Rolling Road/Remap Results.. Opinions?

[smith647]

Not sure whether to be disappointed or not?

I've not been around Clios much so my knowledge is pretty limited but I was thinking a Clio 182 was 182PS so about 180BHP but I accept its an 11 year old engine so I replaced HT leads, injectors, coil pack and pre cat lambda sensor just to make sure it was running at its best. Modifications are KTEC induction kit, Matched inlets (It was fitted with an RS inlet standard so I knew the gains would be negligible from this), Milltek Sport Cat and Pure Motorsport Cat-back.

I was expecting about 185bhp but it didn't get anywhere near that.

 

[JamesBryan]

That's pretty good to be fair.

Hardly any make book power, they're usually around 165bhp plus, for a 172 and 170ish for a 182.

Although the previous figure of 140ish would suggest there was more of a problem, usually timing out if it's that low.

 

[R3k1355]

Book figure for the 182 was in the 170's anyway, the 182 in the name is just misleading.

Wasn't it because the Pug 206 Gti was 180 or something??

 

[McGherkin]

Is that power at the wheels in the second graph?

 

[plees]

My 172 was timed up wrong and made 179bhp haha. That's just with induction and decat k-tec stealth exhaust

That was at EFI parts too so an accurate reading

 

[levaz]

With pretty much the same mods you have on my 56k mile 172 (inc 182 manifold + decat)
mine made 179.1bhp running the factory map.

 

[Tim.]

The variance from the Renaultsport factory compared to other manufacturers and their book output is huge. Some engines are incredibly strong, freakishly so, others are not. If you went in with realistic expectations you'd know not to be disappointed, the chances of it making 180 were pretty slim, but you weren't to know. Don't beat yourself up about the numbers, just enjoy it for what it is - a very good value, great handling, fun to drive, hot hatch.

 

[smith647]

Although the previous figure of 140ish would suggest there was more of a problem, usually timing out if it's that low.

Are you talking about the second graph with the 140ish bhp? If so that's at the wheels pal. I should of mentioned that the first graph is flywheel and second is power at wheels and AFR.

Is that power at the wheels in the second graph?

Yeah pal

 

[smith647]

If I'm honest looking at the numbers I'm pretty disappointed but once I'm in the car driving it I'm over the moon with how it feels and the mid range torque which it gained is very noticeable. Got Blyton and Cadwell booked for March and April so looking forward to that and seeing how much the cars improved as the last time I went on track in September it was totally standard. :up:

 

[JamesBryan]

Are you talking about the second graph with the 140ish bhp? If so that's at the wheels pal. I should of mentioned that the first graph is flywheel and second is power at wheels and AFR.

Ahh that's ok then.

As long as it feels ok, that's all that matters.

 

[SimpleJoee]

Get some Catcams and you will no longer be disappointed with the figures.

 

[Chrisgti6]

Book figure for the 182 was in the 170's anyway, the 182 in the name is just misleading.

Wasn't it because the Pug 206 Gti was 180 or something??

No, they were called 182 as they were supposed to produce 182ps, which is 179.5bhp.

Same with the 172, 197 & 200

 

[RichieJA]

When did it last have a service dephaser and some redex through it ? These things will make a big difference , is it mapped ?

 

[flebay]

The official power figure for the 182 taken from the Clio trophy factory brochure.
2.0 16V (132kW/182CH)
182 CH if a French power rating.
132kw = 177.015 British horsepower
http://www.cliotrophy.ch/trophy.htm

So you car has 5.515 hp less than the official Renault figure.

 

[smith647]

When did it last have a service dephaser and some redex through it ? These things will make a big difference , is it mapped ?

Yeah it's mapped pal. 167bhp standard 171bhp after map at RS Tuning.

I did a full service in August last year and I also did another Oil change in October after a track day. Had belts and dephaser done in September last year at DDC Doncaster. I only use V-Power too nothing else goes in the tank.

Redex? As far as I'm aware that's the most overrated gash product ever.

 

[smith647]

@flebay Never knew the 182 was a CH figure.. Good to know :up:

So its roughly down 5BHP but the peak torque figure is 157Ftlb which I think is more than standard?

