willy engine disapointment

[damo16v]

ok my mates just got his valver back after having a williams engine fitted at bb tuning

its a standard willy engine with a decat,induction kit and ss backbox,racing clutch,he doesnt know wot bhp its running as bb dint RR it

i spoke to him today and basically he said it was faster than b4 but not that much hes raced my other mate who owns a nova gsi that had abit of work and is mailto:126bhp@fly">126bhp@fly and couldnt get past him even a car length.

he has a r19 gearbox fitted to it would this make a difference?his lamda sensor is also fudged?exhaust is blowing abit at decat?

overall i dont think hes very impressed with the performance,

and i dont think he was very happy with bbtunings service as they tried to charge him a coupel of hundred £ too much to start with and got all arsey

any ideas,was he just expecting too much?

 

[Matbrown]

I dont know of anybody who has had a Willy engine fitted and not been 100% happy with it, sounds like a duff un.

Sure they fitted the right one?



Mat.

 

[damo16v]

lol

yeah mate he brought a n reg willy engine with 65k on it and fsh with stamped book and that i think hes just disapointed coz he couldnt leave the nova for dust!

maybe he should get the ickle probs sorted the get it RR and see wot difference that makes.

bb RR his old engine at mailto:132bhp@fly">132bhp@fly b4 the swap

i havnt been in it yet but he just said he wasnt that impressed

 

[Matbrown]

Yeah, id get them bits sorted cos they seem to make a lot of difference for some reason.

My Red 16v was well down on power when the exhaust was blowing and it was on a hot day like this too!

Has he got an IK fitted?
If so, ditch it.



Mat.

 

[epic]

how much did it cost?

 

[damo16v]

mat.

hes got a pipercross IK he likes the ROAR!

epic.

he brought the engine and a r19 box and a few other bits all complete for £1000 then i fink all in all with the clutch and stuff he said it cost him £1600

which aint bad with cambelt change/oil change/throttle cable etc

 

[Matbrown]

They make a nice noise with the IK but no good for power especially in this weather!

Mine seems a bit sluggish at the mo, ive got a K&N.



Mat.

 

[damo16v]

ive told him that

ive got a hillpower IK but im not too bothered bout performance.

ill have to post feedback when hes sorted the probs

 

[Matbrown]

Yeah,

And whereabouts are you?

Im organising a RR for the 13th Sept, come and compare it!



Mat.

 

[damo16v]

im in ipswich and so is my mate bout the only 1s round here i think!

 

[BenR]

told ya!

 

[damo16v]

wot?

 

[BenR]

the willy engine aint all that..........

spesh in std form.

 

[Daz]

Weights does 14.7 on the 1/4 mile.. Id say that was pretty damn good!

 

[BenR]

1/4 miling, all about the start, he get s agood start he gets a good time. Plus the torque helps, but singles out, the engine is pap........not that it cant make power.........

 

[Nick Read]

Put the proper airbox back on if hes still got it and that should make a noticeable difference. The longer (AFAIK) 19 box wont do the lump any favours if outright acceleration is what youre after. Try a top speed run and if you are getting a higher indicated speed than before then thats down to the box and the extra power that youve now got. Top speed is being achieved at the expense of acceleration at low speed.

 

[Nick Read]

BTW why not just put a proper WIlliams box on it? Theyre only £600 from Renault. Or even put a shorter 16v box back on.

 

[Daz]

Mat had a 16v Box in his.. Better Acceleration, Less top speed I think!

Id go for 16v really, Dont care about top speed.. just wanna get to it quick! Hehe.

 

[damo16v]

ok ill tell my mate all the suggestions

he put the r19 box on coz his 16v 1 was fuked and the r19 1 was easier/cheaper to get hold of.

thanks for all the help

if anyone else has any ideas they would be welcome

 

[wongy008]

may it was not a willy engine thats been installed??????

