunes lol! This along with the courtesy switch wires for when you open the doors, the side impact sensors including leaving one of them in the car and still plugged in! Just a shame the airbags weren't in lol

It starts to get a little more complex with the CAN on the ECU I think and along with the data logger! Yes I am just going to have one button to start it and going to have an extra few things in that I didn't this time like a feed for pit to car radio (Mark has been a bad influence on me) so that will need a button.

 

[Chip-mk1]

Well at least you know pretty much categorically it was a loose bolt if you found one complete one and one sheared in half where it took all the load after the other one rattled out.

Amazed we didn't hear it all happening, but helmets on and lots of exhaust noise obv was even louder.


great progress with the strip down, I can see you ending up very handy with a set of spanners soon!

 

[Jonny1*2]

You're not still using the oem UCH ate you mate? Simplify things and just use the ec1

 

[chrispy.clio]

Oh yeah of course you have all the other fancy dash's and loggers in your car! Mines poverty spec! No dash, No loggers lol.

Maybe next year!

Well good luck with it over the winter! You've got off to a good start with the strip down!

 

[BIGASH]

Well at least you know pretty much categorically it was a loose bolt if you found one complete one and one sheared in half where it took all the load after the other one rattled out.

Amazed we didn't hear it all happening, but helmets on and lots of exhaust noise obv was even louder.


great progress with the strip down, I can see you ending up very handy with a set of spanners soon!

Yes mate I agree with you, looking at the windage tray (or whatever they are called)

I don't think we would of stood a chance with all the noise lol

Thanks Chip its been a bit infuriating like nearly 2 hours to remove the race transponder but getting there Haha thank you very much that was my reason for wanting to do the rebuild myself so hope it works at the end of it all lol!

You're not still using the oem UCH ate you mate? Simplify things and just use the ec1

It did still use the UCH yes mate, didn't use the standard ECU though, Oh yeah it will all be going in the bin and starting from scratch

Oh yeah of course you have all the other fancy dash's and loggers in your car! Mines poverty spec! No dash, No loggers lol.

Maybe next year!

Well good luck with it over the winter! You've got off to a good start with the strip down!

No dash haha your nuts lol! To be fair I only ever look at mine for lap times and coolant temps

Thank you very much Chris

 

[dmallett]

Such a shame that this car always looked so good and cost you a serious amount of money but in reality needs so much work to get it to a good reliable standard.

Keep at it James, all this will be worth it!

 

[BIGASH]

Such a shame that this car always looked so good and cost you a serious amount of money but in reality needs so much work to get it to a good reliable standard.

Keep at it James, all this will be worth it!

Yes Dan its a massive shame and I'm gutted about it Will of done everything twice by the time the car next gets used! Just some really daft things that wouldn't have taken any more time or cost more to do properly!

Hopefully it should be good out of the box next year just got to hope I don't have to resort to putting a standard engine back in.

Thanks mate I will do

 

[chrispy.clio]

Engine wise, why don't you just get a standard engine + ARP bolts and just pop your throttle bodies on.

Simple engine and relativly cheap!

 

[BIGASH]

Yes that is an option but it's just if I'm going to do that then I would want to check all is okay and then new cam belt and the cost will start to add up. Don't really want the engine going mid season so want to try and build a reliable engine but will have to see how funds are in the new year

 

[BIGASH]

Managed to get the tank drained After numerous sparks and electric shocks I decided it was only a matter of time before a spark caught some petrol vapours and blew my house up so cut the plug of my old loom and practiced my stunning wiring even included a switch!

Got 41 litre's of Nurburgrings finest 102 Octane fuel out that can now be used for my lawn mower

 

[Ryanj]

cant believe the exhaust thing, a lot of what has happened with your car where they have been concerned just seems to be ignorance and laziness but there is no excuse for that, its just mental, i'd kick them in the nuts. on a brighter note, just saw the bonnet on fb and it looks fantastic! the quality of spray shack's work never ceases to amaze me, its not just paint work, its art!

also i Lol'ed at having to remove the engine to change the battery and the cage stopping you from getting to the fuel pump, genuis.

