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## WARNING ## @ BLOKE
- Thread starter npt
- Start date
- Status
Probably get edited
Scrooge
ClioSport Moderator
E55 AMG
Thank you, glad you see it that way. Now back on topic for this thread please
RB 182 FF
I definitely agree, but on the flip side you can see the community looking after each other and warning others of potentially shoddy work and loss of hard earned cash... That can't be a bad thing, as long as no one is suggesting GBH or murder...
172
I’d just like to say, I had my cup in with Carl to diagnose an overheating issue, he found it was the head gasket and did me a great price to resolve and do a belt while it was there, I’d already replaced the car and it was having the work done so I could move it on.
While it was left there over about a month, I didn’t hear back for a few days despite calls and texts. Turns out he’d fallen from the top floor of his unit and broken his back and ended up in a pretty bad way and was found on the floor by a lad a few units down in a pool of blood. Within a few weeks he was back to it, in a back brace spannering away on my car as I had a buyer and got all the work done, delivered the car back to me and helped with the sale, all while recovering from a pretty nasty fall.
Business aside, I consider him a very genuine guy and I can’t believe the amount of idiots with pitchforks on social media, frankly it’s terrifying. It’s a bit of metal, albeit someone’s “pride and joy” people are going on like he’s committed some horrific crime. Mistakes have been made but it’s all a bit mad.
While it was left there over about a month, I didn’t hear back for a few days despite calls and texts. Turns out he’d fallen from the top floor of his unit and broken his back and ended up in a pretty bad way and was found on the floor by a lad a few units down in a pool of blood. Within a few weeks he was back to it, in a back brace spannering away on my car as I had a buyer and got all the work done, delivered the car back to me and helped with the sale, all while recovering from a pretty nasty fall.
Business aside, I consider him a very genuine guy and I can’t believe the amount of idiots with pitchforks on social media, frankly it’s terrifying. It’s a bit of metal, albeit someone’s “pride and joy” people are going on like he’s committed some horrific crime. Mistakes have been made but it’s all a bit mad.
Krarl
ClioSport Club Member
I dont get how you can stick up for someone that has quite clearly fucked up.
Carl can certainly come back for this quite easily, all he has to do is hold his hands up, admit hes done a f**k up and then prove why hes a cracking bloke. He's full of knowledge and certainly knows his stuff, he just needs to get on top of things and have some organisation to his chaos. I've seen his unit, f**k me it needs a good going through, nobody can be productive in that place ffs
Carl can certainly come back for this quite easily, all he has to do is hold his hands up, admit hes done a f**k up and then prove why hes a cracking bloke. He's full of knowledge and certainly knows his stuff, he just needs to get on top of things and have some organisation to his chaos. I've seen his unit, f**k me it needs a good going through, nobody can be productive in that place ffs
imprezaworks
ClioSport Club Member
Mk5 Golf GTI :)
Ph2 Meg 225
Just to clarify I know neither parties just seeing it from an outsider looking in and nothing to do with the mob following.
maybe mental health could play a part in this but then if that’s the reason for ignoring messages and calls then bloke wouldn’t be posting numerous times a day on this forum?
I think the business Will be too tarnished now to carry on and Carl would be better off getting a job working for someone.
to me it doesn’t look like it was being run as a legitimate business based on Carl’s statement of not wanting to pay for the turbo upfront. generally you go to a company for work, they supply The materials and install them and then give you the invoice/bill on completion no?
Carls unit is tidy compared to some I've seen!
The Internet is the bane of every company these days. I've found several times the best way to get a response from big companies is to complain on twitter! The little man dealing within a specialist community will sooner or later be set upon by a lynch mob of virtual hard men and easily offended idiots who even though they don't have any connection to either party will happily ruin someone's reputation on the word of one person. Carl has admitted fault, keeping his head down is probably the best thing to do atm.
davo172
ClioSport Club Member
TCR'd 172
As is the CS way ! Same with all the other flavour of the month specialists on here over the years🤣
RDH
ClioSport Club Member
7 pages in and I still can’t grasp the fact that neither party (one who works offshore which i widely assumed makes you good money, and one with what I would assume is quite a profitable business considering the posts on here) didn’t have £1400 to continue work.
It is a tiny sum in the grand scheme of things.
I’d also have to question the Megane owners sanity in ploughing £30,000 into an R26.
It is a tiny sum in the grand scheme of things.
