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Renault Laguna Coupe
After the 172 Mk1/Mk2 weight debate, I wouldnt believe anything Renault say about weight until weve put one on a weighbridge!
200
i wouldnt really compare the new STi7 Type UK with the clio cup, yes it "may" have the same power to weight ratio on paper but i doubt if the clio cup can do 100mph in 13 secs
As a recent rolling road day pointed out, STi7 type UK, totally standard (AFAIK) was pushing 280bhp, now with the Prodrive Performance Pack thats due out (very soon, hopefully!) your going to be looking at 300+bhp on these cars
They have this advantage over the clio cup
Better brakes (brembo 4 pots with extremely large calipers! and 330ish mm discs at the front, 305mm discs at the rear which are also 2 pots!)
Proven to out stop a Porsche 996 in tests carried out in germany!
goes round corners somewhat better than most cars due to the excellent suretrac diffs and is somewhat quicker than the 177bhp std uk classic shaped scoob
And hows this you say?!!
Ermmmmm that rather BIG turbo it has under its bonnet
(uk cars have a smaller td04 turbo, the STi7 runs a bigger VF series turbo).
The cup is a nice car and should sell all 400 but its not in the same league as the STi7
Tony
PS, guess what my next car is then?
TB1- even though the scoobys power-to-weight is similar to the Clio Cup, which does even up the playing field a bit, the main advantage it has is 4wd. As proved in my race against an RB5. It was very quick off the line, a bit of tyre squeal then it dug in and went, but once youre rolling thats where power/weight cannot be dismissed.
The size of the brakes is a red herring - a heavy Scooby needs big brakes because it weighs more, not because its supposedly so much faster than a Clio Cup.
Time will tell on the dragstrip and the track, IMHO the Scooby is always gonna be a better all-rounder and track car with blistering pace, but throwing in things like the big turbo and brakes as arguments to make it seem a quicker car.
500bhp is 500bhp however its made whether turbo or normally aspirated. In fact if anything Id rather have a 500bhp NA engine than a big turbo engine, at least I wouldnt have to wait for the power. And since when is the classic UK Scoob 177bhp? Or are you talking about power to weight?
must agree on the brakes, the 172 can manage 100-0 in 3.9 secs..
that is in supercar league..
ps, nick, I am doing some work ona fully programmable ecu/ecm based on the ford eec-IV unit with adapter on the j3 port, if you are interested let me know.
Joe.
ps, the scooby is still an ugly beast... bit like the fat chick at uni that gives out LOL....
Nick,
the 177bhp is power to weight ratio of a 215bhp uk car mine on the other hand (uk turbo with PPP and downpipe) is more along the lines of 210bhp per tonne )
The STi cheats a little over the classic uk car in which it has a 6speed close ratio box (top whack is suppose to be 180mph but restricted to 155mph) and 0-62 in 5.2 secs with 3 gear changes (also has quickshift as std )
As for the brakes yup it does need bigger brakes which have always been an Imprezas achilies heel but when tested from 100-0, it outstopped the new 911 turbo (which was the closest BTW) by over 4 meters! and 911 brakes are pretty damn good
The STi7 also has more torque and less transmisson losses over the old classic shaped scoob, giving it very quick in gear and through gear times
The bigger turbo means more lazy progression but much more power, just because the power to weight says 180bhp it will stomp on something with much less torque in its mid range, ie my scoob outpaced a rather trying MY01 Porsche (300bhp!) due to its better midrange and roughtly the same power to weight
My car with its 210bhp per tonne would still have more than enough difficulty against an STi7 type UK in standard form, and the STI would be quicker above 100 than my car (i know as ive driven an STi7 type UK from my local dealer )
Tony
Good answer TB1, nice to hear some considered opinions.
If I read it right youre basically saying that outright power to weight isnt everything - and youre right. Midrange torque plays a big part which is where the turbo comes into its own I suppose.
I still think the 4wd is the biggest advantage any Scooby has though. I suppose if I was looking at power to weight, theoretically mine puts out 250bhp/ton but its all about controlling the delivery of it, in a 16v thats all at the top of the revs in a band between 5000 and 7000 really. you can tune up a front wheel drive car for power and torque, but laying it down is another matter entirely.
Ill still race you if we ever get to meet though! I really need to compare my Clio to different kinds of Scoobies.
I do try
But having owned lots of french cars (205 pug, 309 gti, 2 306 gti-6s 1 r19 16v 2 other r19s) i wanted a change so went for the scoob
I enjoyed my r19, had her for 4yrs from new, back in 93 thou... steering feel was probably one of the best ive had, the 306 gti-6 is a little lighter but still as responsive thou but didnt like the clunky gearbox or heavy clutch on the r19 16v was a total pain and the 306 was a delight in comparison, damn i only went down to look at one and ended up buying it lol! suppose thats why the sales guy said by the time you get back in, you will want this car.... oooops yup lol!
i was never much of a psycho in any of the other cars as i am with the scoob thou, exiting a roundabout at over 80mph is a bit errrrrrm scary especially when your getting 4wheel drift good fun thou
Tony
Nick, I know it is in a different league but if you get the chance have a go in a Clio Cup Race Car. These things are just awesome and the power delivery is through the front wheels.
I would have to say the best car Ive ever driven. Ive been out in a P1 quite a bit as my m8 has one and this Clio would take it out certainly around the twisties if not in acceleration. By the way they claim it does 0-100 MPH in under 11 seconds and I can well believe it after driving one.
Point Im making is front wheel drive can deliver, the car only has about 180 BHP, but obviously weights nowt and has the six speed sequential box which makes a huge difference.
I want one !!
Renault Laguna Coupe
Agreed the Cup race car was awesome - theyd have to do something about that gearbox if you wanted to use it anywhere but a track though! Question: If you had a Clio Cup Race car, what mods would you do?
