Some reckless driving-172,R32,S2,Z3 M

Justin182 · Oct 21, 2005

French motorway race: 172 sounds pretty sweet at start and seems rapid... would like to know what the camera car is. Wouldnt watch it all as it gets a bit boring...

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=2644358103618235467&q=Audi

Aust1n · Oct 21, 2005

Its got lexus lights.. boooooooooooo

wozzaa · Oct 21, 2005

Camera car had a volkswagon dash anyways.

Neil82 · Oct 21, 2005

It's the R32 i'd imagine.

Neil82 · Oct 21, 2005

Is that a Rover 200 coupe turbo?

Justin182 · Oct 21, 2005

^^^ R32 was filmed next to it though.... and the 172 beat the camera car from rolling start of about 40mph... and although 172s are fast, not as fast as a R32 on the move. Oh, and the dash looked quite dated and was red back lite where there R32 is blue.

Justin182 · Oct 21, 2005

Neil82cup said:
Is that a Rover 200 coupe turbo?

Yeah.. looked like it. Blo*dy Rapid!!!

Neil82 · Oct 21, 2005

Justin182 said:
^^^ R32 was filmed next to it though.... and the 172 beat the camera car from rolling start of about 40mph... and although 172s are fast, not as fast as a R32 on the move. Oh, and the dash looked quite dated and was red back lite where there R32 is blue.

That 172 was modded though, I know my modded 172 would rip a standard R32 a new one.

jon_r · Oct 21, 2005

Neil82cup said:
Is that a Rover 200 coupe turbo?

yep, lol! Cheap bhp.

Justin182 · Oct 22, 2005

Neil82cup said:
That 172 was modded though, I know my modded 172 would rip a standard R32 a new one.

I see.... never been in a R32 but put my foot down at around 70mph next to one and it moves so presumed if standard would win hands down... yours must be pretty heavily modded then.

Alan · Oct 22, 2005

Neil82cup said:
That 172 was modded though, I know my modded 172 would rip a standard R32 a new one.

Doudt it ^^

Mondial172 · Oct 22, 2005

Just had a blat with an R32 in my Cup and no way did it rip me a new a**ehole! Was a tiny bit quicker once the speed was up. The golf after all is a heavy lump a launch off the line.

Bloke looked confused he didn't leave my little cheap clio standing.

Phill1978 · Oct 22, 2005

Adamf said:
Just had a blat with an R32 in my Cup and no way did it rip me a new a**ehole! Was a tiny bit quicker once the speed was up. The golf after all is a heavy lump a launch off the line.

Bloke looked confused he didn't leave my little cheap clio standing.

agree almost the same experience for me too up top they start to pull as that 3.2 takes bigger gulps of air but is also then blunted by its boxy shape after 105mph and the clio is too unstable beyond 125mph unless modified.

id say upto a point nothing worth noting in terms of accelaration, interesting though how a mates focus RS blue fin, full stainless, dump valve (cheesy but keeps boost preassure) pulls past my cup very smoothly as if normally overtaking but this is at 90mph up to then theres little in it with a few mods my cup will be back on par.

chris n nic will tell you how a basic modded cup can keep up with 250bhp saloons due to power to weight. usually if you look at the list of mods some cars get i.e turbo cars = uprated intercoolers $$$, full exhaust $$, remap $, blow-off valve $$ S-AFC Fuel Controller $$$ electric pump and reservoir $$ brakes for all that extra power $$$$ (usually because the stock ones arent upto scratch) Coilovers $$$ etc.. etc..

cup, no back seats free, bucket seats £180 each 6.5Kg. Decat, induction + remap = v.fast 1/4mile times 0-60 5.7 from 170 to 184bhp weight = 985kg`s

cup with 4-2-1 manifold, cams = fromt 170bhp to 195-198bhp weight 980kg (lighter exhaust than stock usually) = 200 BHP PER TONNE <

no laughing stock in anyones eyes, its been said a lightly stripped cup at 980kg with 205-210bhp will keep with a 280bhp saloon.. surley fast enough for a shopping trolley.

so a 1500+ kg r32 with 241 hp wont be much trouble for a cup with 190bhp let alone a stripped one.

all my opinion, i could be way out, but i know 241hp + awd trans loss + awd weigh gain + boxy shape + huge kerb weight doesnt equal massive accelaration even if its really pushing 250bhp.

