Everything itbs management discussion..

[Krys_23]

Ok so i purchased brand new atspeed itbs last night took a wild idea to just spend a fortune on the 182, which route do i go down for management, fitting, getting the loom? Anyone with an insight would be great thanks.

 

[MicKPM]

The world is really your oyster

Omex, DTA, Emerald, Adaptronic, Gen90... It all depends on your budget and what features you want.

 

[Krys_23]

I knew about management from years ago when i owned a mapped rallye but never owned itbs, ehh all in management and mapping im hoping to spend a grand on top of what i have alrwady payed?

 

[Krys_23]

HERE I HAVE A NEW SET OF RENAULT CLIO 172 SPORT F4R THROTTLE BODIES, 42X100 EXTENTION PIPES ,42X40 RAM PIPES WITH MAGNETTI MORRELLI PF2C TPS SHAFT COMPLETE WITH ITG AIR FILTER "O" RINGS AND SPACERS BRAND NEW .. Description of what ive bought just needing some help on what i will need now

 

[Chip-mk1]

Find someone to map it, ask their preference. It's such a simple application that any fairly modern aftermarket management will run it.

 

[Krys_23]

Doesn't sound as complicated or expensive as I first thought then by the sounds of things?

 

[scotty10]

how much did that cost bud and when mapped what will performance and final cost be of work done

 

[Chip-mk1]

Doesn't sound as complicated or expensive as I first thought then by the sounds of things?

Its pretty straightforward stuff yeah.

Dont forget to factor in converting to a phase 1 pedal by the way, as yours is fly by wire currently if its a 182.

 

[Krys_23]

Think for the kit I bought its £1100 from atspeed website, alright are the ph1 pedals relatively easy to come by? Cheers.

 

[Chip-mk1]

Yes there are always people on here breaking phase 1s.

I doubt you have spent half of what you need to yet in total.

Did you get a filter with it too?

 

[Dan519]

don't for christ sake buy the AT power kit. Horrible

 

[Chip-mk1]

don't for christ sake buy the AT power kit. Horrible

Lol, was thinking the sake, jenveys are SO much better, but bit too late for him now, he's already got it.

TBH it will still work, just all a bit fiddly and cheap feeling.

 

[Krys_23]

Whats with all the hate for these? Ive got the filter bodies tps, etc etc about 75% of the kit, theres a mapper local by luck who maps local sprint cars and hes a dealer for emerald, sounds decent.

 

[mitch1503]

may aswel spent a little bit more than the pries mentioned above and got the k-tec kit with the GEN90 for 2340
ish

 

[Krys_23]

Why pay 2340 when i could get my itbs management and mapping for under 2k though? Starting to have 2nd thoughts about it all now!

 

[welshname]

Why pay 2340 when i could get my itbs management and mapping for under 2k though? Starting to have 2nd thoughts about it all now!

For the same reason people buy Sony TV's over Sanyo. You pay for the quality.

 

[MicKPM]

Just buy yourself a decent 2nd hand Emerald or Omex, DIY the loom and get it mapped.

Edit - Sony TV's aren't what they used to be

 

[Krys_23]

Yeah it was either going to be omex or emerald, if they are really that ill fitting where is the problem? As i could get them tampered with at work to fit better.

 

[welshname]

Just buy yourself a decent 2nd hand Emerald or Omex, DIY the loom and get it mapped.

Edit - Sony TV's aren't what they used to be

I know but I'm sat looking at one now and it's all I could think of

 

[MicKPM]

You need to think about what you want to do with the VVC to as you need to buy an ECU that can run it if you decide to keep it.

 

[Krys_23]

Ahh never took that into consideration at all, whats the normal and sensible thing to do with vvt? I would imagine its better kept..

 

[mitch1503]

because AT bodies are just AT bodies.. k-tec kit is JENVEY... just an all round better quality but either way youll get gains and its your money soo

 

[Krys_23]

Fair enough dude, think ill just punt them on been a little put off with swithing clutch pedals over etc is there much interest in these on cliosport?

 

[mitch1503]

don't think the throttle pedal will actually be 2 difficult tbh with you fella.. disconnect old pedal... ph1 pedal on and feed cable through the bulkhead to the bodies

 

[mr.pink87]

Nothing wrong with AT bodies tbh. Throttle linkage is a bit fiddly and needs to be adjusted precisely. Otherwise the design is pretty good (screw on ram pipes/bolt holes for engine mount/cambelt cover).

 

[Krys_23]

Cheers i appreciate all the feedback

 

[Chip-mk1]

I'd take omex over emerald anyday.

 

[HrRACING]

I don't know how people are coming up with these crazy figures. When we built my rallycross car the inlet cost less than two grand with ecu, jenveys, trumpets, linkage, bigger injectors, manifold air box etc!!