 

[BIGASH]

cant believe the exhaust thing, a lot of what has happened with your car where they have been concerned just seems to be ignorance and laziness but there is no excuse for that, its just mental, i'd kick them in the nuts. on a brighter note, just saw the bonnet on fb and it looks fantastic! the quality of spray shack's work never ceases to amaze me, its not just paint work, its art!

also i Lol'ed at having to remove the engine to change the battery and the cage stopping you from getting to the fuel pump, genuis.

Haha yes I know its so bad its just funny Yes I still think they had great intensions and we did get on very well for a time but the execution was poor and once I learnt what was going on then it had to be nipped in the bud!

Yes I can't wait to see the bonnet it looks great in the photos and yes Sprayshacks work is simply epic!

Haha I know I couldn't believe it, just hilarious and its stuff that even as a novice I wouldn't do lol!

 

[chrispy.clio]

I see what you mean about the engine! Make sense to build something good once instead of doing it ok but twice!

Thats my tyre of Wiring

Good effort!

 

[BIGASH]

Yeah knowing the luck I have had if I just chuck a stock engine in it will blow up as soon as its been mapped lol!

Haha yeah thats the fuel pump part of my new loom done

 

[Tony Hunter]

Don't forget, we got fairly good results, with a knackered old engine the was down on compression on one cylinder, for 2 yrs.

 

[bomber]

That's cus' I was beating you with a spatula


James, you're trying to kill yourself with the fuel, nutter. I ran a length of cable outside the car and plugged it to the battery externally. Am I right in saying the two slightly thicker cables were power, one of those being black and therefore negative? Been a while but I've drained 3 clios this way

 

[JamesS]

The next job was to get the wiring loom out, unfortunately it has obviously been wired up in the car so connections have been made around the cage and it was then impossible to get it out without cutting it. The loom will be re-done for next season as this really isn't what I was expecting from spending in excess of 3k on wiring.

You've exposed a number of items that you would have to actually see to possibly believe, which a "Motorsport" company would try and pass off on a paying customer, but £3k for that wiring takes the biscuit!

How you have managed to remain this calm and composed, having been blatantly ripped off by Tour De Farce is beyond me! To say That wiring loom looks like something which came from Halfords would be doing Halfords a dis-service.

£3k for a Motorsport harness should have given you a decent portion of it being System 25, with proper assembly of harness legs (so twisted and sleeved), connectors booted where possible and minimal wiring exposed.

It starts to get a little more complex with the CAN on the ECU I think and along with the data logger!

No, CAN makes it much, much easier. Two wires with 120 ohm resistors at each end of the CAN bus, and then just splice in anywhere along in between to connect the nodes and Bob's your mother's brother.

 

[Tony Hunter]

That's cus' I was beating you with a spatula


James, you're trying to kill yourself with the fuel, nutter. I ran a length of cable outside the car and plugged it to the battery externally. Am I right in saying the two slightly thicker cables were power, one of those being black and therefore negative? Been a while but I've drained 3 clios this way

I still have bruises.

 

[Jonny1*2]

James your mad doing the tank like that. Was half expecting a 'so.....after a visit to hospital' post. Glad you managed to do it unscathed

 

[BIGASH]

Don't forget, we got fairly good results, with a knackered old engine the was down on compression on one cylinder, for 2 yrs.

Ohh yes Tony the power isn't the issue I just dont want it to be something that could cause issues mid season

James, you're trying to kill yourself with the fuel, nutter. I ran a length of cable outside the car and plugged it to the battery externally. Am I right in saying the two slightly thicker cables were power, one of those being black and therefore negative? Been a while but I've drained 3 clios this way

Yes as soon as I saw the sparks I realised it was going to kill me and my house lol! It felt fairly safe after that with my awesome wiring loom

Yeah the two large ones are the + and - and then the two smaller ones seem to be for the fuel sender

I was draining the fuel from the engine bay if that makes it any better The garage did stink of fuel after so I then realised it wasn't the best idea in a closed garage lol!

You've exposed a number of items that you would have to actually see to possibly believe, which a "Motorsport" company would try and pass off on a paying customer, but £3k for that wiring takes the biscuit!

How you have managed to remain this calm and composed, having been blatantly ripped off by Tour De Farce is beyond me! To say That wiring loom looks like something which came from Halfords would be doing Halfords a dis-service.

£3k for a Motorsport harness should have given you a decent portion of it being System 25, with proper assembly of harness legs (so twisted and sleeved), connectors booted where possible and minimal wiring exposed.