Phill1978 · Oct 22, 2005

.. well not enough to tear a cup a new asshole anyway

Neil82 · Oct 22, 2005

16vClio said:
Doudt it ^^

Ya rekon? Did a 14.2@101 before I fitted the Maxogen and have seen R32's 1/4 mile and they are quick off the line but have no balls mid range. I stand by the fact my car would rip a standard R32 a new one.

Justin182 · Oct 22, 2005

just looked at the vid again and i have changed my mind as to what the camera car is....think Neil82cup was right. In the first clip of the clio, it looks to be a silver golf, but then later on the camera must change hands as that golf was filmed.... so that 172 nailled the R32..nice one!!!

Justin182 · Oct 22, 2005

^^^ humm... however, maybe it wasnt an R32 and just an imitation??

Justin182 · Oct 22, 2005

If you go to about 47 seconds into the clip and look to the other side of the 172...it looks like a V6 in the background. Can see the side vent.... they put their foot down and the 172 still wins..... interesting!!!

The Hoff · Oct 22, 2005

Hmm and here was me thinking it might be a Corrado VR6 :s

Towards the end though the camera car got to 270kph/180mph so whatever it is, its got good top end too

BigChris · Oct 22, 2005

justin is right... but not 100%... if you look in the background you can see a V6.. correct, and it is pulling on the 172... then suddenly it falls out of pictures, and a few seconds later you see why, as there is a slow moving car in the V6s lane...

not that i watched it much

Justin182 · Oct 22, 2005

BigChris said:
justin is right... but not 100%... if you look in the background you can see a V6.. correct, and it is pulling on the 172... then suddenly it falls out of pictures, and a few seconds later you see why, as there is a slow moving car in the V6s lane... not that i watched it much

Well spotted!!...... yeah, watched it again and see what you mean.... another silver car gets in the way. V6 did start pulling away about 5 seconds

Big G · Oct 23, 2005

*pats his Z3 M Roadster*

Dan@SJM · Oct 23, 2005

meggerman said:
id say upto a point nothing worth noting in terms of accelaration, interesting though how a mates focus RS blue fin, full stainless, dump valve (cheesy but keeps boost preassure)

No it doesnt.
A dump valve dumps boost pressure as is suggested by the name.

Dan@SJM · Oct 23, 2005

also a 4-2-1 manifold and cams DONT gain 20 odd bhp. i do hope your not one of these peope who see 5bhp gain on the side of a k+n box, and think oo my 172 is now 177.

Chris n nic · Oct 23, 2005

I think he is right in what he is saying m8...the dumpvalve keeps the turbo from stalling so suppose it is keeping the pressure up between gear changes...I think lol

Chris

Dan@SJM · Oct 23, 2005

the turbo will never stall. Dont forget that it is spinning at 20,000+ rpm on tick over. And jsut because the throttle is closed, doesnt mean that the turbo stops, the exhaust gasses will still be going out, thus still spinning the fan. The only time a turbo stalls is when the exhausr gases do, so, that'll be when the engine has stopped then.

Im working with turbos everyday, hence my knowledge of them.

Phill1978 · Oct 23, 2005

Danlp6 said:
the turbo will never stall. Dont forget that it is spinning at 20,000+ rpm on tick over. And jsut because the throttle is closed, doesnt mean that the turbo stops, the exhaust gasses will still be going out, thus still spinning the fan. The only time a turbo stalls is when the exhausr gases do, so, that'll be when the engine has stopped then.

Im working with turbos everyday, hence my knowledge of them.

yup my bad i meant the other way round lol

and yes i do think 20hp is possible from 4-2-1 sportcat, induction, cams + smt6 so 170 to 190hp in fact id wager that would be spot on.

