2005 RB 182 Cup

[R29TJR]

Nice to see you again Tom!

The car is looking awesome, really drove well too.

Hope it performs well on track!

Thanks. Was good to see you again, although we must stop meeting up when the weather is so good!

Happy days Tom!!

What tyres did you get for the 2118s?

Also, what's the indifference on thoughts regarding the PMS shifter?

I ordered Extreme VR2 S2 I believe @GrahamV182 is running them and from what I've read seems to like them. They should turn up any day.

Regarding the PMS Shifter, its grown on me however when I first got it I wasn't keen. It took ages to set up and get into a perfect position and the adjustments were so small it all seemed a little bit too fussy. In addition to this i had a loud vibration noise coming from the shifter which unfortunately appears to be something I will have to live with. Its not as bad as it was when we first fitted but it still loud. I will upload a video. In addition to this I couldn't initially see any benefit but it has grown on me.

 

[R29TJR]

Track Day - Snetterton 16th August 2017 (Evening)

After around 10 months of ownership it was about time I actually used the car! The week leading up to the track day I tried to resolve a few issues:

• Try to reduce the rattle on the PMS shifter
• Check alignment
• Pack the car!

I spent a good few hours playing around with the PMS shifter and I just cant stop the rattle. Luckily it doesn't make much noise at cruising speeds. Below is a video to show what I'm dealing with, any idea's/tips on how to reduce would be great:



However the position and feel of the PMS has grown on me and I must say I am now totally sold, although reverse is still a bit of a pain, it does look cool!

In my quest to resolve the rattle I popped over to Mark Fish Motorsport on Tuesday which turned into him checking the alignment, so a quick hour or so I was back on the road again:

He made slight adjustment to the Clio but there is definitely some adjustment require now that I've actually driven it on track.

The track day was booked for Wednesday evening and on Tuesday evening I drove to Waterlooville (basically Portsmouth) from Essex, around 2 hours each way to collect a set of 15" Team Dynamics Pro Race 1.2's in Gloss Black. It was a set of 5 wheels with Toyo R888r tyres (205/50/15) with the 5th wheel & tyre being brand new while the remaining 4 are virtually brand new also.

I'm pleased as punch with them and it also means I can now sell my Cup Turini's, there is certainly no need for 3 sets of wheels!

I eventually got home around 10pm, I was planning on packing the car however I called it a night. I was up bright and early on Wednesday, as I had to pop into work until midday, so first thing I go all my items together, its amazing what you can fit into the back of a caged Clio (4 wheels, 200 piece halford tool kit, two helmets and an array of fluids etc):

So around 8 (M3, caterham, 135, Fiesta, MR2, Morgan, Civic) of us left Essex around 2pm to get to Snetterton in plenty of time and I quickly went about fitting the TD's however the slightly wider 205 tyres rub badly compared the the 195's on my 2118's. I did the sighting lap with them on (forgot to take a pic) but they were quickly removed again. I therefore need to review suspension/arch liners/brackets to see what is catching as even the 195 are rubbing. I did read online about moving the bumper brackets but I'll look into this next weekend.

The drive down:

Noise testing:

The car was recorded at 98dB which is louder than I expected, however it passed fine.

I don't actually have any pics of my on track yet however I do have some GoPro footage from inside the car and I have a few pics I've ordered online. Overall it was a great first time on track in the Clio. I have a lot to learn about how the car drives and it made me notice how the car currently under-steers (as called by @Scrooge) , I really struggled to get the back end out even if lifting off mid-bend.

It was a great evening and fantastic value for money. The Clio didn't miss a beat all evening and I was on track for a long time. The only casualty was the exhaust hanger finally gave up and therefore I melted the exhaust surround, so I'm after a new pair of these also!

I'll upload the professional pics and GoPro footage hopefully later this week all things being well.

More updates shortly...

 

[Inequality Street]

@a17vts I have 2 brand new exhaust hangers if you're interested?

Glad all went okay!

 

[JKING3008]

Good write up Tom, I have the powerflex black exhaust hangers on mine but you would probably be better with the red ones.
I was surprised when the noise test came back as 99db for me, Its normally about 89db for me!