No, CAN makes it much, much easier. Two wires with 120 ohm resistors at each end of the CAN bus, and then just splice in anywhere along in between to connect the nodes and Bob's your mother's brother.

Yes it's a little crazy lol!

PMSL at tour de farce lol! I don't know really, When I found more stuff out the other night I was pacing around my garage for 20 minutes lol

Yeah I have been finding the costs for wiring vary massively now that I have been looking again!

Haha that still means nothing to me but thank you for trying to help

James your mad doing the tank like that. Was half expecting a 'so.....after a visit to hospital' post. Glad you managed to do it unscathed

Haha Luckily not although I will refrain from doing it again in future!

 

[Cupman29]

What was wrong with syphoning the fuel out the tank pikey style?

Sorry to hear about how your car has turned out but just reiterates to me the benefit of doing as much of the work yourself as possible and what you don't know, learn or use people you know.

It will be back a better car now that you are doing it yourself!

 

[Tony Hunter]

You had the Talaban around your house, FFS.

 

[Toastfrenzy]

^Good pick showing the blocked in fuel pump....hahahahahaahahahahaahahahahaahahahahahahahaah - sorry (smiling).

 

[Dan519]

You've exposed a number of items that you would have to actually see to possibly believe, which a "Motorsport" company would try and pass off on a paying customer, but £3k for that wiring takes the biscuit!

How you have managed to remain this calm and composed, having been blatantly ripped off by Tour De Farce is beyond me! To say That wiring loom looks like something which came from Halfords would be doing Halfords a dis-service.

£3k for a Motorsport harness should have given you a decent portion of it being System 25, with proper assembly of harness legs (so twisted and sleeved), connectors booted where possible and minimal wiring exposed.



No, CAN makes it much, much easier. Two wires with 120 ohm resistors at each end of the CAN bus, and then just splice in anywhere along in between to connect the nodes and Bob's your mother's brother.

Listen to this man. Always. He's really quite good with motorsport electronics

 

[BIGASH]

What was wrong with syphoning the fuel out the tank pikey style?

Sorry to hear about how your car has turned out but just reiterates to me the benefit of doing as much of the work yourself as possible and what you don't know, learn or use people you know.

It will be back a better car now that you are doing it yourself!

I don't really know how I would of syphoned it out to be fair!

Ohh yes I fully agree mate The problem was when I started the project I didn't have enough hours in the day so certainly had no time to do work on the car that has changed now so not an issue I also didn't have a clue with how to do anything but after a year of watching how everyone does everything I now have the confidence to give it a try!

You had the Talaban around your house, FFS.

Hahaaaa lol :rasp:

^Good pick showing the blocked in fuel pump....hahahahahaahahahahaahahahahaahahahahahahahaah - sorry (smiling).

Haha tell me about it! I tried last night again, I can do it but would have to hacksaw the pick up in two lol!

 

[BIGASH]

Listen to this man. Always. He's really quite good with motorsport electronics

Yes he does sound like he knows what he's talking about Unfortunately I have no where near 3k again to redo the loom

 

[Dan519]

Yes he does sound like he knows what he's talking about Unfortunately I have no where near 3k again to redo the loom

I think you've misunderstood what he said. It shouldn't cost you anywhere near that

 

[BIGASH]

Sorry yes Dan, I think it depends what spec I want the wiring to be makes the biggest difference on cost

I have had quotes from £400 to £5.5k which is crazy haha

 

[MG cup]

3k for wiring by itself, no ecu's/sensors etc is pure crazy. I haven't made any comment on TDF saga you have had as it can affect a business but after hearing 3k for wiring and other little bits you have posted it's an absolute joke. I can't help but think their "motorsport" achievements have been overrated. I'm just glad I didn't make the journey down to have some work done as that was the plan. I would like to see some words from Matt to try and defend himself/TDF over some issues.

 

[BIGASH]

3k for wiring by itself, no ecu's/sensors etc is pure crazy. I haven't made any comment on TDF saga you have had as it can affect a business but after hearing 3k for wiring and other little bits you have posted it's an absolute joke. I can't help but think their "motorsport" achievements have been overrated. I'm just glad I didn't make the journey down to have some work done as that was the plan. I would like to see some words from Matt to try and defend himself/TDF over some issues.

