Detailing Chat & Questions Thread

[Amos91]

Call me paranoid / crazy / a tree-hugger(?!) but I do think this nano-tech is going to create problems we aren't even aware of yet, and it will be too late by then to remove them from the environment. (Not to mention that I'm sure they are in loads more cleaning / personal hygiene products that we aren't told about.)

Best use it while you can then :tongueout:

 

[Yellow Dave]

I just don't like the idea of nano particles floating around the environment when there is no regulation of them whatsoever, seemingly - and if they are that small that they get through pretty much any filtration system, do you really want to be glugging back tapwater filled with car polish nanoparticles that have come off in the washing machine and gone straight into the sewage system, which is re-processed back into drinking water?

Call me paranoid / crazy / a tree-hugger(?!) but I do think this nano-tech is going to create problems we aren't even aware of yet, and it will be too late by then to remove them from the environment. (Not to mention that I'm sure they are in loads more cleaning / personal hygiene products that we aren't told about.)


Anyway, I appreciate that such technology works well for car polishes... lol


So, after all that rambling, I've taken off my tin-foil hat andI think my final selection will be:
CarPro Tar-X
CarPro Iron-X
Bilt Hamber Clay (regular)
AutoFinesse Tripple
Collinite 467S
and then some foam pads / microfibres for applying/removing, all of which should be relatively quick and easy to work with, hopefully :smile:

Thanks for all the help, gents, it's much appreciated! :up:

I'll have to remember to take some before and after photos because the current paint is shocking :laughing: although I don't think I'm going to be able to do much about the parts where someone's polished/scrubbed through to the white undercoat... lol

Colli 476 I beleive is very solvent heavy, and more than likely interefere a with any base products. So using it over tripple will more than likely mess with the wax and filler parts. In short it will effect the finish and outright durability.

As JD found Tripple and gtechniq C2, an alternative to reload, works very well together

 

[White16valver]

Gnargh, this is so confusing

The GTechniq C2 is another nano-product so I'm not keen on it lol

476 looks to be ok over SRP?
http://www.cliosport.net/threads/show-off-your-beading.427798/page-10#post-10359620
and SRP is a similar all-in-one product to Tripple, I think, so it might be alright??

Alternatively, I could go with AF Tough Coat (http://shop.autofinesse.co.uk/tough-coat-250ml) over the top of AF Tripple?
Looks nice and shouldn't have any issues with applying it?
http://www.cliosport.net/threads/af...ng-combination-lots-of-beading-inside.739912/

Although what is doing my head in now is that the Tough Coat seems to be a next step after Tough Prep, but the Tough Prep blurb seems to be contradictory in that it says it applies polish but 'leaves nothing behind', which would seem to imply it strips everything you've done before / during it, rendering it pointless?? WTF?
(This seems to be backed up by the Power Seal blurb saying "... [it] needs to be applied to clean bare paint... or [paint] prepared with Tough Prep" blurb - http://shop.autofinesse.co.uk/power-seal-500ml.)
And the Power Seal blurb seems to say the sequence should be Tough Prep > Power Seal > Tough Coat?

Is Tough Prep the same as SRP / Tripple or is it just a paint cleaner? Do Power Seal and Tough Coat do much the same job so it doesn't really matter which is used?

Are there any other sealants that work over a wax-inclusive all-in-one product, other than the gtechniq C2 and Carpro sealant??

Or should I go back to the original plan of a 3-stage clean/polish/wax system but add a (non-nano) sealant in before the wax stage?


Jeeze, is it any wonder some people get ripped off by buying crap, overpriced products that don't work when even the good stuff seems to be impenetrable to us old people / noobs?! 😞

 

[Yellow Dave]

A solvent based wax like colli or fk are likely to interefere with any base product. And ideally should be applied to bare clean paint for maximum results and durability. You can use them over something like tripple or SRP but be aware that you will more than likely find it dies off sooner than normal so will just need to re apply sooner.

Tough coat is a non nano sealant. Can be used over tripple, but again works at it's best off clean paint, but it's as easy to use as a quick detailer re applying once a week would only add another 5-10 minutes to a wash

Tough prep is a chemical cleanser, with minimal if any abrasives. It's designed to deep clean the paint more than just normal decontamination and washing, leaving behind a great base for applying sealants, of which colli and fk strictly are. Just because they come in a paste wax form doesn't change that.

My advise, drink the reload and get the nano system in you sooner rather than later then you can use it on the car. Far worse being out into our air and water ways

 

[White16valver]

A solvent based wax like colli or fk are likely to interefere with any base product. And ideally should be applied to bare clean paint for maximum results and durability. You can use them over something like tripple or SRP but be aware that you will more than likely find it dies off sooner than normal so will just need to re apply sooner.