Have you got a video of me going past on the Bentley Straight?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[R29TJR]

@a17vts I have 2 brand new exhaust hangers if you're interested?

Glad all went okay!

Interested, I'll drop you a PM.

Good write up Tom, I have the powerflex black exhaust hangers on mine but you would probably be better with the red ones.
I was surprised when the noise test came back as 99db for me, Its normally about 89db for me!

Have you got a video of me going past on the Bentley Straight? :tongueout:


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I was massively surprised at my noise test results. Next time I'll just hold it a little lower!

Agreed, I think black will just rip a hole in my exhaust!

I'll be honest I think the time you overtook me I didn't have the GoPro mounted. I'll check tonight for sure.

 

[R29TJR]

Here is a video of me from Snetterton from last week, you can hear both the rubbing and gearstick rattle:



Any suggestions on how to prevent the rubbing would be great and I'm aware the GoPro setting aren't the best but I'm still learning...

 

[Scrooge]

Glad the track day went well, an anti roll bar and maybe damping settings could definitely work in its favour handling wise.

 

[mintno1]

Track Day - Snetterton 16th August 2017 (Evening)

After around 10 months of ownership it was about time I actually used the car! The week leading up to the track day I tried to resolve a few issues:

• Try to reduce the rattle on the PMS shifter
• Check alignment
• Pack the car!

I spent a good few hours playing around with the PMS shifter and I just cant stop the rattle. Luckily it doesn't make much noise at cruising speeds. Below is a video to show what I'm dealing with, any idea's/tips on how to reduce would be great:

My PMS rattles like that, like you say not all the time but still... I read somewhere, not sure it was on here that someone had put sand in the linkage between the bottom of the shifter and the gearbox and that made a difference. PMS also sell a weight that is supposed to help, although have heard varying reports that it still does it but just at a different RPM rather than getting rid of it. Out of interest how much did Mark Fish charge for checking the alignment? Need mine doing ideally and looking for somewhere to take it! Glad the track day went well :up:

 

[R29TJR]

Purchases/Service

After Snetterton a few things became apparent that I require:

1. Sunstrip. At certain points it was impossible to see where I was going.
2. New exhaust mounts.
3. Rear anti roll bar.

Sunstrip
Firstly I set about looking for a Sunstrip, initially I wanted a satin black one however they were hard to come by therefore I settled for a matte black item. I was a massive fan of 90's BTCC and remember the two part sunstrips, like so:

I plan to replicate this so I've ordered 15% tint film (although unsure if this will be too dark) and a large matte black sunstrip. I have a friend who is a pro at this sort of stuff so hopefully it'll come out as good as I hope. If it looks terrible its only cost me £15 plus a bit of time so not the end of the world.

Exhaust mounts
After the issues at Snetterton I was in dire need of new exhaust mounts. After a bit of research I decided to order the Powerflex (red) exhaust mounts and a standard middle mount. The Powerflex items weren't cheap at £20.00 per side but hopefully they'll get the exhaust in the right place and hold it there.

Rear Anti Roll Bar
After a bit of research I've read that a rear anti roll bar may help with the understeer so I'm ordering one of these tonight. I'm going to order the Whiteline ARB from KAM racing. While I'm at it I also plan to order new front anti roll bar bushes as I noticed these have started to wear.

I'm hoping once I've got this fitting I'll pop back to Mark Fish and get the set up however I'll want to resolve the rubbing issue prior to this.

When ordering all these bits I thought I may as well order a few a few items for a quick service so I have also ordered the following:

• Genuine Clio Oil Filter & washer
• 5l Fuchs Titan Supersyn 5W-40 Engine Oil (I already have a spare 2l from last time)
• 5l Type D Engine Coolant
• Brand new expansion bottle (thus the need for some new Coolant) I feel this was really letting down the ending bay

I've only done around 3,000 miles in my ownership and the oil change and coolant change aren't really required however I doubt I'll do much much before October and I believe the oil should be changed at least every year. It'll also be a good time to check how the oil stood up after the track day.

All things being well I should hopefully have some updates this weekend.

Finally a quick couple of pics from Snetterton the other night:

 

[Jekyll]

Can't you remove the windscreen rubbers and water the screen, slide the tint on, squeeze the water and and let it dry and then add the sunstrip on top slightly higher with the same process?

