Silverstone this weekend Clio 182 lost...

[mr_merc]

Hoped the title would capture some views into this thread.

I havent posted on here much, if at all to be honest but have met both roamer and yoz, and truth be told if I had the money Id consider a 172 as a better alternative to my Punto GT.

Just interested really and wondered what your opinions were, and honest opinions if you will as well!

I have read that last weekend a standard clio 182 raced at Silverstone during the trax festival. I have also read that someone, with coilovers and 180 bhp @ flywheel, about 1000 kgs all up, beat said clio 182 on the straight above 80 mph and comfortably beat him around the corners.

I bit my tongue because it will seem like I am putting him down, and I have to be honest have only raced a 172 in mine and never driven either 182 or 172, but is this really feasible? The punto driver isnt a bad one, but doesnt have much if any real track experience and apparently the 182 was standard. I would have thought even a standard 182 would outhandle a punto, decent driver or not.

Lend me your thoughts!

Regards

 

[182_blue]

13 July 2004
1 Posts

in fact you have never posted before

im not really sure what your getting at, and if you dont say what car beat it how can we give you an opinion

 

[Tom]

Was this out on the track?

 

[Illusion]

Quote: Originally posted by 172cup_nut on 06 September 2004


13 July 2004
1 Posts

in fact you have never posted before

im not really sure what your getting at, and if you dont say what car beat it how can we give you an opinion

Maybe in off topic he has...

 

[mr_merc]

Beg your anal pardon, sorry I havent posted before. I considered buying a valver before I bought the gt, but having raced yoz around bthorpe in the gt I know I made the right choice!

Apologies. Back on topic now?

 

[Lee]

IMO the Punto would need to be heavily modified to comfortably beat the 182. Having had track time myself yesterday even an Evo 8 doesnt have the sort of power advantage to breeze past you on the straight. The Tommi Makkinnen edition on the other hand made short work of me. LOL

I spent my time sat behind a CTR. There was nothing in it. Had he not been in front of me I think I could have pulled a little on him as he wasnt braking as late or cornering as hard as I was, but once we got onto the straights it was stale mate.

The two of use passed a 2.0 litre Corsa, this gave is problems on the straights but was in the way when slowing and cornering, he realised this and moved over to let us passed.

Great fun though.

 

[182_blue]

Quote: Originally posted by mr_merc on 06 September 2004


Beg your anal pardon, sorry I havent posted before. I considered buying a valver before I bought the gt, but having raced yoz around bthorpe in the gt I know I made the right choice!

Apologies. Back on topic now?

thats ok, thx for the appology

 

[Illusion]

A mate of mine has a GT, and these things have quite a bit or low down torque...about 145 and 3000rpms iirc...

We havent raced eachother yet down the pod, but im sure itll be close...round the twisties tho, down on paper the 172/Cup should be better, the only thing I hate mechanically about the punto is its handling...the amount of times weve lowered/raised/adjusted his suspension is a joke...but these things can easily get 180 brake especially with this seb chip so I hear...

 

[mr_merc]

This was on the track, 20 mins for £25 or something.

Yellow gt, superleggeras, coilovers, road tyres, 180 bhp, 170 lb/ft.

I am genuinely interested in what you think, this isnt a thread for flaming or anything. Id just been led to believe 172s were excellent, handling unsurpassed (indeed the gf owned one at one point) and the 182 was the new pretender and thus took on and improved on the 172. As said, this isnt a wind up, and Im all for praising my car but I think on a track Id get killed by one.

they may be quicker on a 1/4 mile, but they arent round a track. went to silverstone today, and had 20minutes track time. It was awesome, you really do get a massive buzz.

anyway this 182, was in front of me, i was on his arse through a corner, came to a straight, he pulls to the right which is track day indication that i can overtake on the left but he was defintely still going for it, and i edged past him at about 80mph. was proper chuffed, i carried on, but he went slower through the corners.

 

[Lee]

Not everyone on track was pushing it, a couple of our guys admitted to pottering around. I just went hell for leather.

Any idea what colour the Clio was?

 

[mr_merc]

Dont know what colour the 182 was to be honest. Just intrigued as to whether this is reasonable. I understand the basis of good driver in bad car vs bad driver in good car, but surely the gap in cornerning between the two (forgetting torque and straight line acceleration) is significant enough that he would have had to be one armed and lacking in vision?