I’d also have to question the Megane owners sanity in ploughing £30,000 into an R26.
Stefan.
ClioSport Club Member
I'd imagine the £30k is including buying the car which if he has had for 11 years would take up nearly half the budget at a guess?
Krarl
ClioSport Club Member
Dont forget the 10k worth of crack he must have been tooting on😂
MarcB
ClioSport Club Member
182 Trophy & 197 F1
Once again its hard facts that are needed and to be backed up by both party's (not mates or someone who knows someone that was there with there cousins dad) otherwise its all pie in the sky IMOH
I feel sorry for both party's as to loose a car that you have had for many years and pumped £30k in would be heartbreaking but I also feel for the business owner who has just lost his livelihood due to what could have been as simple as a small mistake or judgment that has spiralled out of control.
What I dont agree with are the people that have no idea whats going on or what the facts are but yet are saying they are going to smash this and kill that.
I would personally say other social media platforms are alot worse than what I have read and seen on here but none the less there is no need for it.
Its no wonder people end up depressed, lonely and suicidal dealing with what could postenailly be a real live threat made by dozens of people on social media that dont know anything apart from a partial one sided story.
I feel sorry for both party's as to loose a car that you have had for many years and pumped £30k in would be heartbreaking but I also feel for the business owner who has just lost his livelihood due to what could have been as simple as a small mistake or judgment that has spiralled out of control.
What I dont agree with are the people that have no idea whats going on or what the facts are but yet are saying they are going to smash this and kill that.
I would personally say other social media platforms are alot worse than what I have read and seen on here but none the less there is no need for it.
Its no wonder people end up depressed, lonely and suicidal dealing with what could postenailly be a real live threat made by dozens of people on social media that dont know anything apart from a partial one sided story.
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Clio 182 Trophy
@Stefan. Correct mate
Blew his 1st engine up so went to Engine Dynamics and had a forged engine installed costing a fair few thousand. It was then running 330bhp so mapping, turbo kit, standalone ECU, swirl pot etc were added.
£1,500 coilovers
Blown up gearbox so that was rebuilt
Full custom weld in roll cage
The list goes on, it was a very very clean car.
I think the car was around 14k - 15k when he bought it. Quite easy to end up 30k deep over 11 years when modifying and having bad luck.
Blew his 1st engine up so went to Engine Dynamics and had a forged engine installed costing a fair few thousand. It was then running 330bhp so mapping, turbo kit, standalone ECU, swirl pot etc were added.
£1,500 coilovers
Blown up gearbox so that was rebuilt
Full custom weld in roll cage
The list goes on, it was a very very clean car.
I think the car was around 14k - 15k when he bought it. Quite easy to end up 30k deep over 11 years when modifying and having bad luck.
bashracing
ClioSport Club Member
In that case my 330d owes me £70k
Has he considered just throwing in a standard motor in for now?
Has he considered just throwing in a standard motor in for now?
RB 182 FF
What someone spends on a car is completely their choice though, anyone questioning his sanity is ridiculous... This money is accumulative over many years and virtually all of us spend way more than we should on cars, that's why we are on these forums mainly... Someone else said on here, "oh it's just a car" get over it sort of attitude... Cars have so much more meaning to some people, what if his passed away parent bought it for him or his passed away nan etc etc. Also the amount he spent shows how attached he was to it... Mistakes happen yes of course, but the way this car went from a minter to a scrapper is inexplicable and inexcusable really...
Gaz_
ClioSport Club Member
Extreme mode
Clio 182 Trophy
@MarcB
I have spent around 4 hours over the last 3 days on the phone to the OP discussing this situation and his options moving forward. I see him at least once a week, I feel I'm in a very good position to fight his corner on here given that I have been involved in this for the last 18 months and he isn't a member on here to defend himself.
Carl has gone AWOL and has made no efforts to contact OP as of yet with regards to putting this to bed.
Not only is there the issue with the state of the car ... OP also paid Carl £1,250 over a year ago, and Carl said he will sell the current turbo kit installed on the car as he has a buyer for it ... just a personal assumption but I wouldn't be surprised if it ended up on his sons Twingo? Not factual, just an assumption ...
OP did receive his new turbo when he collected the box of parts from Carl, however, there is still a large discrepancy in finances which is yet to be addressed.