That way you can get a clean cut on the sides and the rubber will seal them.

 

[Djw John]

I took mine to a local tinting place who took £20 for an internal one fitted, well well worth it for the faff of fitting one. He cut it on the outside then fitted it after removing the mirror. Like the idea though

 

[R29TJR]

Can't you remove the windscreen rubbers and water the screen, slide the tint on, squeeze the water and and let it dry and then add the sunstrip on top slightly higher with the same process?

That way you can get a clean cut on the sides and the rubber will seal them.

I believe that's the process we're going to follow. The guy who will be helping me can wrap cars etc so this will be a piece of piss for him......hopefully!

 

[Jekyll]

It'll be a walk in the park for him Tom!

 

[R29TJR]

I took mine to a local tinting place who took £20 for an internal one fitted, well well worth it for the faff of fitting one. He cut it on the outside then fitted it after removing the mirror. Like the idea though

I'll be honest I always thought they would charge a lot more than that.

 

[Djw John]

So did I. But after wasting 14 hours (it felt like) fitting one to @DJW Daves and then not being able to see through it I decided to call them. Didn't hesitate to book it in. He uses old offcuts from his other tinting jobs so winners all round.

 

[R29TJR]

So did I. But after wasting 14 hours (it felt like) fitting one to @DJW Daves and then not being able to see through it I decided to call them. Didn't hesitate to book it in. He uses old offcuts from his other tinting jobs so winners all round.

It being too dark.not dark enough etc has been my main worry.

I may mock it up tonight too see how it looks from the inside and if I'm not happy get a professional to do the tinting part and then I can worry about the sunstrip after. Plus getting them to do it will also also us to check various different levels of darkness prior to fitting.

 

[Djw John]

Yeah I ended up going one lighter than I expected to after trying them all.

 

[NorthloopCup]

What geometry settings have you got mate? Also to reduce understeer, try trail braking. It'll bring the back end into play more too.

 

[R29TJR]

What geometry settings have you got mate? Also to reduce understeer, try trail braking. It'll bring the back end into play more too.

This is the current set up although I think the toe has been slightly adjusted since but nothing major:

I'm aware its a relatively standard set up but any pointers would be great.

Thanks for the tip regarding trial breaking, its not something I usually do TBH however I did try it for the first time the other night after a suggestion from a friend. It did seem to help but the understeer remained although not so prominent.

 

[JKING3008]

Front set-up looks okay to me,
Maybe a bit less toe-in on the rear? Others may suggest otherwise.


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[NorthloopCup]

This is the current set up although I think the toe has been slightly adjusted since but nothing major:

View attachment 1331136

I'm aware its a relatively standard set up but any pointers would be great.

Thanks for the tip regarding trial breaking, its not something I usually do TBH however I did try it for the first time the other night after a suggestion from a friend. It did seem to help but the understeer remained although not so prominent.

Ok we have a starting point! Right next question is what suspension setup do you have? Springs and dampers, or coilovers? If it's the latter, do you know what the spring rates are? Are they adjustable?

With that info I can give you a pretty good starting point for where to go mate.

 

[R29TJR]

Ok we have a starting point! Right next question is what suspension setup do you have? Springs and dampers, or coilovers? If it's the latter, do you know what the spring rates are? Are they adjustable?

With that info I can give you a pretty good starting point for where to go mate.

Thanks for the help in advance.

Setup is as follows:

• GAZ GHA's (Front 350, Rear 250) adjustable (I don't actually know the full amount of adjustment but the rears are 8 down from full hard while the front are about 3/4 from fully hard)

Camber is adjustable at front while the rear is standard (no shims etc)

I hope that helps. Sorry I'm jo expert so any help would be great.

 

[NorthloopCup]

Thanks for the help in advance.

Setup is as follows:

• GAZ GHA's (Front 350, Rear 250) adjustable (I don't actually know the full amount of adjustment but the rears are 8 down from full hard while the front are about 3/4 from fully hard)

Camber is adjustable at front while the rear is standard (no shims etc)

I hope that helps. Sorry I'm jo expert so any help would be great.

Well the spring rates ain't the stiffest, but we can work with it!