Dont know then. Yes, they can develop good torque and power from very few mods. Seb2 chip being one of them. I run a gt with seb2 chip, side exhaust (no cat, no silencer, shorter exhaust), filter, bleed, intercooler and would guess at a reliable 170+ bhp (135+ @ wheels) and 170 lb/ft torque, yet against a decent driver on the 1/4 mile in a 182 Id be concerned at least, on the corners I dont think Id bother, hence my interest.

 

[Lagerlout]

Hmm... I would imagine your car to handle quite well on coilovers.... It has similar power to the 182, has more torque and is lighter - cant see why your so surprised at the outcome.!!

All I can say is that the 182 driver was not realeasing the cars full potential through the corners. Go drive one and see what its like (mut have Cup suspension!!)

Having said that, I would assume that the difference would not be enough for him to cruise past at 80mph. You need a great deal of power to breeze past a car at those kind of speeds.....

Perhaps his car was still fairly new/tight and he didnt want to give it his all??

Guess well never know...

 

[Chad]

A mate of mine has a punto running over 170 bhp on a good day. Weve had a couple of blasts with me in my 172 and if anything it was over 80mph that the 172 started to leave the punto. Very close up until then though, for the money he has spent he has a very quick mota the only thing he doesnt like is that the cars power is really affected by the weather and somedays has no where near 170bhp.

 

[jon_r]

I would imagine if you spent a similar amount of money on a 182 as has been spent on the Punto, coilovers etc the 182 would be a fairly substantial step up in performance.

 

[Mondial172]

Ohhh a Heavy modded Turbo charged light little car against a standard 182.

Correct if Im wrong but a Punto GT as standard isnt miles quicker than a 182 (about the same as a VTS?). Your car should be pretty dam quick with all them mods. Cant see you passing that quickly if the 182 driver was on the gas.

Has it crossed youre mind that the 182 is pretty new and mite not quite fully run it yet. I know my cousins 19000 cup is alot more responsive than my 2500 Cup.

 

[cup'id]

I raced (a little) against a yellow punto gt at trax on sunday. He was quite quick round the corners, which i wasnt suprised about as I think most reasonably quick hot hatches will perform very similar tbh. I was suprised tough how easliy I pulled away from him oout of the corners into the straights.

 

[paddymph]

i raced loads of cars (mostly straight line).

as someone has said, u need BIG power to breeze past these quick clios at 80.

my mates 20VT does it, a mitsi GTO did it and im struggling to think of other cars that did??? oh and a 911 once, that goes without saying tho....

 

[Dave]

Hello Jimma lad. (Mr_Merc)

Surely your not STILL loving the Punto GT.

 

[CTR_Paul]

1.)His GT has ~170bhp, not 180bhp, it seems to have gained 10bhp jumping from PSC to here !

2.)He pulls to the right which is track day indication that i can overtake on the left but he was defintely still going for it, and i edged past him at about 80mph.

EDGED not flew past like he was driving a Austin Maxi !

3.) Hes been on plenty of track days !

 

[Lagerlout]

Bothered. Puntos are w**k anyway, fast or not.

And how did he know he was definitely going for it?

 

[msouthall]

Hi im the non-experienced punto driver. It was like a light burgundy / dark pink 182, id really like the owners perspective if he is on here.

Im not disputing the fact that 182s are better cars, im just chuffed than my 3k sh*tbox held its own against something far more expensive. comments at will.

p.s Jimma you should be a racing driver

 

[Dave]

I have to say...these Punto GT porkies do go on some...

 

[Tucks]

I was out on the trak on sun(9.am session)There were at least 2 punto gts out with me (yellow and black)Didnt come accross the yellow one,it may have bin you?But was dueling with the black one all the way,norght in-it on the straights-not one bit.Im sure I was cornering faster than him though and I aint a quick driver at all,I have no major mods and I dont think I would be as quick as a 182.Had a quick natter with the lad drivin the GT(Top bloke!)and he says he had about 170bhp,He was highly amused by the height my wheel was coming off the ground at times!Ne-way I think a182 would have been quicker.............

 

[McBunny]

why are we suprised this car that has more power per ton than the clio and is on coilovers could pass the clio :s

granted the punto is a sh*t box but hey the clio aint much better

 

[007]

The 182 is set up for the road is it not? British type roads at that.