Sorry maybe electronics would be a better way of me putting it! I think total electronics including dash, ecu, data logger wiring etc was about 4-5k inc vat. Just the actual wiring itself I would have to go and check but I guess when you take off the ECU and other components from the above then it is 3k ish

I spent months not saying anything as I felt my case may just be a one off and I didn't want to affect them as I did used to get on very well with them! Over the months though so many things have emerged many of which still haven't been mentioned on this forum. I confronted Matt about some of these and was told that my expectations and demands were out of line with my budget! Now when you spend the amount of money I have I didn't feel I was expecting too much!

The funny thing for me is I went to them with a spec (Exhaust, suspension, brakes to name just a few) that they felt wasn't ideal, I then followed their route and have now had to do a u-turn and do what I originally planned. I mean what 'pro' motorsport company sends a race car out with road car KW V2 coilovers and brands them as per my invoice 'KW Competition line to TG spec' or leaves the sound system wiring in a loom for a race car

I would welcome Matt to explain things from his point of view but I fear it would end up as an argument as you can imagine I am very unhappy with what has happened and I have heard enough excuses and bulls**t, Cold hard facts are the only way to look at it and the reality is not pretty.

 

[MG cup]

Totally agree with you mate, not saying it is any fault on your part, you pay, you expect, simple. I realise you haven't posted most of the issues but people that have spoke face to face and see the car in person have voiced a poor opinion. I respect you for not going mental about it and holding your views for a while but if it was my car and finding the exhaust and then suspension not as described then that would be enough, someone would have their head to play with ( that's the Scotsman coming out in me) I'm mildly angry just now thinking about it.

 

[BIGASH]

Haha yes trust me there have been times I have been at breaking point lol! All I can say is I have had a very expensive lesson that I have now learnt from

 

[Cup_Phil]

Hahah KW road suspension, spaghetti wiring system, k-tec exhaust faked to look like a race system - it's unbelievable

A lot of people questioned my sanity building my car entirely myself from scratch - but I find it hard to trust garages any more, at least if I fit something myself I know it's been done

 

[BIGASH]

Haha yes cracking car lol!

Yes exactly and when it goes wrong/ something doesn't work out you only have yourself to blame rather than paying someone to do it lol

 

[Chip-mk1]

I dont think there is any chance at all of Matt coming on here to try and defend what he has done with this car, as clearly its just been a case of everytime James turns up they just see a big chequebook walking up the drive and have milked him for every penny they could while not doing anywhere near a good enough job to justify the expense, James has paid for racecar levels of prep but only received the sort of job on a lot of parts that a hobbyist could have done.

Its a shame as I dont doubt Matt's ability or knowledge, he's clearly a clever guy and does have a lot of experience of certain aspects of racecar preperation without a doubt, but clearly whats been paid for on this car just hasnt happened, and thats before you take into account mistakes like the fact it looks VERY VERY likely (ie I would say certain TBH as why else would one bolt be whole still and the other snapped in half) to me that one of the rod bolts wasnt done up tight enough.

Shocking service to be giving what was a very loyal customer who WASNT doing the usual trick of trying to scrimp and save, he was for once a customer actually prepared to pay to get the job done right but despite that he just got given shoddy work and taken for a ridiculous sum of money

 

[JohnnyE]

I dont think there is any chance at all of Matt coming on here to try and defend what he has done with this car, as clearly its just been a case of everytime James turns up they just see a big chequebook walking up the drive and have milked him for every penny they could while not doing anywhere near a good enough job to justify the expense, James has paid for racecar levels of prep but only received the sort of job on a lot of parts that a hobbyist could have done.

Its a shame as I dont doubt Matt's ability or knowledge, he's clearly a clever guy and does have a lot of experience of certain aspects of racecar preperation without a doubt, but clearly whats been paid for on this car just hasnt happened, and thats before you take into account mistakes like the fact it looks VERY VERY likely (ie I would say certain TBH as why else would one bolt be whole still and the other snapped in half) to me that one of the rod bolts wasnt done up tight enough.

Shocking service to be giving what was a very loyal customer who WASNT doing the usual trick of trying to scrimp and save, he was for once a customer actually prepared to pay to get the job done right but despite that he just got given shoddy work and taken for a ridiculous sum of money

Well said bud