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EVO Mag June 2010 172 cup vs 200 cup

172head

172head

Car  172 Cup
Quiet a good read in this edition, they test the Old 172 cup against the 200 cup, the 172 came from Club GT and the 200 their own test fleet.

Anyway they put both on the track an the 200 was 2secs quicker.

Anyone else read this, what are your thoughts?
 
You would really hope they could improve a car over the space of 6ish year. Which they have... well apart from that front bumper.
 
No real surprise. The 200 Cup is the best Clio since the 172 Cup. The chassis is better, it has more grip, the brakes are better and the engine has more power.
 
Hugo- said:
Clio Media?
Click to expand...


Evo Magazine is media, and the thread is about the Clio spread in the Mag.
get a Mod Move it to the correct section which is..........

I wasnt too surprised by the outcome, hoped it would be abit closer tho, these new cars just look too big imo
 
As they said in the article, the lap times don't tell the whole story....

I've still not driven a 200, but from everything I've read it clearly seems a stepup as an everyday car. But more fun for punting around a b-road? Doubtful.
 
As the article concluded, yes the 200 was faster but the 172 Cup was more fun.

I know what i'd fancy to take on track.
 
Haven't been lucky enough to drive a 200 or even a 197 yet, but with a lot of modern cars are they now lacking in sole and driver input to appeal to a bigger Market?
 
ABOO said:
Haven't been lucky enough to drive a 200 or even a 197 yet, but with a lot of modern cars are they now lacking in sole and driver input to appeal to a bigger Market?
Click to expand...

absolutely not.

If anything the 200 Cup is more focussed than the earlier cars.

I've owned a 182ff, 182 Trophy and my brother owned a 172. Now have a 200 and I can assure you that not an ounce of soul has been lost in the development of the newer car. They've just added a few extra bits to make it even better.

Like for example; Recaros, Brembo brakes, even more sophisticated chassis, even firmer damping and better roll control, wider tyres, excellent short shifting 6 spd box, quick ratio steering, higher reving engine, more power.

What's not to like?
 
MadUsa1 said:
absolutely not.

If anything the 200 Cup is more focussed than the earlier cars.

I've owned a 182ff, 182 Trophy and my brother owned a 172. Now have a 200 and I can assure you that not an ounce of soul has been lost in the development of the newer car. They've just added a few extra bits to make it even better.

Like for example; Recaros, Brembo brakes, even more sophisticated chassis, even firmer damping and better roll control, wider tyres, excellent short shifting 6 spd box, quick ratio steering, higher reving engine, more power.

What's not to like?
Click to expand...

This doesn't always make for a fun car. Sometimes the lack of what you mentioned is more fun.
 
Im sure the 200 does win but you could by 2 172 Cups with spare money for that 2 seconds difference if it was just purely for track? Or even a 172 Cup + ITB's and other upgraded parts to rip the 200 a new one.
 
I thought it was a pretty good read and the out come was what I expected. To be honest I was kinda hopping for an extra half star for the 172 cup tho. They seemed to really like it (complained about not having abs) but loved everything else. To me it is exactly ehat they say an EVO car should be, yet 4 stars!

Also, if track times are so important then, your still better in the 172 because for about half the frice of a 200 you can buy and turn a 200 in to a rocket! I'm not complaining bout the on track comparison because I find it very interesting to see how things have changed, but 2 secs isn't a huge amount to find imo!
 
_WILL_ said:
2 secs isn't a huge amount to find imo!
Click to expand...

But seeing as track days are about fun anyway, what does that 2 seconds really matter ;) Tbh I could count the number of professional drivers on CS with one hand, the rest of us wouldnt know the difference between a 56" lap time and a 58" one anyway lol ...

We would however, know which one was more fun.

:race:
 
I think the one that Evo are running is not a Cup, it is a FF with Cup Pack... On track the lighter Cup car which is the correct comparison (yes it's only -40kg) would have given even more difference.