 

[jimbo1]

the 19 and clio box have exaclty the same ratios. they both pull the same in gear speeds, only the 19 has a 133mph top wack due to better aerodynamics i guess.

heres the ratios and in-gear speeds for the 16v box;

final drive 4.07:1

1st gear 3.09 = 5.2mph/1000rpm <A target=_blank href= "mailto:36.4mph@7000rpm">36.4mph@7000rpm

2nd gear 1.84 = 8.8mph/1000rpm <A target=_blank href= "mailto:61.6mph@7000rpm">61.6mph@7000rpm

3rd gear 1.32 = 12.2mph/1000rpm <A target=_blank href= "mailto:85.4mph@7000rpm">85.4mph@7000rpm

4th gear 0.97 = 16.7mph/1000rpm <A target=_blank href= "mailto:116.9mph@7000rpm">116.9mph@7000rpm

5th gear 0.80 = 20.3mph/1000rpm <A target=_blank href= "mailto:142.0mph@7000rpm">142.0mph@7000rpm

those speeds r actual gearing speeds, not speedo readings, as normally 3rd gear at 7k rpm reads near to 90mph, etc

if you want blistering acceleration, use a 1.4 energy box. 1st n 2nd gear ratios r shorter, giving better use of the torque on offer. mite shred the tyres tho!

 

[BRUN]

get that I/K off mate, you will be losin a fair amount of power in this weather

also obviously sort the exhaust/lambda/other faults

you cant really say its crap if its not runnin right anywayz..........

firstly, get the air box back on it !!!

 

[cliocup]

Williams box on there soon as-someone said these are 1900 diesel internals. Anyone?

 

[jimbo1]

yeah, ive been investigating this, from what ive read, they jsut used the casings and main shaft or sumthing. its got bigger bearings to handle the increased torque capacity. ive got the specs of the 19 diesel and turbo diesel box, and the ratios r exaclty the same. seems as though the williams uses the diesel ratios too;

final drive ratio 3.563

1st gear 3.727 = 4.8mph/1000rpm mailto:31.2mph@6500rpm">31.2mph@6500rpm

2nd gear 2.048 = 8.8mph/1000rpm mailto:57.2mph@6500rpm">57.2mph@6500rpm

3rd gear 1.321 = 13.7mph/1000rpm mailto:89.05mph@6500rpm">89.05mph@6500rpm

4th gear 0.967 = 18.7mph/1000rpm mailto:121.3mph@6500rpm">121.3mph@6500rpm

5th gear 0.795 = 22.7mph/1000rpm mailto:147.5mph@6500rpm">147.5mph@6500rpm

from what ive sourced these are the sorta in gear speeds the williams achieves, like not being able to make 60mph in 2nd for example.

seems as though if you want quicker acceleration, rather than higher gear speeds, then the 16v box is the one to go for when using the williams lump. il be using the 1.8 16v box, when i finally get my 190bhp williams lump sorted for my 19 16v

jimbo

 

[Ben H]

The only reason that the Willy will not do 60 in 2nd is because it revs lower than the 16V.

The Willy box uses the same gear ratios and overall crownwheel diameter as the 16V one. But the Willys 5th gear is taller, the bearings are higher quality and the secondary shaft is uprated - courtesy, mainly, of 19 TD box parts.

So using the 16V box wont give any acceleration benefits, unless you spend a lot of time driving at the lower reaches of 5th. On the contrary, the Willy box should offer the more accessible advantages of durability - since it was uprated over the 16V box to handle the extra low-down torque.

Remember that the reason the Williams is faster than the 16V out on the roads is because it develops its output at lower revs and for longer than the 16V. The 2.0 F7R engine only has another 10lb/ft and 13bhp, according to factory figures. But it gets 85% of that torque at 2500rpm - a point at which the 16V would make maybe 60% of its torque. So a Willy will pull better out of junctions at low revs; will not need to be kept "on the boil".

 

[Ben P]

Jimbo you got the same stats for the RT box and also the RSi box?

cheers

 

[Alex M]

19 diesel box is a good bet, anybody tried one, even in a 19 16v or clio 16v/willy, they will be stronger, and less likely to be tired, as they are unlikely to get thrashed, unlike a valver box etc

 

[Adams_16v]

dont think they have rev counter output,

 

[jimbo1]

the rev counter output doesnt come from gear box anyway...

jimbo

 

[Adams_16v]

shows how much i know lol. im sure someone said if u use the diesel box it has something missing the willy box has!

 

[CLIO16V_BOY]

I have a willy engine running on a 19 box did all the work myself and i was impressed not 100% as i have transmission problems now but the torque on the bottom end was good novas are buggers though my mate slaughters me, well it is a 2.0 16v turbo with nos but there you go depends how far you wanna take it and how much money you have.