As far as I know (Focus RS excepted) most hot hatches are set up for A & B roads by the makers and not tracks. I think the Focus spent most development on the track and good german roads which is why its so quick on track.

I agree with DM - I cannot see why the punto on coilovers cannot be quicker. You could probably get something like a MK1 Fiesta with some track mods to go quicker on track than a standard 182 if you wanted - depending on the track i supposed.

 

[GarvGT]

Tucks I think that was you I was tailing. Not much in it on the straights but I was suprised how slow the Williams was for a 2l.

Nice to see you had it on 3 wheels on one of the corners

Who was the light blue clio that stacked it into the gravel trap at copse? Ahahahaha

 

[McBunny]

are you just here to annoy people ?

 

[Tucks]

Youve got more power than me!!GarvIve got 150bhp.

 

[GarvGT]

Who moi?

Just trying to see who I was up against, put ya dummy back in

 

[Max172cup]

Cant be arsed to read all this through, but ok you beat a standard 182 to in a heavily modified Punto! Whats to comment on? You ask is this normal, well anything thats been modified to any degree will beat something slightly better standard. there are modified 172s/Cups and 182s on here beating standard scoobs. There are modified Valvers beating Williams, and other cars.

You cant compare a modified car to a standard car, it just doesnt work like that. A car that has similar power ( and a lot more torque) plus modified suspensions is going to be the same or slightly better than a car with the same power and standard dampers and springs.

Not flaming you, but what do you want from us? Do you want a small ticker tape parade, a party in your honour at the next clio sport meet or something equally as stupid?

Heres a hearty well done in your modified Punto, congrats for pulling on the straights! Just wait till you come up against a heavily modified 172/Cup/Williams/Valver/1.2/182/1.6/1.4/etc

 

[Mike@Rentech]

If he was on about my car (182 wheels), Im not suprised, I totally sh*t it!! and let everything pass me
1st time I have ever been on a track, look forward to doing it again and maybe try harder and not worry so much....and yes before you say it Im a PUSSY!!!

 

[CTR_Paul]

Quote: Originally posted by Max172cup on 06 September 2004




Not flaming you, but what do you want from us? Do you want a small ticker tape parade, a party in your honour at the next clio sport meet or something equally as stupid?

He doesnt want anything from you.... Mr_Merc seems to want some kind of f**king appreciation society though !

 

[msouthall]

oh dear its degenerated.

 

[Toypop]

Quote: Originally posted by msouthall on 06 September 2004


Hi im the non-experienced punto driver. It was like a light burgundy / dark pink 182, id really like the owners perspective if he is on here.

Im not disputing the fact that 182s are better cars, im just chuffed than my 3k sh*tbox held its own against something far more expensive. comments at will.

p.s Jimma you should be a racing driver






Er? It wasnt a 182. Probably a 1.2 Dynamique with 2.0 badges, they are very common.

 

[littleone]

yep it 1.0

 

[badinvincible]

....and we wonder why we want Driving Tales scrapped.

 

[-Leigh-]

For £14k odd, I expect better performance than what the 182 delivers. Test drove one and walked away laughing at it. Got back in the GT and damn she felt quick!

 

[mr_merc]

On the contrary paul, I wasnt looking for flaming, it was a genuine question. I didnt want to discuss it on the psc site as youd get the usual bigging up of a gt (as well you know, btw what would you have said to me if I said Id beaten a ctr on a track?), so I asked a reasonable question on here of people who know what a 182 is and isnt capable of.

I couldnt understand how, as msouthall describes it, "a 3k sh*tbox" would beat a 182 around the corners, and lose above 80 mph which is where the 2.0 engine should have a higher top end. I thought this was a interesting thread, and for what its worth I agree with the comment that its good a 3k car can get near a 14k car.

 

[RobFenn]

Ill echo what people have been saying, with the money spent, the Punto is bound to be quicker. You have more grip, and a better power to weight ratio...plus all the variables you have with driving.

With the exception of xzibit (who cant appreciate what good dynamics are) the Punto drivers have been fine on this thread, no need for Cliosporters to get defensive!

-Rob

 

[McBunny]

exactly rob !!

the 182 isnt slow but will drive completely different to a turbocharged car !!!! so it will seem slower