Shiney F4R bottom end bits - FAO Porkie

[Chip-mk1]

Pictures as requested.

The valves and guides and springs are with the head over at Neil's so not got any pics of those for you yet, will get you one when the head comes back.

I think we need to lob all the bits in here somewhere?

Old piston pic:

s**tty standard pistons FTL, could see the air bubbles in the rubbish casting where it broke away, although im sure they would have been fine in an engine where they got an easier life, lol

 

[Will.]

Ohh shiny. Bet that cost a fair Bob.

 

[lewisredfern001]

Pure Awesome

 

[Jonny1*2]

Strange place to break that. Shoddy casting

 

[Chip-mk1]

Ohh shiny. Bet that cost a fair Bob.

Yeah it soon adds up, you end up doing best part of a grand you often over look just in bolts, pumps, belts, gaskets etc which is more than the rods and pistons but not so obvious. Then a set of new guides and valves in head etc add upto more than the cams do.
If you arent use to building engines its easy to come up with a figure thats half what you actually spend as you just think of the big exciting bits not all the boring bits. Then clutch and flywheel and new bolts is best part of yet another grand gone.

Think we're at about 5K or so in total now, havent checked, best not to think about it, lol


Not even like we're spending money trying to build a big power engine particuarly either, the pistons arent particuarly high comp they are only a mild upgrade over standard compression really for example where we could have bought higher comp for exactly the same money which would make bigger numbers but obviously more loads and more wear accordingly, the aim is it just needs to be something that make a little more power than before and hopefully be reliable for the endless abuse it gets, Lee's car does more track miles in a month sometimes than a racecar would in a complete couple of seasons including testing!

 

[Chip-mk1]

Strange place to break that. Shoddy casting

No det marks on the top of it either, but I suspect it saw some det mild det to encourage it on its way as I know that he had an injector go down on that cylinder previously so no doubt it went lean for a bit while it was failing, but I wasnt involved with working on the car at that point so i'm just going by secondhand info from Lee.

Considering the utter kicking it gets, I think it lasted pretty respectably TBH for a standard engine.

Most people who say they trackday their car hard mean they do 4 15 minutes sessions in a day half a dozen times a year, lee's though quite often spend 4 hours acutally on track in a day as he tends to let his mates all use it as a bit of a "pool car" at bedford and its not uncommon for it to do two trackdays in a week either. In fact it probably does more track miles than some people do road miles, LMAO

 

[Michael Woodford MST]

I need a [FONT=&quot]Manicure!!! Look at the state of my nails![/FONT]

 

[Porkie]

SWEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEET. very excited! Am at Bedford this weekend. Will be weird doing a trackday and not having the Clio there as well!

Thanks for pics

 

[Porkie]

what make are the Rods?

 

[Chip-mk1]

SWEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEET. very excited! Am at Bedford this weekend. Will be weird doing a trackday and not having the Clio there as well!

Thanks for pics

Hopefully it won't have to miss too many trackdays before you have it back

Rods and pistons are from engine dynamics, pistons are wossner, rods are their generic ones, the head components are the limiting factor rpm wise on these engines so little point going overboard on the rods. The pistons are very light too which makes the rods life easier.

 

[Cr33do]

Our standard piston failed in exactly the same place

 

[Chip-mk1]

Our standard piston failed in exactly the same place

Someone else just PM'd me to say the same thing too.

Scarey thing really was how well it still appeard to run, bet lots of people are driving around in F4R cars that are a bit down on power and not realise this is why, and obviously its only ever going to get worse, especially if used hard!
I never expected that level of damage when me and Mike ripped it open to see why the comp was down slightly on that cylinder (and it was only very slightly)

Hopefully the new forged pistons will help ensure that this doesnt happen again!

 

[st3ve]

Always like pics like these, I love building engines.

 

[Chip-mk1]

Always like pics like these, I love building engines.

I like building engines when its for someone who understands the need to build them from the right parts.

Can be frustrating when people scrimp on key components that you know will bite them in the arse later on though.

Thankfully although we're only looking for moderate power this is still an example of the former not the latter

I like mapping them when they are finished too, although mapping I do all the time so less interesting in that respect unless its something really different.

 

[Chip-mk1]

Bit more of an update for you Porkie.