I've spoke to the OP a few hours ago and he said he'd be happy if his car was put right and some compensation to recoup costs of having to hire a car transporter, a handful of wasted trips down there and the whole stress of the situation. Whether this be in monetary value, free labour, free servicing etc I don't know, that depends how willing Carl is to negotiate and try to clear his name I guess
I have spent around 4 hours over the last 3 days on the phone to the OP discussing this situation and his options moving forward. I see him at least once a week, I feel I'm in a very good position to fight his corner on here given that I have been involved in this for the last 18 months and he isn't a member on here to defend himself.
Carl has gone AWOL and has made no efforts to contact OP as of yet with regards to putting this to bed.
Not only is there the issue with the state of the car ... OP also paid Carl £1,250 over a year ago, and Carl said he will sell the current turbo kit installed on the car as he has a buyer for it ... just a personal assumption but I wouldn't be surprised if it ended up on his sons Twingo? Not factual, just an assumption ...
OP did receive his new turbo when he collected the box of parts from Carl, however, there is still a large discrepancy in finances which is yet to be addressed.
I've spoke to the OP a few hours ago and he said he'd be happy if his car was put right and some compensation to recoup costs of having to hire a car transporter, a handful of wasted trips down there and the whole stress of the situation. Whether this be in monetary value, free labour, free servicing etc I don't know, that depends how willing Carl is to negotiate and try to clear his name I guess
Bluebeard
ClioSport Moderator
Whichever has fuel
Forgot to catch up on this... turned notifications off as it was literally none stop after I posted them screen shots lool.
Hope he managed to sell the trackday or go in another car, thats about £500 down the drain for the trackday alone, never mind travel and hotel expenses.
To people saying why not go down when Carls there on a weekday, whats to say he would have been there, if unable to contact him? Whats to say he doesnt want to take a day off work or whatever to travel down (with a trailer) and to then end up leaving empy handed anyway.
It's a fuckin dick move to deliberately not be there knowing full well he was on his way down to collect the car. He deliberately wasnt there in the hope he would either not come, or if he did, wouldnt have the balls to do what he did and break in to get to his own property.
I dont blame him one bit, maybe not the assault, but I belive thats his son provoking that, probably deserved it (going off his facebook comment)
Hope he managed to sell the trackday or go in another car, thats about £500 down the drain for the trackday alone, never mind travel and hotel expenses.
To people saying why not go down when Carls there on a weekday, whats to say he would have been there, if unable to contact him? Whats to say he doesnt want to take a day off work or whatever to travel down (with a trailer) and to then end up leaving empy handed anyway.
It's a fuckin dick move to deliberately not be there knowing full well he was on his way down to collect the car. He deliberately wasnt there in the hope he would either not come, or if he did, wouldnt have the balls to do what he did and break in to get to his own property.
I dont blame him one bit, maybe not the assault, but I belive thats his son provoking that, probably deserved it (going off his facebook comment)
Leaving it outside to get wet too, why not just rest the bloody bonnet on top, wouldve taken 2 seconds and literally saved the engine.
I just cant get my head around the state in which the car is now in.
From a chap with such a good repuation across seemingly many RS platforms.
If his buisness goes down the shitter now, he's only got one person to blame hasnt he.
Communication couldve stopped this from ever happening, atleast to this extent.
I just cant get my head around the state in which the car is now in.
From a chap with such a good repuation across seemingly many RS platforms.
If his buisness goes down the shitter now, he's only got one person to blame hasnt he.
Communication couldve stopped this from ever happening, atleast to this extent.
Is he willing to let Carl rebuild his car?
massiveCoRbyn
ClioSport Club Member
Several
To look at this from a different angle, you could argue that any engagement from Carl on this topic or on social media could do further damage, as every prick could want to chuck in their two cents worth. Arguing with people on the internet, especially when most of them have nothing to do with it, is a waste of time.
If Carl wants to rectify the situation, the only person he should be speaking to is the customer. It doesn't need to be acted out on social media for the masses to witness.
I have no loyalty to any moderators on this forum but, having been on plenty of forums over the years, I would say that this is one of the more fairly moderated ones.
He has admitted that there was mistakes though, hasn't he?
Clio 182 Trophy
He's all but been in tears to be totally honest mate. Genuinely heartbroken. He just wants it fixed whether that means sending it to Carl or elsewhere. He has been in touch with another renault specialist who I won't name who has quoted him 3k to completely finish the car and a time frame of 2 months. Obviously the majority of the parts are there now, it's just a case of rebuilding the engine, replacing chopped ancillaries and replacing corroded wiring and then installing the new side winder turbo.
