Mk1 F4R/172'd Track Car Project [Year 3 - Engine and Chassis Rebuild]

[Matteh]

Re: Mk1 172 Hybrid Track Car Project

the plot thickens

excuse the boring stuff at the beginning... skip to about 1 minute remaining

looks like mine is hitting the cold limiter! even though you can see when the camera is on the coolant temp gauge its 100% up to temp!

hopefully a new CTS will solve that as I'm currently using a K4M item (though the fan cuts in and out fine :S)

 

[geesus69]

Re: Mk1 172 Hybrid Track Car Project

matteh am i still going to have this problem or does that thing you mentioned on my car sort it? :S

 

[JD]

Re: Mk1 172 Hybrid Track Car Project

Nice top mounts fella, where did you manage to source a set from?

I was under the impression that camber had nothing to do with the way the bolts were facing, as this was how to correct/adjust castor? That's what I was told by most on here/Tweaks? Hence they can be in different positions dependant on how badly made the car's turrets are?

 

[geesus69]

Re: Mk1 172 Hybrid Track Car Project

Nice top mounts fella, where did you manage to source a set from?

I was under the impression that camber had nothing to do with the way the bolts were facing, as this was how to correct/adjust castor? That's what I was told by most on here/Tweaks? Hence they can be in different positions dependant on how badly made the car's turrets are?

he got them off me i cant use them as my new car has standard ()suspension

and yes i think you are right, just having the bolts facing a certain way doesnt necessarily mean the most/least camber/castor etc

 

[Matteh]

Re: Mk1 172 Hybrid Track Car Project

matteh am i still going to have this problem or does that thing you mentioned on my car sort it? :S

your rev counter will work fine, we've 100% got that issue fixed. your clocks have been modded already so just plug the correct wire from the clocks (pin 13 on the large connector behind the rev counter) into pin 70 of the 172 ecu.

you will also need to run the white wire (middle on the connector - ignore the colours of the wires on the speedo cable itself as it's 'wrong' - go by what the car side of the loom is) from the mk1 speedo sensor to pin 53 (iirc) of the 172 ecu

you should then be cooking on gas

 

[geesus69]

Re: Mk1 172 Hybrid Track Car Project

your rev counter will work fine, we've 100% got that issue fixed. your clocks have been modded already so just plug the correct wire from the clocks (pin 13 on the large connector behind the rev counter) into pin 70 of the 172 ecu.

you will also need to run the white wire (middle on the connector) from the mk1 speedo sensor to pin 53 (iirc) of the 172 ecu

you should then be cooking on gas

sweet!

 

[powey]

Re: Mk1 172 Hybrid Track Car Project

Nice top mounts fella, where did you manage to source a set from?

I was under the impression that camber had nothing to do with the way the bolts were facing, as this was how to correct/adjust castor? That's what I was told by most on here/Tweaks? Hence they can be in different positions dependant on how badly made the car's turrets are?

If you look at the shape of the top mounts when they are held flat the bottom will kick out, if you think of it bolted to the turret thats what gives the adjustable camber/castor by having it facing different directions

 

[JD]

Re: Mk1 172 Hybrid Track Car Project

^^^Makes sense

 

[geesus69]

Re: Mk1 172 Hybrid Track Car Project

If you look at the shape of the top mounts when they are held flat the bottom will kick out, if you think of it bolted to the turret thats what gives the adjustable camber/castor by having it facing different directions

yeh but i think he means using the direction of the 3 bolts to adjust doesnt necessarily mean the most/least castor/camber

only true way to tell is get it aligned properly

 

[powey]

Re: Mk1 172 Hybrid Track Car Project

Any pics of the IK fitted?

 

[f0xy]

Re: Mk1 172 Hybrid Track Car Project

Will watch the video when I get home Matteh.

Clutch cable replaced this morning in 15 mins, easy job, alls good now

Weather forecast is OK for tommorow so got to crack on with stuff, proper update then.

 

[Guppy]

Re: Mk1 172 Hybrid Track Car Project

Caged by FCS?

 

[f0xy]

Re: Mk1 172 Hybrid Track Car Project

itl be caged in the next week or two, has to be in by brands (27th)....had it sitting here in pieces for 3 months now...then interiors getting a respray straight afterwards

 

[Guppy]

Re: Mk1 172 Hybrid Track Car Project

Sweet!

Will be stiff as a board then

 

[Hutchie]

Re: Mk1 172 Hybrid Track Car Project

Sweet!

Will be stiff as a board then

only if he gets it welded to b pillars etc like we discussed jord

cant wait to see this car in the flesh... one day....

 

[f0xy]

Re: Mk1 172 Hybrid Track Car Project

right then.....

My ecu is getting the speed reading fine now, got a few logs in RSTuner, all good. Turned out the wire from the sensor to the ECU was damaged (well the pin on the connector block). Anyway, its getting a speed reading perfectly fine.

But....you guessed it, the limiter is still sub 6k!

So im no closer, the ecu is getting the reading fine, there is no error codes showing. All other data is good on the live + logging, coolant temp sensor is fine, but still hitting the limiter at 6k ish on the clock, well, 5770(ish) according to RSTuner....

Out of ideas again....lol.

 

[Matteh]

Re: Mk1 172 Hybrid Track Car Project

:S wierd

did some further testing on mine today, it seems to cold limit at 6k and warm limit at 6.6k...

something is up :/

 

[Hutchie]

Re: Mk1 172 Hybrid Track Car Project

im sure you feel like you banging your head on a brick wall atm :banghead:

 

[Mark One]

Re: Mk1 172 Hybrid Track Car Project

standalone Pwns.
Expensive. But in the end surely worth it.