At end of day it's an 11 year old engine and I haven't done any drastic power modifications so I suppose I can't really complain.

 

[klm182]

Not sure whether to be disappointed or not?

I've not been around Clios much so my knowledge is pretty limited but I was thinking a Clio 182 was 182PS so about 180BHP but I accept its an 11 year old engine so I replaced HT leads, injectors, coil pack and pre cat lambda sensor just to make sure it was running at its best. Modifications are KTEC induction kit, Matched inlets (It was fitted with an RS inlet standard so I knew the gains would be negligible from this), Milltek Sport Cat and Pure Motorsport Cat-back.

I was expecting about 185bhp but it didn't get anywhere near that.

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for a comparison we need someone with a standard 182,to go to the same place(or has been)..the figures are very disappointing, not even to get the standard 182 figures.. I know its hard to get extra power from the engine,you would expect 185 to 190 really.. with all the mods
a clio 182 specialist told me,some of the engines are not as good as others..but not so bad.. must be something wrong with the engine...who last did the belts? I had my belts done last week..they said my old timing was 95% correct, the car does feel abit faster now..

 

[R3k1355]

No, they were called 182 as they were supposed to produce 182ps, which is 179.5bhp.

Same with the 172, 197 & 200

The official power figure for the 182 taken from the Clio trophy factory brochure.
2.0 16V (132kW/182CH)
182 CH if a French power rating.
132kw = 177.015 British horsepower
http://www.cliotrophy.ch/trophy.htm

So you car has 5.515 hp less than the official Renault figure.

Ah rite now I understand, I'd always thought the book figure was 177(ish) which isn't quite 182ps, so just figured that since Peugeot had the 180 Renault wanted "Two more"

 

[flebay]

@flebay Never knew the 182 was a CH figure.. Good to know :up:

So its roughly down 5BHP but the peak torque figure is 157Ftlb which I think is more than standard?

At end of day it's an 11 year old engine and I haven't done any drastic power modifications so I suppose I can't really complain.

The official torque is 200Nm = 147.51242986 Ft lb so you have a extra 9.48757014 Ft lb

 

[klm182]

Yeah it's mapped pal. 167bhp standard 171bhp after map at RS Tuning.

I did a full service in August last year and I also did another Oil change in October after a track day. Had belts and dephaser done in September last year at DDC Doncaster. I only use V-Power too nothing else goes in the tank.

Redex? As far as I'm aware that's the most overrated gash product ever.

Yeah it's mapped pal. 167bhp standard 171bhp after map at RS Tuning.

I did a full service in August last year and I also did another Oil change in October after a track day. Had belts and dephaser done in September last year at DDC Doncaster. I only use V-Power too nothing else goes in the tank.

Redex? As far as I'm aware that's the most overrated gash product ever.

what would a clio 1.2 produce at the wheels? 20 bhp.. ha ha.. am getting my car tested,if mine is 137 at the wheels, even with no mods,am selling it,getting a mini cooper s..ha has anyone heard off DDC in Doncaster?

 

[JamesBryan]

The official torque is 200Nm = 147.51242986 Ft lb so you have a extra 9.48757014 Ft lb

Really? Mine is pretty decent then.

179bhp 160ft/lb

 

[klm182]

is y

Really? Mine is pretty decent then.

179bhp 160ft/lb

is that with a standard engine?

 

[JamesBryan]

is y

is that with a standard engine?

The actual engine is yes, but it does have an exhaust and decat with the RSTuner 98 RON map :tonguewink:

 

[klm182]

isn't rolling roads a false environment ,cause no test will be conducted ,with the same ambient temperature,unless its a sealed controlled room..and in the real world we don't drive in shinny metal rollers,what is your tyres slips..wont that give false readings .flywheel power means nothing,its what goes to the wheels that counts,some cars might lose 20% from flywheel to wheels, other might be 15%. rear wheel drive cars will be even more...the question is how to a reduce the power loss to the wheels?. Energy cant be created ,just transferred,
Don't manufactures bench test their engines for bph,and don't use a rolling road?thats why they don't publish bhp to the wheels.. what if you tested the same engine on a bench,then fit it to a car,then did a rolling road test,would the bhp figures be the same?

