Test drive 172 - brakes underwhelming - is this common?

[traceline]

Hi everyone - first post for me - please be gentle

Long story short - I took a 172 for a test drive yesterday and whilst the car was a great example (quick!) I was v. disappointed in the brake performance.

On closer inspection it looks like there's drilled and grooved all round with pads that look relatively new (either that or the things been valeted to the point where the brake pad backs are all shiny and black again). Dealer who took it on PX says he's unaware of a pad change, so maybe the previous owner chucked a pair of halfords specials in to get it sold?

To describe the brakes - there was v.little initial bite - however it did slow down ok (eventually) - I was just expecting a lot more "immediacy" to proceedings and there was a bit of brake-cooking smell at the end of the drive (tho I was giving it some, so that maybe not an issue).

I did have a '54 cooper s which was afflicted with a similar prob - the calipers were too small for the power of the car - and this felt v.similar. Given that it was one of the reasons I got rid of the mcs I don't want to go through that again.

SO! Can anyone comment on the general braking experience I should expect? Does this sound normal? Is there a magic bullet solution to this ("get ferrodo ds's and you'll be fine")? I've got no probs putting £1-200 into getting it right, I just need a little confirmation that this is do-able.

Any comments (no matter how short/unscientific) would be massively appreciated.

Cheers!

Andy

 

[Stu_350z]

Not sure about normal 172s but the Cup has great braking as soon as you touch the pedal

but they do have diff systems i believe??

 

[Vish]

Maybe brand new pads? They would need time to get up to standard. My standard pads have been fine.

I had DS2500s, more than you'll need for road driving IMO. And I wouldn't hesitate to put them on any other car as I loved having that stopping ability either when driving fast or in case of an emergency.

 

[Turkish]

Sounds fairly normal RS models aren't heavily assisted like the smaller engined variants. Gives you a lot more feel and opportunity to modulate the braking pressure however some people don't like it. They're perfectly capable of slowing the car very quickly however you'll have to apply a decent amount of pressure to get them to haul the car up or lock the wheels.

 

[black_sunrise]

i have standard 172 brakes with mintex pads... they arnt amazing by any stretch but they are adequate. Mine do bite pretty well initially. They were a LOT better when i changed the brake fluid though, before this they were either on or off but now you can feel a lot better.

 

[Xanda73]

I have drilled and grooved discs, and mine stop very well. So much that a friend who has a fiesta st asked why they were so much better than his. Maybe they need bleeding?

 

[MarkCup]

Forget thoughts about the calipers being to small for the car...the Cup race cars run standard calipers. There are 4-pot options, but most stick with standard.

Braided lines, a good fresh fluid, Brembo HC discs, and standard pads are more than adequate on the road.

For mild track use, DS2500s should cover you.

For heavier track use there's a few alternatives, I like Pagid Blues myself although the Carbone Lorraines are worth a look.

 

[Joe R26]

I'd say the initial bite on my 182 is excellent. Infact when I first got it I kept slamming them on by accident because they were so much more sensitive than my old car.

 

[MikeoftheQuays]

Sounds fairly normal RS models aren't heavily assisted like the smaller engined variants. Gives you a lot more feel and opportunity to modulate the braking pressure however some people don't like it. They're perfectly capable of slowing the car very quickly however you'll have to apply a decent amount of pressure to get them to haul the car up or lock the wheels.

This is my experience. They feel almost weak at first but stand on em and they'll stop you alrighty.

 

[DrR]

I think they are pretty poor, have to really stomp on them to get them to work.

 

[sideways danny]

poor brakes is normally down to poorly maintained calipers or incorrectly fitted pads. Calipers, sliders, pads etc all need to be able to move, quite often the can't and you need a large pry bar to get old pads out. Fluid change helps too, and making sure servo vacuum line is in good condition

 

[traceline]

Great comments - thanks guys!

So - am taking away from this that a) they don't sound too outlandishly different from the rest out there (which is good, was concerned that I was looking @ a pup) and b) there are options around hoses, discs, pads, fluid that will change the characteristics that am feeling (without going big brake brembos) - maybe a caliper overhaul, plus renewing of the disposables could work wonders.

 

[welshname]

take it for another test drive and try left foot braking. lets see how crappy the brakes are then lol

 

[traceline]

That's a cracking idea rhys - I've been meaning to learn that side of things for a while anyway

 

[welshname]

That's a cracking idea rhys - I've been meaning to learn that side of things for a while anyway

cracking because you will end up through the windscreen. dont go fast the first time. youll regret it.

 

[traceline]

Will do - thanks

 

[Rob669]

Drilled and grooved discs will be non standard. Standard front discs from Brembo (high carbon ones) cost about £50 a pair - I'd replace the front discs personally with these, fit the brake lines MarkCup suggested and standard OEM pads (or DS2500s if possible).

 

[rory182]

Braided lines, a good fresh fluid, Brembo HC discs, and standard pads are more than adequate on the road.

AMEN

 

[traceline]

Done and done - I ended up buying the aforementioned 172 after a bit of to-ing and fro-ing the dealer had the brakes checked and it ends up the pads were "incorrect" in some way (suspect that the prev owner had put on something rubbish) - he's replaced them with proper pads and it's like night and day - MUCH better stoppage :approve:

Just booked it into 519 automotive with danny for a cambelt... so is all good.

thanks for the help chaps - much appreciated!