For a start, go full stiff on the rear dampers and about half way on the fronts. Take it out on track and see how you get on, but be aware that the rear end will now be significantly livelier than before. Too stiff? Drop it off 1 click at a time. Fronts are the same, so either up or down depending on what it's doing.
Camber could do with being about 2 degrees up front tbh.
Toe out on the fronts is fine. Don't go beyond 15mins toe out though as you'll start to kick f**k out the tyres.
I'd be tempted to leave the rear end geo until you've got a better feel with the car mate.

Getting a setup to suit you will take time, but that listed above will give you a good starting point.
Going stiff (easy!!) on the rear end is what the clio chassis loves.

 

[R29TJR]

Well the spring rates ain't the stiffest, but we can work with it!

For a start, go full stiff on the rear dampers and about half way on the fronts. Take it out on track and see how you get on, but be aware that the rear end will now be significantly livelier than before. Too stiff? Drop it off 1 click at a time. Fronts are the same, so either up or down depending on what it's doing.
Camber could do with being about 2 degrees up front tbh.
Toe out on the fronts is fine. Don't go beyond 15mins toe out though as you'll start to kick f**k out the tyres.
I'd be tempted to leave the rear end geo until you've got a better feel with the car mate.

Getting a setup to suit you will take time, but that listed above will give you a good starting point.
Going stiff (easy!!) on the rear end is what the clio chassis loves.

Great, thanks for taking the time to respond.

I can easily change the spring for not a lot of money so I can look into that in the future but this should hopefully give me a starting point and I can work with it over time. I appreciate getting the suspension "correct" isn't a one answer question.

Thanks.

 

[R29TJR]

Oh I totally forgot to mention the fact i'm running H&R (DRA Bolt to Hub) 20mm spacers at the front @NorthloopCup

No spacers on the rear.

Not sure if this will make any difference to your synopsis.

 

[R29TJR]

I took mine to a local tinting place who took £20 for an internal one fitted, well well worth it for the faff of fitting one. He cut it on the outside then fitted it after removing the mirror. Like the idea though

Contacted my local tinting place to see if they could quickly fit me in. A quick 5 minute phone call later and him quoting "around £50" but maybe more as I've not done a front screen before didn't fill me with confidence!

Anyone local to Essex now any window tinting people. My mate has said he'll have a go this Friday and if it all goes wrong it'll only be a couple of hours wasted nothing more.

 

[NorthloopCup]

Oh I totally forgot to mention the fact i'm running H&R (DRA Bolt to Hub) 20mm spacers at the front @NorthloopCup

No spacers on the rear.

Not sure if this will make any difference to your synopsis.

I'm not a fan of spacers personally mate as it throws the scrub geometry out too much on the 1*2's. I'd go no more than 10mm, 15mm at a push up front personally.

 

[R29TJR]

I'm not a fan of spacers personally mate as it throws the scrub geometry out too much on the 1*2's. I'd go no more than 10mm, 15mm at a push up front personally.

I agree about spacers, I didn't want to run spacers however the tyres would have rubbed on the coilovers without them.

I'm running 2118's in a ET38 offset. I only used 20mm as it was the smallest bolt to hub spacers I could find. Would you suggest running nut & stud and a smaller spacer? However I was under the impression (maybe incorrectly) that bolt to hub would be "better/safer".

I just remembered why I though bolt to hub etc would be better (well just read it on PMS website) basically you require at least 18mm spacers to clear the current center ring. Therefore does the additional 2mm make much difference?

 

[NorthloopCup]

I agree about spacers, I didn't want to run spacers however the tyres would have rubbed on the coilovers without them.

I'm running 2118's in a ET38 offset. I only used 20mm as it was the smallest bolt to hub spacers I could find. Would you suggest running nut & stud and a smaller spacer? However I was under the impression (maybe incorrectly) that bolt to hub would be "better/safer".

Ah ok, sounds like there's not much choice then.

On my 200 I run 20mm spacers with longer bolts. They've seen some abuse now too and I've had no issues, but they're also hubcentric. You'd be fine to run a set of longer studs and spacers, providing they're hubcentric on anything over 10mm. They help to take the load, but spacers up to 10mm will be fine as none hubcentric mainly because they're not strong enough in hubcentric form!