Paul J · Oct 23, 2005

The idea is to keep the turbo spinning by expelling the pressure in the inlet, thus when you open the throttle in the next gear lag is reduced, assuming the revs are above the boost threshold of the turbo.

Without a dump/re-curc valve the boost remains but the dense air in the inlet greatly reduces the speed of the turbo. Chatter is created

In practice no dump valve is better for lag! New turbos (GT series) are too fragile to be run without a dump valve as the strain on the impellor blades is too much.

General opinion is that the Focus RS should be run with either dump or re-circ.

Dan@SJM · Oct 23, 2005

meggerman said:
yup my bad i meant the other way round lol

and yes i do think 20hp is possible from 4-2-1 sportcat, induction, cams + smt6 so 170 to 190hp in fact id wager that would be spot on.

ah, i mis interprted your post, i read it as just a manifold and cams, what you list there is good for 20bhp.

EvoCarl · Oct 23, 2005

Danlp6 said:
meggerman said:

id say upto a point nothing worth noting in terms of accelaration, interesting though how a mates focus RS blue fin, full stainless, dump valve (cheesy but keeps boost preassure)

No it doesnt.
A dump valve dumps boost pressure as is suggested by the name.

Click to expand...

actually thats kind of wrong.

A leaky dumpvalve or one with a soft spring setting will leak boost= not keeping boost pressure.

Dan@SJM · Oct 23, 2005

EvoCarl said:
Danlp6 said:

actually thats kind of wrong.

A leaky dumpvalve or one with a soft spring setting will leak boost= not keeping boost pressure.

Click to expand...

Depends when, I am talking about on deaccelaration, so the dump valve has been actuated, but yes you are right, on accelaration its closed, so its a sealed system.

But what i was saying, is that it doesnt keep boost pressure up in gear changes,as it dumps it. But as Paulj said, the fins on the turbos are more brittle now days, so yes there is a need for them, but the waste gate opens on gear changes aswell, to help prevent damage.

Paul J · Oct 23, 2005

the waste gate opens on gear changes aswell, to help prevent damage

Pls explain. My thoughts are that the wastegate is controlled by the actuator which opens at a set pressure, there are no means the wastegate could be opened without boost pressure.

Even then all the wastegate does is to allow excess exhaust gas to bypass the turbo.

EvoCarl · Oct 23, 2005

How would a wastegate open on a gear change? (no throttle/pressure)

Theres no boost on a gear change so no pressure reaching the actuator and the wastegate would be closed.

EvoCarl · Oct 23, 2005

Paul J said:
Pls explain. My thoughts are that the wastegate is controlled by the actuator which opens at a set pressure, there are no means the wastegate could be opened without boost pressure.

Even then all the wastegate does is to allow excess exhaust gas to bypass the turbo.

bleh beat me to it

Dan@SJM · Oct 23, 2005

the waste gate is operated by an actuator which operates on boost pressure AND vacuum, so on deaccelaration the waste gate is opened, not as much as when set boost is achieved, but i also sisnt say that it completly bypasses the turbo, otherwise that would contradict what i said about the turbo not stalling.

Paul J · Oct 23, 2005

Dan, how could boost be built up if at idle the wastegate is open due to the vacuum? They only work one way, try blowing/sucking (no jokes

) a weak actuator.

Dan@SJM · Oct 23, 2005

so, all the stuff that university/turbo technics has taught me is wrong?

Paul J · Oct 23, 2005

:S How do you start getting boost tho if the wastegate is open?

Dan@SJM · Oct 23, 2005

as there is next to no vacuum when the throttle is open.

I think its going to be best to agree to disagree, im going to continuwe to believe what ive been taught, and you, also seem knowledgeable, so you will keep believing what you have also been taught.

Paul J · Oct 23, 2005

Cheers Dan, wasnt an agument, genuinely interested if i was wrong. Just what ive learn from my old car:

Some reckless driving-172,R32,S2,Z3 M

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