 

[R3k1355]

No the bench test would be more accurate there's tons of variables with a rolling road test, it's more a general idea of the power and abit of a look at how that power is delivered, and the AFR (if you're interested) over the rev range.

It's a good tuning tool and alrite for pub BHP banter, but not definitive at all.

 

[klm182]

No the bench test would be more accurate there's tons of variables with a rolling road test, it's more a general idea of the power and abit of a look at how that power is delivered, and the AFR (if you're interested) over the rev range.

It's a good tuning tool and alrite for pub BHP banter, but not definitive at all.

I know the bench test is more accurate, am saying rolling road tests cant all the same, they depend of so many difference factors ..one day your car may be tested at 170bhp,next day maybe 175bhp....is it worth all the messing and cost ,getting all mods for an extra 7 or 8 bhp at the wheels?.. Renault has got the most you can get, out of the engine anyway...so why bother?..

 

[clarkey*]

Yeah it's mapped pal. 167bhp standard 171bhp after map at RS Tuning.

I did a full service in August last year and I also did another Oil change in October after a track day. Had belts and dephaser done in September last year at DDC Doncaster. I only use V-Power too nothing else goes in the tank.

Redex? As far as I'm aware that's the most overrated gash product ever.

Don't worrie, mine also mad 168 at rstuning, with decat, port matched, k&n, but on track it leaves other clios out of corners with its torque, I've heard that rstuning leeds produce very accurate figures, if you won't big numbers take it to another rolling road and see it make 180+

 

[RichieJA]

Yeah it's mapped pal. 167bhp standard 171bhp after map at RS Tuning.

I did a full service in August last year and I also did another Oil change in October after a track day. Had belts and dephaser done in September last year at DDC Doncaster. I only use V-Power too nothing else goes in the tank.

Redex? As far as I'm aware that's the most overrated gash product ever.

Nope redex works, always going to get people that bash every product but for 2 quid its worth a go, last test I seen made a 4hp difference on a v6 golf
I bet if you take it to another rolling road it will get a different result. They are very inaccurate.

 

[McGherkin]

If I'm honest looking at the numbers I'm pretty disappointed but once I'm in the car driving it I'm over the moon with how it feels and the mid range torque which it gained is very noticeable. Got Blyton and Cadwell booked for March and April so looking forward to that and seeing how much the cars improved as the last time I went on track in September it was totally standard. :up:

Simplest advice is forget the numbers. If it pulls well and isn't obviously down on power, it's fine. Enjoy it!

Redex? As far as I'm aware that's the most overrated gash product ever.

Yep.

what would a clio 1.2 produce at the wheels? 20 bhp.. ha ha.. am getting my car tested,if mine is 137 at the wheels, even with no mods,am selling it,getting a mini cooper s..ha has anyone heard off DDC in Doncaster?

Mine produced a whopping 45.0bhp ATW. 1.2 8v.

isn't rolling roads a false environment ,cause no test will be conducted ,with the same ambient temperature,unless its a sealed controlled room..and in the real world we don't drive in shinny metal rollers,what is your tyres slips..wont that give false readings .flywheel power means nothing,its what goes to the wheels that counts,some cars might lose 20% from flywheel to wheels, other might be 15%. rear wheel drive cars will be even more...the question is how to a reduce the power loss to the wheels?. Energy cant be created ,just transferred,
Don't manufactures bench test their engines for bph,and don't use a rolling road?thats why they don't publish bhp to the wheels.. what if you tested the same engine on a bench,then fit it to a car,then did a rolling road test,would the bhp figures be the same?

To an extent, yes.

However, depending on the dyno, the transmission losses are factored in, and runs with wheelspin are discounted. The temperature is also accounted for (and a lot of the time this is how dyno operators fake figures), and so on. They're not that inaccurate when set up right. But rarely are they set up right - my 172 apparently made 181bhp after corrections. The measured figure was 185!