 

[R29TJR]

I edited by post prior to your response @NorthloopCup !

But you had already covered the issue. The other issue with spacers is rubbing (on the front bumper bracket), in the video above you can hear much much it rubs on track. So I'm going to look at "adjusting" the brackets this weekend.

 

[NorthloopCup]

I edited by post prior to your response @NorthloopCup !

But you had already covered the issue. The other issue with spacers is rubbing (on the front bumper bracket), in the video above you can hear much much it rubs on track. So I'm going to look at "adjusting" the brackets this weekend.

Ah I was on the pace mate! Lol!!

I'm pretty sure that h&r do 15mm hubcentric spacers tbh.
Bumper brackets are easy to fix. They just need 'massaging' with a grinder. The wing holds the bumper in place anyway.

 

[R29TJR]

Official pics from Snetterton:

 

[NorthloopCup]

Official pics from Snetterton:

View attachment 1331396

What's the cornering speed in this shot mate?

 

[R29TJR]

What's the cornering speed in this shot mate?

Odd answer.

About 5.75-6.25k revs in third! No idea about speed. Just trying to work it out.

I used my video to work out speed.

 

[R29TJR]

Video can be found here if helps.

 

[NorthloopCup]

Video can be found here if helps.

I'll have a watch mate.

If you're wondering why I asked, it's because the n/s wheels haven't gone into positive camber (or don't appear to have done), so it actually gives an indication of how much load it's under for a given speed.

 

[R29TJR]

I'll have a watch mate.

If you're wondering why I asked, it's because the n/s wheels haven't gone into positive camber (or don't appear to have done), so it actually gives an indication of how much load it's under for a given speed.

Understood (TBH i did a bit of googling to understand what you meant)!

Cheers.

 

[R29TJR]

Some more Snetterton pics (not sure if these help @NorthloopCup):

Looking to do Cadwell Park on 15th October 2017 with a few pals which I'm really looking forward to.

Hopefully this weekend I'll some of my new purchases.

Tom

 

[R29TJR]

Front ARB Bushes, Clutch, Whiteline Rear ARB, Power steering pipe, Exhaust mounts, Track rod ends, Air filters & Tyres!

After deciding my front ARB bushes needed replacing, it was also suggested that the clutch is changed was probably due a change at the same time, so the other weekend @Scrooge set working his magic, unfortunately, and through no fault of his own had a nightmare of a job. Listed, in no particular order, problems encountered:

1. Rain!
2. Rusty subframe bolts
3. Rusty/broken power steering pipes
4. Broken clutch components ("brand new" valeo unit)
5. More rain!
6. Steering wheel column not connected

So basically had a few shitty weekends on the Clio but I can't thank @Scrooge enough for all his help, he's been amazing :up:

Anyway I'll let the pics do the talking!

After a slight misunderstanding from Extreme Tyres I've finally got hold my my VR2's. All going well they will be put on my 2118's tomorrow afternoon and this weekend I'm at Cadwell so will be able to report back on there performance. Most importantly the thread pattern is cool!

Again I had a few issues with air filters, I ordered one which was out of stock and then got sent a standard one in "error" so I then purchased a K&N item direct which arrived next day so quickly got to fitting it:

Cables ties FTW!

Whilst on the easy jobs I fitted my Whiteline rear ARB, only took two weekend to finish! Nothing to do with it being hard just me! (ignore cable ties they are used for positioning)

I've put it on its softest setting and again I will be able to report back after this weekend.

So here come the shitty jobs!

Firstly I ordered a Valeo clutch from eBay (a company with lots of feedback and sales of this unit according to eBay) and upon arrival I believe the part was an old unit and to make matters worse the clutch release bearing was broken. The two positioning clips were broken clean off:

Original Part:

New part:

You can see at the bottom where the original clips should be positioned, unfortunately we found this out at around 2.30pm on a Saturday so had a nightmare finding a replacement, after a good hour we eventually got held of one from GSF.