Tough coat is a non nano sealant. Can be used over tripple, but again works at it's best off clean paint, but it's as easy to use as a quick detailer re applying once a week would only add another 5-10 minutes to a wash

Tough prep is a chemical cleanser, with minimal if any abrasives. It's designed to deep clean the paint more than just normal decontamination and washing, leaving behind a great base for applying sealants, of which colli and fk strictly are. Just because they come in a paste wax form doesn't change that.

My advise, drink the reload and get the nano system in you sooner rather than later then you can use it on the car. Far worse being out into our air and water ways

You are a gent, sir :up: - that has made things a little clearer, although like many a good Indian restaurant menu, making a final choice when so many are available and attractive is difficult...

It sounds like the cleaning/prep part is the easiest to decide - the following looks to cover all bases and bring the paint to its cleanest and ready for polishing, going from what has been said, so I'll definitely get these unless anyone tells me I'm an idiot:

CarPro Tar-X
CarPro Iron-X
Auto Finesse Tough Prep
Bilt Hamber Clay (regular)

After that, a plethora of options seems to exist - tell me if this summary of what everyone has kindly tried to help me understand :up: is utterly wrong...

Polish - used first to remove scratches / restore colour (but ideally needs to be cleaned/stripped afterwards with Tough Prep or similar if wax or sealant is the next step?)
Solvent-based Wax - should be used straight onto bare paint
'Pure' Carnauba Wax - can be used straight on top of bare paint or polish or sealant as is non-reactive (?)
Sealant (non-nano-tech) - may interact with ingredients of polishes and waxes so should be used on bare paint
Sealant (nano-tech) - inorganic so can go on top of anything, whether polish, wax or bare paint

So, if I have this in any way correct, the decision to be made seems to be whether to go:

Polish > Carnauba Wax
or
Polish > Carnauba Wax > Sealant (nano)
or
Polish > Clean/Strip (e.g. Tough Prep) > Solvent-based Wax
or
Polish > Clean/Strip (e.g. Tough Prep) > Solvent-based Wax > Sealant (nano)
or
Polish > Clean/Strip (e.g. Tough Prep) > Sealant (nano/non-nano)
or
Polish > Clean/Strip (e.g. Tough Prep) > Sealant (nano/non-nano) > Carnauba Wax

Is that right?? Am I a blind/deaf muppet who can't read or take anything in?? :dizzy:

I really don't know what's happened to me in the 5 years I've not really been around on the forum, I swear it was a lot easier when all we had to do was walk into Halfords and pick up the AutoGlym selection box, then wash, clay, slap on some Super Resin Polish and top off with some Extra Gloss Protection... 😊

[/old man]

 

[Yellow Dave]

things get more confusing, you can get lots of different types of sealants, polymer, solvent, glass / silicon / nano, and waxed based. likewise you can get waxes that are either carnuba wax, polymer or solvent based, and recently glass based. its only really the nano coatings, a more advanced system of sealant, that truly require a perfectly clean bare paint base. the other general waxes and sealants can be used over a filler or wax based product, but just wont last as long. then are the options like tough prep that leave very little if anything behind so theres not really an issue of what you put over it as long as its not a coating.

 

[White16valver]

things get more confusing, you can get lots of different types of sealants, polymer, solvent, glass / silicon / nano, and waxed based. likewise you can get waxes that are either carnuba wax, polymer or solvent based, and recently glass based. its only really the nano coatings, a more advanced system of sealant, that truly require a perfectly clean bare paint base. the other general waxes and sealants can be used over a filler or wax based product, but just wont last as long. then are the options like tough prep that leave very little if anything behind so theres not really an issue of what you put over it as long as its not a coating.

Thanks for putting up with my noob questions and taking the time to respond, it's very kind of you, good sir :up: :blush:

I think I have made my final selection now so, over a hundred and thirty quid later :dizzy: I'm about to press 'Submit Order'...

I'm not sure it will completely cure all the issues in abused paintwork a quarter of a century old, especially not when done by hand, but it should make an improvement at least. It better look effing amazing when I'm finished, that's all I can say... lol

 

[Cliotoby]

Just to confirm, Turbo detailed is exactly what people say it is - which is what BSD should have been.