But you're right in saying that the only power that matters is power ATW, but unfortunately car manufacturers will insist on measuring power ATF and everyone compares their cars to stock power figures of other cars and therefore everyone just uses fly horsepower.

 

[Bear Head]

Mine made 182.8 bhp and nearly 165 ft lbs on Pauls Rollers, clio 182 with janspeed sports cat, scorpion cat back and ktec ind kit.

He seemed surprised how much it made.

171 isn't so bad, I'd of expected higher though tbh

 

[Bear Head]

what would a clio 1.2 produce at the wheels? 20 bhp.. ha ha.. am getting my car tested,if mine is 137 at the wheels, even with no mods,am selling it,getting a mini cooper s..ha has anyone heard off DDC in Doncaster?

DDC in Doncaster are a brilliant garage. They seriously know their s**t, you only need look at what cars they drive to know that. They're all I use, they timed mine up and did a belt change and mine made 182.8 bhp on Pauls Rollers.

 

[klm182]

DDC in Doncaster are a brilliant garage. They seriously know their s**t, you only need look at what cars they drive to know that. They're all I use, they timed mine up and did a belt change and mine made 182.8 bhp on Pauls Rollers.

DDC in Doncaster are a brilliant garage. They seriously know their s**t, you only need look at what cars they drive to know that. They're all I use, they timed mine up and did a belt change and mine made 182.8 bhp on Pauls Rollers.

my granny drives a bugatti Veyron,i wouldn't let her near my belts... what's a mechanics car ,got to do with his mechanical skills/knowledge?. Normally good mechanics drive rubbish cars,they cant be bothered working on their own...

 

[gambit]

Run an oil catch tank, does your car produce any blow by, check you intake. Also throw out the aircon, a/c systems place a not insignificant amount of drag on the engine, you don't need it anyway

 

[Bear Head]

my granny drives a bugatti Veyron,i wouldn't let her near my belts... what's a mechanics car ,got to do with his mechanical skills/knowledge?. Normally good mechanics drive rubbish cars,they cant be bothered working on their own...

Well, they're both ex renault mechanics, they race a fully fettled clio 182 and he has a fully forged nyon racecar megane with near 400 bhp, guess that shows they know quite a bit.

Why you acting like a prick?

 

[klm182]

Well, they're both ex renault mechanics, they race a fully fettled clio 182 and he has a fully forged nyon racecar megane with near 400 bhp, guess that shows they know quite a bit.

Why you acting like a prick?

a few on here from near Doncaster way, go to dan in Nottingham,they must drive past DDC ...DDC must be a hidden gem then.. guess when you find someone good,you don't like to change...

 

[Bear Head]

a few on here from near Doncaster way, go to dan in Nottingham,they must drive past DDC ...DDC must be a hidden gem then.. guess when you find someone good,you don't like to change...

They're seriously a hidden gem, they know every single nut and bolt on a clio or megane, they're massively renowned specialists. Every time I go there's several sports in, 197's 200's, everything.

I couldn't rate them any higher. Their pricing and professionalism is impeccable and the only reason you wouldn't go is because you don't know about it.

 

[klm182]

They're seriously a hidden gem, they know every single nut and bolt on a clio or megane, they're massively renowned specialists. Every time I go there's several sports in, 197's 200's, everything.

I couldn't rate them any higher. Their pricing and professionalism is impeccable and the only reason you wouldn't go is because you don't know about it.

I wouldn't go its to far..if its on your door step ,you've laughing...guess if you are good,you don't have to advertise ..there are some cowboys out there,who have wrenched a few 182s timing..3 on here in the last 3 months....

 

[Bear Head]

I wouldn't go its to far..if its on your door step ,you've laughing...guess if you are good,you don't have to advertise ..there are some cowboys out there,who have wrenched a few 182s timing..3 on here in the last 3 months....

Yeah they're 35 mins from me.

As I say, they're renault specialists, proper good lads.

My car made 183 bhp after they'd timed it, stronger than any I've seen so they've clearly done it right

 

[bashracing]

I want a picture of Granny's Veyron

 

[McGherkin]

I want a picture of Granny's Veyron

It's under the surface.