 

[f0xy]

Re: Mk1 172 Hybrid Track Car Project

i shouldnt need to buy standalone, its a 172 loom, 172 standard ecu, 172 standard engine....172 sensors, its getting the readings it needs sensor wise, so there is no reason why it should not work as it would do in a 172 shell!

 

[Mark One]

Re: Mk1 172 Hybrid Track Car Project

i shouldnt need to buy standalone, its a 172 loom, 172 standard ecu, 172 standard engine....172 sensors, its getting the readings it needs sensor wise, so there is no reason why it should not work as it would do in a 172 shell!

Sounds a great excuse for ITBs and standalone to me jord. Wallet open mate.

 

[f0xy]

Re: Mk1 172 Hybrid Track Car Project

maybe if the nobber who sold me the fucked first engine gets his act together its a possibility

 

[Hutchie]

Re: Mk1 172 Hybrid Track Car Project

 

[Daz Clio Cup]

Re: Mk1 172 Hybrid Track Car Project

I assume your using a mk1 speedo output to go to the 172 ecu? maybe it's that not being compatable? can't you use a cup or ph1 sensor?

 

[f0xy]

Re: Mk1 172 Hybrid Track Car Project

i have a ph1 sensor, not needed to use it though...

Had the RSTuner running on live data output, watching the vehicle speed when driving. Its spot on, mk1 cable is outputting correctly and giving the reading to the ECU now...

Just the limiter is stil lowwwwww.

Ive got some of the logs, just playing in excel at the moment then il put an image up of it, see if anyone can spot anything dodgy....

 

[Matteh]

Re: Mk1 172 Hybrid Track Car Project

looks like the mk1 sensor is compatible

you cant use the mk2 as the mk1 speedo is mechanically driven, so needs a cable.

the mk1 cable just happens to have the signal generator built in

 

[Daz Clio Cup]

Re: Mk1 172 Hybrid Track Car Project

can't you use the rs tuner just to reprogram the rev limit?

 

[f0xy]

Re: Mk1 172 Hybrid Track Car Project

i *could* do, but i dont want to, as there is clearly an issue elsewhere....and id rather know what it is, incase it effects anything important (fuel etc)

 

[richy22]

Re: Mk1 172 Hybrid Track Car Project

I swear before I re programmed my ecu with the RStuner it was kicking in just after 6K?? I honestly cant remember! (thats probably of no help what-so-ever)

 

[Mark One]

Re: Mk1 172 Hybrid Track Car Project

i *could* do, but i dont want to, as there is clearly an issue elsewhere....and id rather know what it is, incase it effects anything important (fuel etc)

GEY! get it done. A problem rigged is a problem nearly solved.

 

[f0xy]

Re: Mk1 172 Hybrid Track Car Project

wrong

 

[Andrew Cooke]

Re: Mk1 172 Hybrid Track Car Project

looks like it's running out of steam at about 5600rpm, are you sure it's the ECU, and not something else like fuel supply? Are you able to plot the lambda outputs?

 

[f0xy]

Re: Mk1 172 Hybrid Track Car Project

unfortunately no, rstuner dosent have the lambda/or/air-fuel ratio output....well my model dosent anyway, i know the newer ones have additional options...

It literally bounces off the limiter at 5700-6000 (seems variable after lookiing at the data), dosent just stop....so its the ECU setting that limit for some reason

 

[Daz Clio Cup]

Re: Mk1 172 Hybrid Track Car Project

temperature?

 

[richy22]

Re: Mk1 172 Hybrid Track Car Project

unfortunately no, rstuner dosent have the lambda/or/air-fuel ratio output....well my model dosent anyway, i know the newer ones have additional options...

It literally bounces off the limiter at 5700-6000 (seems variable after lookiing at the data), dosent just stop....so its the ECU setting that limit for some reason

you sure about that?? I thought they all did the lambda/fuel ratio's??

Also I notice your running software 1.7.7?

 

[f0xy]

Re: Mk1 172 Hybrid Track Car Project

they read lambda voltage, but to get the proper 'air/fuel ratio', you need a sensor in the end of the exhaust with a wideband input to log it IIRC....ie like when you go on a rolling road to get fuelling data, how its running etc...

My data has 'Lambda Voltage', but it seems its operating correctly.... 0-800-0-800 as they do, will double check the higher value shortly.

 

[f0xy]

Re: Mk1 172 Hybrid Track Car Project

temperature?

Coolant temprature is showing fine, sensor seems to be 100% working. The data collected for it shows consistency, no unusual values etc

 

[richy22]

Re: Mk1 172 Hybrid Track Car Project

Ah yeah the wideband sensors forgot about those.

 

[Andrew Cooke]

Re: Mk1 172 Hybrid Track Car Project

something starts to limit at 5600, then hard cuts at 5700 (or is that averaging in the software?).

I'm just throwing random stuff out here, but say it started to run out of fuel at 5600, and at 5700 the lambda showed lean and the ECU shut down. I don't even know if the ECU can do that???

If you want to monitor the lambda you only need a multimeter with a high impedance input. It's only a narrow band, so you'll only know if it's weaker than 14.7:1

Have you tried getting the TDC sensor closer to the trigger? Maybe the ECU loses the signal at higher RPM.

 

[Andrew Cooke]

Re: Mk1 172 Hybrid Track Car Project

they read lambda voltage, but to get the proper 'air/fuel ratio', you need a sensor in the end of the exhaust with a wideband input to log it IIRC....ie like when you go on a rolling road to get fuelling data, how its running etc...

My data has 'Lambda Voltage', but it seems its operating correctly.... 0-800-0-800 as they do, will double check the higher value shortly.

that's perfect, you're not mapping with it, just checking that it isn't going silly lean