Clio 172 - 153 BHP Max on Dyno?

[HelloImSam]

Hi there,

Just wondering what my Clio 172 should be running at, as I had it dyno'd today and it was running at a maximum of 153 BHP. Just wondering if this is normal or what, considering the car is about 12 years old?

To be honest I was expecting around 165 so kind of disappointed with it. Need to get to work on bringing it back up, some how!

Thanks.

Also, the car is completely standard apart from a pipercross performance air filter.

 

[Steven103]

You're probably going to get a hundred suggestions, 95 of them will say check the cam timing.

Apologies if you're already aware, but these engines are extremely sensitive to tiny variations in cam timing hence it's so strongly recommended to have the cambelt changed by a specialist or at a push a main dealer - certainly not your average garage (who almost certainly won't even have the correct £150/£200 locking tools for what is a relatively rare engine).

Other than that, any odd things about the car? Smell rich? Misfire?

 

[MartinR]

At the wheel or fly figure that??

 

[imprezaworks]

At a guess, timing if the belts have been done recent ish. But, it's an old car and that figure depending on the dyno isn't that bad.

 

[HelloImSam]

My Dad did the timing belt for my car. He's done hundreds of timing belts previously so I'm not sure if that's what's causing it.

The car isn't misfiring, and I don't think it smells rich.

Also, not sure if the dyno was slightly off too, as it was a car group we went through with, and the majority of the cars were running quite a bit less HP than what their owners were expecting.

 

[W M Autos]

And there's your answer.

 

[JAMason]

Rollers could be wrong but chances are your dad hasn't timed the car properly. Iv don't loads of cam belts in my time, non as bloody annoying as the Clio and I would never try it on my own with out specialist help. You need to lock the cams into position before taking the belt off, the slightest movement will throw the timing out. The tools to lock the cam aren't something you will just have sitting about in the shed!

Jack

 

[Diagro]

Yup that's the reason.
Unless he has done the clio loads of times then it may be incorrect.

It's why I took it to a garage that has clips in their family for track use.

 

[Steven103]

Were there any other 172s/182s there?

 

[Yellow Dave]

Loads of reasons

172 was ps, not bhp.
Hardly any, if not all cars dont make book power.
Renaults seem to produce when tested slightly more down on power of what is expected compared to other manufacturers.
It's 12 years old and how many miles? It's going to be producing less than it did when run in
At the fly wheel figures are not an exact figure, but based on a rough calculation from at the wheel figure calculated back on transmission losses.
Dynos are calibrated differently, so always vary readings.
The weather and environment can play a difference of readings from day to day.
the timing may be out or in need of a good service etc

 

[not normal dan]

The belts are not exactly rocket science (no different to a zetec se engine in terms of floating pulleys) but it is vital all the correct tooling is used, I've done one today funnily enough.

There is a picture of my tooling, all genuine which is also a must. If all of these haven't been used the correct procedure has more then likely not been followed and the timing will be out.

 

[HelloImSam]

Do you guys mean that it is a tooth out on the timing?

 

[EZ Tutty]

Due to the Floating Cam Pulley's and Crank Pulley, the timing could be off by any number of degree's not whole teeth.

As said before it's vital to use cam pulley locking tools when tightening the pulley bolts/nut or the cams will likely move, or sometimes actually bend the cam locking tool/bust the slot in the end of the cams.

 

[Chip-mk1]

Do you guys mean that it is a tooth out on the timing?

No. When you time it properly you lock the crank and cams in position, let the pulleys freewheel and turn it over to let the belt and tensioner settle then lock it all off in the correct place, it's not a case of a tooth out. It can be out by any number of degrees if the pulley isn't aligned on the cam properly etc.

Your dad probably just tipexed it all up and tried to put it back where it was after. That way nearly always gets it slightly wrong on the new belt.

 

[Dan@SJM]

150 tends to be about the mark they make when the timing is out.

 

[McGherkin]

150 tends to be about the mark they make when the timing is out.

Yup, Aaron's RB was around that figure when his timing was out.

 

[MicKPM]

Also (just for info purposes) it's not as simple as just putting the genuine tooling in, changing the belt, locking it up and removing the tooling. When you do it like that it's probably a 95% chance the cam setting bar will not re-engage without some persuasion.

We've had one in recently that was done by a main dealer and they not only got it wrong but they damaged the cams bending the setting points in the process so timing that up is now impossible without replacing camshafts. Starts fine, idles and drives fine but does run a tad lumpy and rich.

 

[Chip-mk1]

Agreed. Takes a bit of practice to get a feel for how to position it on the bit of play it has so that when you've turned it over and come back it then settles and lets the tool pass in and out with little or no resistance.

 

[davo172]

Wheels or flywheel figure ??