Still a 2 cloth application, but its pretty much effortles - wipe on, buff off gently. Still a grabby finish but not as bad as BSD, doesnt leave smears like BSD did - was difficult to get it right. Beading is excellent. Durability still excellent. Be interesting to see what winter throws at it.

http://vid578.photobucket.com/albums/ss227/ClioToby/Video_zpsgmzsxt8x.mp4

 

[terryc101]

Best way to remove vinyl? brothers gf has just bought a fiat 500 and the roof has a chequered pattern on it that's all faded, so wants it removing before I polish it for her.

 

[Cliotoby]

Best way to remove vinyl? brothers gf has just bought a fiat 500 and the roof has a chequered pattern on it that's all faded, so wants it removing before I polish it for her.

heat the fucker up with a hair dryer or a heat gun and remove it. Dont get it too hot

 

[terryc101]

heat the fucker up with a hair dryer or a heat gun and remove it. Dont get it too hot

That was my thinking, thanks. They're all individual too Gonna take forever I feel.

 

[sburrell93]

Ordered myself a load of new cleaning gear at the end of last week there. One thing I ordered was 5L of Bilt Hamber Autofoam to try out as a new snow foam. Now, boredom in work today led to me having a look at the safety data sheet for it and it's supposedly got a pH of 13.

Surely at that it can't be LSP safe? Or am I missing something?

 

[Yellow Dave]

pH rating is only part of the story. Autofinesse citrus power is extremely alkali despite the name yet has proven to be wax safe.

Iirc autofoam has to be diluted quite highly to keep it wax safe

 

[Gus]

Ordered myself a load of new cleaning gear at the end of last week there. One thing I ordered was 5L of Bilt Hamber Autofoam to try out as a new snow foam. Now, boredom in work today led to me having a look at the safety data sheet for it and it's supposedly got a pH of 13.

Surely at that it can't be LSP safe? Or am I missing something?

Really want to try some of this myself. Bilthamber are one of the only companies who's products are always awesome.

 

[sburrell93]

Cheers Dave, that clears that up then. Feel a bit better about using it now!

I just tried it out there anyway, diluted about 200-300ml into a 1 litre bottle (probably a bit strong but I have no LSP just now anyway so just wanted to test cleaning power).

The car hasn't been washed in about 2 months and its left it very clean looking for just a quick going over!

I'll get a few photos once it's dried a bit since it always looks cleaner while wet.

 

[sburrell93]

OK ignore that idea. It's too dark now lol!

So this was before. It almost wasn't black anymore...

And then after using autofoam at the dilution I mentioned:

Photos from a distance don't really show much hence why I've not got any of the full car, however, I'm very impressed by it!

 

[Gally]

Use 8:1 in a decent pump sprayer also for epic cleaning ability!

 

[Gus]

So I have spent way too many hours machine polishing a petrol blue 182. I have gone through wet sanding any deeper scratches, meguiars ultimate cutting compound and then 4 different Menzerna polishes and a range of hex logic pads until the paint had a complete mirror finish. Ive never spent this long on a car but now that I have a nice garage it has been quite enjoyable to spend a few hours a day on it without rain or weather screwing things up.

Im now at the stage where tomorrow I plan on using bilthamber cleanser just to get rid if any oils from the polish and also any glue from when I remove the masking tape. I now need to wax the car and that is where I am a bit stuck. Usually on my black 182 its an easy choice - black hole followed by collinite if its winter or chemicals guys XXX wax if its summer.

I have these waxes at the moment and they are all pretty low budget choices. As I have spent so long on the polish and prep I want to try some decent wax.

Ive never opened the Essence wax and wondered how good this is?
Any help appreciated.

 

[aucky]

Do you drive the car in winter?

Either way, I think you need a strong base, followed with a nice wax.
Something semi-permanent, CQUK etc..

 

[Gally]

It's a bit of a shame you have to use one of those on what sounds like a flawless finish.

Megs #16 2 layers for me. Esscence or 53 might look the best but won't last at this time of year.

New age sealants are king now due to their ability to keep cars cleaner for longer and keep the fresh look there.

 

[Gus]

It's a bit of a shame you have to use one of those on what sounds like a flawless finish.

Megs #16 2 layers for me. Esscence or 53 might look the best but won't last at this time of year.

New age sealants are king now due to their ability to keep cars cleaner for longer and keep the fresh look there.

That #16 must be 10 years old. Used to quite like it lol.
Really could do with a point in the right direction. Im up for buying what it takes and was hoping you could tell me what to buy. I dont mind if it doesnt last ages and am looking for a beautiful finish more than anything. What would you suggest. Dont want to spend more than 200.

 

[aucky]

And after the hours you've put it, you may as well put something hard on top. Then follow it with something nice for devilment / looks.