In brighter news the original clutch was from new and was in need of a change:

The clutch casing was also filled with oil from an earlier leak from the block which hopefully has now been resolved! But the gearbox was given a good clean:

Finally the front ARB bushes were replaced with Powerflex items and new track rod ends where fitted (although not all in this pic):

So late on Saturday evening we got the subframe back on the car and all going well tomorrow afternoon we'll get it all back together again, so that tracking can be done ready for Sunday at Cadwell Park.

I also have the following to do before Saturday:

• Fit Uniroyal Rainsport to my TD Pro Race 1.2's
• Fit new VR2's to 2118's
• Fit new exhaust mounts (Tiger Seal)
• Tracking

Nothing like leaving it last minute!

Tom

 

[R29TJR]

Cadwell Park - Sunday 15th October 2017

Firstly I had an amazing day at Cadwell Park, by far the best track I've driven to date.

However the lead up to the track day it was a bit of a nightmare, but with the amazing help of @Scrooge the car was ready to depart on Saturday afternoon.

With Cadwell being a good 3 hours from home I decided to drive up on Saturday afternoon, stay at my sister's house who lives around 35 mins from the track, and then drive across in the morning.

Having not driven the car for around 3 weeks prior to the journey to my sisters and since I last drove the Clio it’s had a new clutch, new front inner & outer ARB bushes and a Whiteline rear ARB. Following this work the car was finally all up and running on Friday evening, after a few issues with the ABS light.

Upon leaving @Scrooge on Friday evening:

When I first drove all was great excluding the tracking being out a little. Saturday morning I woke early to pop to Elite (Rainham, Essex) to get the alignment done, they open up at 8am and I was there at 7.45 and still 4th in the queue! 1hr 45 minutes later I'm on my way, I not recommending Elite however the fact you can just turn up and get it done is a big bonus!

The drive up to my sisters was perfect, the car drove amazingly well and even after a good 3 hour journey all appeared good.

As I’d been running so behind I hadn’t even time to wash the car and with it being parked in a yard it was covered in dust so a quick drive to the local garage I gave it a quick once over with the lance!

I also gave the car a quick once over and all looked good. Sunday I was up bright and early and arrived at Cadwell at just before 7.30am and greeted with thick fog!

We had the briefing and a bite to eat and basically sat around waiting for the track to open, eventually the track opened at around 11am and the fun started. To be honest the sighting laps were scary! It’s a tight circuit, very little run off, it was damp, it was foggy, I had no idea where I was going & I had no ABS! So as you can expect, in the morning I took it easy and slowly built up my confidence, in both the car and track. We also had a few red flags in the morning which made you aware of how damp it was offline but after a morning of taking it easy, I got going in the afternoon.

A few pics of the Clio:

I made a quick video of the day:



Throughout the day I was playing around with my suspension setting and tyre pressures and it’s now much better now, it no longer rubs which is good and the turn in is much better. Still room for improvement but it’ll take time to get it perfect.

All was going well and on my final session when I had a little spin, video to follow!

Not blaming this but it appears that my power steering fluid leaked, a friend in the car behind said I gave off a puff of white smoke just before the bend, which I assume was the fluid on the tyre thus causing the car understeer more than usual. No harm done so all is well.

Back in the pits it became clear the power steering pipe had leaked, right behind the alternator so a pain to get to. We therefore made a temporary fix to allow me to get home, however I still used 3.5l of power steering fluid on the way home and had to stop every 40 mins to top up the fluid.

Trying to fix the problem:

All in all a great day however I still have a few issues to resolve, which I’ll try and get done over the winter, I doubt I’ll do any trackdays between now and Christmas, but never say never!

I then put the car on the Team Dynamics Pro Race 1.2's for the journey home, not sure I like them:

The things I need to resolve:

• Power steering leak – either a new pipe or will just need cleaning up and putting back together.
• ABS issues (NSF) – either sensor or ABS ring.
• Steering angle sensor – appears this is a common issue when removing the subframe.

Other items which I’ve noticed while on track:

• I need some rear camber, the inside of my tyres aren’t wearing at all, so will look into this over the winter.
• I need to do a service (will be 12 months since I did it last in November).
• The air-conditioning stuff is a pain in the ass, takes up so much room in the engine bay!

I’ll edit the spin video later tonight and upload, in slow motion you realise how lucky I was…

As always a special thank you to @Scrooge a true gentleman!

Tom