Just facts :o :approve:
 
Should also enquire what track length it was, if it's a 1min lap on Bedford Autodrome type affair then 2 sec is a fair pull, if it's 10min lap on the ring then 2 sec is no difference :)
 
i drove a 200 cup the other day and honestly i can say the bigger smile came from jumping back in my 182.. the 200 feels heavier and softer.. im sure its a much more clinical car on a track but for pure driving pleasure id have to say the 182 does it for me personally.
 
KMB said:
I think the one that Evo are running is not a Cup, it is a FF with Cup Pack... On track the lighter Cup car which is the correct comparison (yes it's only -40kg) would have given even more difference.

Just facts :o :approve:
Click to expand...
40kg will make next to bugger all difference. Especially on an already heavier car.

And you have to rofl at more focussed. Why do all the big boys make there focussed models as light as possible? Why does the r26r have softer suspension than an r26? Weight is the enemy of performance/handling.

The newer cars have firmer suspension, bigger brakes and wider tyres because they are heavier lol.
 
Look forward to reading their comparison.

For me they both do the same task very well, however one's a hooligan and the other's all grown up. Each has it's preferred market.
 
I know it's a little off topic but I want/need the Scooby. I plan on owning a car like that one day!
 
I've never driven a 197 or 200, however most people use their 1*2 for general day to day aswell as fast road and in some cases track.

Personally i'd rather take the MK3 RS over a 1*2 as an all rounder because thats what a hot hatch should do. On a twisty road yes the 1*2 will feel more raw. However the same arguement is had between the willy and 172.

Some people really rate the fun of the MK3's. I know Kneel loved his 197 a lot more than his 172 in terms of driving, as he never fails to mention at a meet about his 197 ;)
 
gaz44 said:
Is BS.
Click to expand...

This.

I'm ordering a 200 next week. Am I making the right decision?.. I have no idea :( I love them both for different reasons. No 2 ways about it, my 182 (quite modded) is much quicker but I'm hoping once I've put a few miles on the 200 I'll be just as happy with how it pulls. The 200 wins in every other department though.
 
Last edited:
platty said:
i drove a 200 cup the other day and honestly i can say the bigger smile came from jumping back in my 182.. the 200 feels heavier and softer.. im sure its a much more clinical car on a track but for pure driving pleasure id have to say the 182 does it for me personally.
Click to expand...

I also test drove a 200 cup on monday, great brakes, nice ride and steering and alot of torque low down. It was quick but didn't feel it because of the more stable chassis and increase in refinement. I'm sure it is a good car, but didn't have that trophy feel and I felt much happier geting back into mine.
 
Hmmm...

Well Auto Express also went for the 200 Cup... (7 April issue; 20 Years of Clio)
80p cheaper then Autocar :rasp:
 
1.5 seconds quicker actualy! nearly identical for most of the lap tho, it lost out on the faster corners.
172 was also faster than the trophy! ;)
 
MadUsa1 said:
absolutely not.

If anything the 200 Cup is more focussed than the earlier cars.

I've owned a 182ff, 182 Trophy and my brother owned a 172. Now have a 200 and I can assure you that not an ounce of soul has been lost in the development of the newer car. They've just added a few extra bits to make it even better.

Like for example; Recaros, Brembo brakes, even more sophisticated chassis, even firmer damping and better roll control, wider tyres, excellent short shifting 6 spd box, quick ratio steering, higher reving engine, more power.

What's not to like?
Click to expand...

yeah it has some fancy instruments...but compared to the williams....the driver involvement is almost zero....felt so detatched from the 200 when driving it. granted, i didnt thrash it round a track, but new cars just seem to lack soul.
 
2 live said:
yeah it has some fancy instruments...but compared to the williams....the driver involvement is almost zero....felt so detatched from the 200 when driving it. granted, i didnt thrash it round a track, but new cars just seem to lack soul.
Click to expand...
Driving the 200 doesn't leave me feeling "detached" - Granted I'm no Aryton Senna but it certainly feels like I've been in the car when I've had a spirited run in it :).

As for soul - that only ever comes with age - the 200 will have plenty of soul in the coming years when we all look back with our "fuel was only 1.20 a litre back in the day" rose tinted glasses on ;)
 
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