This is the terrible accident that happened with your new phase 1 head when it went to Neil Roper, im sure I only asked for new valve guides but it appears to have somehow ended up ported

Steve decided to try and get artistic with the pictures hence the valves and springs in the foreground (well half the springs actually, like I said, think he was being artistic, lol)

Meanwhile me and Mike bolted the engine together, and now thanks to your build my Mrs who normally has fairly cheap tastes wants a 600 quid snap-on dibitial torque wrench for changing her wheels with on trackdays, "because its so cute when it beeps"

Clearances and ring gaps checked and set etc

Finished ARP stud'ed bottom end waiting for the head

all bolted up:

Then it met the gearbox, which me and Les had given a quick once over to tidy up cause it was minging, including getting carried away and cleaning up all the aux brackets, thermostat housing, alternator etc, fitted a few powder coated bits too, not exactly going to win a bling contest, but certainly looking "a bit tidier" as requested:

Sneak preview of it in the bay when I first fired it up so Mike could balance the throttle bodies, sounds lovely idling but dont worry I can f**k that up for you on the idle map if you want it to sound "more racey"

More on that later though as the install isnt quite finished yet, hopefully Stone Automotive will have a coilpack bracket (as per their RS2 kits) for it later on today (he just needs to get some spacers turned up as he is out of stock) in anodised red to match the set of KV85 Magencore leads which should be turning up in the next day or too as well to replace the cheap and nasty autofactor crap that was on there before. Amazed Mike allowed me to choose a bit of colour for it, he was certainly adament I wasnt allowed to "do any of that tacky pointless s**t" with the powder coating colours etc.

 

[Porkie]

ooooooooooof

Love shiny engine build pics! even better when they are your own!

 

[Chip-mk1]

Agreed, nice bits of engineering are awesome.

Your head was getting some very admiring looks for the few hours it was on the bench over at Mikes before it got fitted, Mike went and fetched it and the cams on friday so we could crack on this weekend as planned as the cams didnt arrive till then. Then when he got back friday evening we decided that rather than wait till saturday we'd get started friday evening.
By the time we next looked up at the clock once the engine was finished and bolted up to the box ready to go in it was 6:30am on the saturday morning and by the time I got back to mine and Les's hotel they were already serving breakfast, bit of a bodyclock fuckup that was, I felt like I was jetlagged still when we went snowboarding last night lol!

Mike was still fresh as a Daisy all weekend though, I dont know how the hell he does it TBH!

 

[Michael Woodford MST]

8am Friday morning till 7pm saturday without a break. Very very happy with the result tho. Looks and sounds fantastic

 

[Chip-mk1]

Mike just text me this picture, the leads and coilpack bracket are on

Just got to get a breather setup sorted now and we'll be done in terms of the actual engine build, then just a few bits and pieces like a stud converison and the bearings and brakes to sort at the back, and then its ready for running in and mapping and then you can get on with your hobby of trying to kill it again!

 

[Millerin]

looks sexy. i love this car

 

[Chip-mk1]

She seemed even more interested when I mentioned it vibrates too? lol

 

[Michael Woodford MST]

She can borrow it if I can watch?

 

[Chip-mk1]

ha ha

 

[Porkie]

OOOOOOOOOOOOOH yeah!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Jamesstone]

The previous company's coil pack mount attempt Vs Stone Automotive

 

[Chip-mk1]

Lol, that is quite a difference.

 

[Fred@BTM]

who did that!

 

[MicKPM]

Wall of fail item that.

 

[Chip-mk1]

Would rather not name names, I know nothing about the history of how it all came about to end up like that, it might not have been charged for it might just have been something that they did in a last minute rush to give his coilpack somewhere to sit, and it did fundamentally work even if it looks hideous.
I do know that Lee almost certainly gave them nowhere near enough time to do the job properly and no doubt bugged them continnually to hurry it up for him to take to a trackday as per usual cause he is the most impatient person in the world, LOL

 

[Jamie86]

I like this a lot, makes me want to strip my engine down "just in case" now though!

 

[Chip-mk1]

I like this a lot, makes me want to strip my engine down "just in case" now though!

Lol, I know what you mean, so many F4Rs out there just not quite making the numbers and it could be cause of something like this inside them!

When I took the car off Lee to find out why it wasnt performing for him, I was expecting a few issues with the mapping, and maybe something like the VVT solenoid not working, wasnt expecting to even have to open the engine up!
It was down on power (made 185bhp on bodies on standard engine) and it was drinking fuel a bit more than it should, but nothing hinted that there was a dirty great chunk of piston broken off and no doubt about to make a bid for freedom, lol

 

[Tony Hunter]

Lee, you kept that quite.

 

[.GAZ.]

Well Jel.

 

[Silent_Scone]

looks nice, like the coil bracket

 

[LewisTaylor]

Very nice, really making me want to get my old engine out of my cup built up forged for the ph1.

 

[Chip-mk1]

Lee, you kept that quite.

Some of it he only found out about himself today, lol

 

[Chip-mk1]

looks nice, like the coil bracket

Its the ally one that normally goes in an RS2 kit:

But James got us one made on its own in red to match the leads and tidy it all up a bit.

He really should market them to the throttle body boys

 

[Porkie]

Lee, you kept that quite.

Kept what quiet mate?

I really haven't kept anything quiet!

 

[Porkie]

oh and Mark Fish has had NOTHING to do with any shoddy work EVER on my car before rumours start!

Mans a clio genius

 

[mark smith87]

Neil Roper is one of the top cylinder head engineers in the UK. Any work done by him is always top notch. He's a real nice guy as well. I'd recommend him to anyone wanting a top job done on a head.