 

[Chip-mk1]

I don't know how people are coming up with these crazy figures. When we built my rallycross car the inlet cost less than two grand with ecu, jenveys, trumpets, linkage, bigger injectors, manifold air box etc!!

Because labour isnt cheap.

If you have the skills to do it yourself its far cheaper.

Its like it costs 1500 quid to have a car painted, but you can do it for less than a 3rd of that no drama if you do it yourself, same for anything in life.

 

[Dan519]

I don't know how people are coming up with these crazy figures. When we built my rallycross car the inlet cost less than two grand with ecu, jenveys, trumpets, linkage, bigger injectors, manifold air box etc!!

is it a full ready to go kit with every nut and bolt included? no

 

[ben_r1]

don't for christ sake buy the AT power kit. Horrible

Justification?

I have two clios fitted with AT power bodies. They both run smooth as standard and produce good power gains and drivability and have been nothing but 100% reliable over many miles ( one of them is a daily commuter ). Even the MPG remains half decent.

IMO they look a better install than Jenveys too, but thats just down to opinion.

 

[Chip-mk1]

Justification?

I have two clios fitted with AT power bodies. They both run smooth as standard and produce good power gains and drivability and have been nothing but 100% reliable over many miles ( one of them is a daily commuter ). Even the MPG remains half decent.

IMO they look a better install than Jenveys too, but thats just down to opinion.

They arent as well made IMHO, they are fiddlier to fit, and the plates seperate themselves and need re-attaching which is a ballache as you have to take them off and send them back etc.

 

[ben_r1]

Well i cant comment on fitting them as obviously i leave that sort of work to professionals, but as for poor build quality? Mine have seen 12,000 miles in the past year and never missed a beat. The idle needed adjusting once about a week after installation but besides that havent seen any maintenance or adjustmesnt. Even that was a very simple DIY case of turning a screw.

Driven other branded ITBs, which i wont quote name as to go against the ClioSport masses would be social suicide on here, but compared to the ATs the throttle seemed much less progressive at low rpm making it difficult to drive smoothly...

 

[Chip-mk1]

Take the air filter off, get someone to hold the throttle at WOT, and check for play in the blades themselves, by now I would expect at least one of them to have started rattling around TBH from what I have seen.

 

[Dan519]

Justification?

I have two clios fitted with AT power bodies. They both run smooth as standard and produce good power gains and drivability and have been nothing but 100% reliable over many miles ( one of them is a daily commuter ). Even the MPG remains half decent.

IMO they look a better install than Jenveys too, but thats just down to opinion.

worst linkages known to man, which get in the way of absolutely every bolt during fitting, making them un-necessarily difficult to use. They're also exceptionally hard to balance, the screws are inaccesible
They're badly thought out, the ports are smaller than the standard port, and the material is very thin, so highly restrict any further port work.
injectors are too close to the head, and the longest available runners are still too short, and too narrow. The butterfly is also only equivalent to a 40mm round one on cross sectional area.

 

[Dan519]

oh and almost impossible to add good brake servo vacuum take-offs without restricting throttle movement. I bet you have a bit of fuel hose lashed on like this....

 

[ben_r1]

worst linkages known to man, which get in the way of absolutely every bolt during fitting, making them un-necessarily difficult to use. They're also exceptionally hard to balance, the screws are inaccesible
They're badly thought out, the ports are smaller than the standard port, and the material is very thin, so highly restrict any further port work.
injectors are too close to the head, and the longest available runners are still too short, and too narrow. The butterfly is also only equivalent to a 40mm round one on cross sectional area.

All of which resulted to 207bhp on the dyno up from pre fitted 178bhp. Most of what you described relates to fitting and setting the kit up, unless the chap in question plans to do the job himself this is why he'll pay good money for a professional to do the work. They'll still work and perform just as good for the customer, anyone who wishes to test their crudentials is more than welcome to a passenger ride, then you can see they are far from 'horrible'.

Just because you dont stock and distribute a product doesnt make it crap...

Anyway theres my 20 pence worth, take it or leave it just an opinion.

 

[Fred@BTM]

I'm with Dan double barrelled on this, Jenvey rule the roost, AT are ok but they don't half sound like an air cooled VW at part throttle!

 

[ben_r1]

I'm with Dan double barrelled on this, Jenvey rule the roost, AT are ok but they don't half sound like an air cooled VW at part throttle!

Good or bad point depending on taste lol

 

[Dan519]

Just because you dont stock and distribute a product doesnt make it crap...

I could if I wanted to though, but I don't, because they are.

I've driven a few and fitted a few, and they always feel flat. You can justify that as "easier to drive smoothly" if you want, but in reality it unresponsive, something which ITB's are meant to improve