I like layers.

 

[aucky]

Has JD still got his small pot of BOS for sale?
That would be ideal over some CQUK/STRATA/Whatever

 

[Gus]

Has JD still got his small pot of BOS for sale?
That would be ideal over some CQUK/STRATA/Whatever

What does CQUK and BOS stand for ? will go and have a look at what you have suggested, much appreciated!

 

[aucky]

Sorry dude,
CQUK = CQuartz UK, a semi permanent sealant. Just an example, there are plenty available. It reall would be a shame not to protect your hard work with something durable.
STRATA is the Migliore equivalent, there are several on the market, I haven't stayed up to date in the last year though..

BOS= Swissvax Best Of Show. In terms of show waxes, there's few I'd choose over it.

Like it said, you've put in the graft, so the final 5% will pay dividend more than most dividends.

 

[Yellow Dave]

I'm really liking migliore strata coating, but can't find any UK stockists to do my own car with it.

 

[Gus]

As we all know clios are made of thin coke can metal. How do people tackle the roof of the car when they are machine polishing with DAS. on harder pads I find when i get to the middle of the roof the polisher will jump a little and vibrations will go through the roof. Even if you dont put any pressure on the polisher and even support the weight of it a little it still vibrates the roof. pain in the ass.

 

[Gus]

Also more importantly after 5 years of using my Kestrel DAS 6 it might finally be dying. I think the bearing that supports the backing pad is worn out as there is a lot movement in the backing pad and also makes noises now. Kind of glad its breaking as I want another polisher.

What would you guys recommend ?

 

[Gally]

I'm really liking migliore strata coating, but can't find any UK stockists to do my own car with it.

Don't Monza still sell it? If you email (Migliore) them they'll send it out, great company.

 

[Gally]

Dave...

 

[Yellow Dave]

Monza are no longer resellers and moving stock. Just seen that on Instagram and asked about uk postage, they'll send and postage isn't too bad, but works out at approx £65 for a 30ml bottle of strata. Was happy with the group buy price. I like it but not that much. Nanolex Si3d will be tried next.

 

[Inequality Street]

Also more importantly after 5 years of using my Kestrel DAS 6 it might finally be dying. I think the bearing that supports the backing pad is worn out as there is a lot movement in the backing pad and also makes noises now. Kind of glad its breaking as I want another polisher.

What would you guys recommend ?

I have a DAS6 Pro for sale, if you're interested

 

[Gus]

I have a DAS6 Pro for sale, if you're interested

Hi mate yes sounds good. will PM you.

 

[sburrell93]

Bit of recent polishing done on the daily. White hex pad and Menz SF4000 (106FA on the old school naming I think). Was amazed at how much correction there was from a combo with such a low level of cut.

There's a few deeper marks left, anyone any ideas as to what combo I'd be best moving to? Harder pad or higher cut polish? Or just another pass with the same pad/polish? It's clearly very soft paint and I don't want to go through it!

 

[Scrooge]

Nice correction there!

How many passes did it take to achieve that? Have you measured the paint to see how many microns those passes have taken away? Also is that second picture cleansed to reveal the actual correction?

If that was only a few passes and actually corrected that well i'd probably stick with that combo as the paint is clearly very soft.

What car is it btw?

 

[sburrell93]

Nice correction there!

How many passes did it take to achieve that? Have you measured the paint to see how many microns those passes have taken away? Also is that second picture cleansed to reveal the actual correction?

If that was only a few passes and actually corrected that well i'd probably stick with that combo as the paint is clearly very soft.

What car is it btw?

That was about 3 passes I think. Spread the polish about then went over it twice by which point the polish residue was pretty much disappearing before doing a final light pass. That second picture wasn't cleansed though, forgot about that! Don't have access to anything to measure paint depth either. Never been an issue in the past but might need to try and find one for this since its so swirled.

It's a Honda civic. Paint is in shocking condition just now lol.

 

[Scrooge]

@Knuckles How soft is your Civic paint, like all Jap cars?

I'd be sticking with the combo you've got tbh.

 

[Knuckles]

@Knuckles How soft is your Civic paint, like all Jap cars?

I'd be sticking with the combo you've got tbh.

Very very soft, i found triple more than enough to remove minor swirls.

I'd be using a slightly more abrasive polish rather than a harsher pad to remove deeper marks

 

[Gally]

Yeah you can't go heavier stu as it will inflict it's own marring, i'm surprised the white hex hasn't left marring actually.

 

[Knuckles]

I'm sure it was tripple on a finishing pad that I used.