Irrespective if he wants Carl to touch it or not, Carl also needs to raise his head from the sand as he might not want anything to do with the situation and just accept the fact that his reputation will suffer. As I've said before, it's in Carl's hands entirely and he chooses not to speak ...
@bloke
Pep
ClioSport Club Member
M2,XJS,S1000RR
In any legal battle you've got to give the person who has cocked it up the chance to put it right. You can't just ship it to someone else and then try to claim costs as far as I'm aware. If he's not interested in doing this at his expense then deserves all the flack he gets.
Bloke needs to sort his s**t out, all well and good saying he shouldn't come online to share it to the world but he's clearly not been in touch with the owner either so has just decided to ignore it all.
I cannot understand how in this day and age people run a business yet don't understand the worth in customer service, it's where they all fail and then it goes down the drain. The internet is a brutal place and we all know it so you just can't be surprised when you cause your own downfall for being s**t. Business is tough and not for everyone (me included) so if you can't do it without f**king up other peoples property then you shouldn't be in the game.
Does he deserve threats of violence from randomers not involved? No of course not.
But he completely deserves a big knock in his reputation for handling it so badly. Had it been my car I'd probably have acted a lot worse.
Bloke needs to sort his s**t out, all well and good saying he shouldn't come online to share it to the world but he's clearly not been in touch with the owner either so has just decided to ignore it all.
I cannot understand how in this day and age people run a business yet don't understand the worth in customer service, it's where they all fail and then it goes down the drain. The internet is a brutal place and we all know it so you just can't be surprised when you cause your own downfall for being s**t. Business is tough and not for everyone (me included) so if you can't do it without f**king up other peoples property then you shouldn't be in the game.
Does he deserve threats of violence from randomers not involved? No of course not.
But he completely deserves a big knock in his reputation for handling it so badly. Had it been my car I'd probably have acted a lot worse.
Clio 182 Trophy
This is a straight up copy and paste from the OP ... he sent me this at 22:31 so hot off the press
So, a reply to Carl saying i didn’t pay for turbo for 6-8 month....
I had paid him £1050 pound to get the ball rolling for the likes of timing belt kit and water pump and oil change etc. Quote £500
Which 18 month later hasn’t been done as he’s ordering timing belt kit this week apparently and sending it back to me with air con unit and coil packs which he couldn’t find on Saturday after i got my car.
So thats £550 left. He then said he could sell my hybrid turbo for £575, injectors for £100 and down pipe for £100. (Probs made money on them when he did)
Thats now £1275.
He then said garry who is doing manifold was out of action due to health. This was back end of 2018. So i said no hurry just leave it as no need to pressure garry. I sent him £300 via paypal in Jan. I sent carl some 172 cams to be machined and fitted.
Now we are at £1575 with no more work done.
I asked him for a bill on numerous occasions so i wasn’t just sending money for the sake of it. My friend went down with a clio 172 to get cammed. I gave him £200 cash when he went.
Now at £1775.
Still asking for a completion date and if turbo is getting ordered. Then garry began to get back on with manifold. Still asking for final bill going into march. He told me it would be done in march. It wasn’t. He then said it would be done in April. I sent him and extra £400 via paypal for the rest of bits n bobs and asked for a final bill. Still to this day had no final bill.
Then i booked the Nurburgring track day for £400 for end of April as i was told it would be done. Bought fuel system etc and sent him it to his unit. Including injectors and fuel rail.
Missed track day as wouldn’t answer phone and texts as per. Same happened month after month. I renewed my insurance hoping to get it on track after getting told it would be done.
Add this to working at sea and ringing him every time in port and at home.
August 2019 by now, i drove to Liverpool to see Carl. Confronted him as it was impossible to get intouch. He assured me the car would be done end of august/first week of September. I agreed and said no problem. Make sure its done as the next time i come down i will take my car regardless.
Back to work at sea and got home end of October. Carl said he had 3 bookings for November at efi. 9th,10th and 12th and my car would deffo be in one of them slots. 12 came and as per no answer from Carl. I emailed efi who said my car was not there.
Rang carl for rest of the month and told him to send my car home.
First week of December no answer as per. Had enough so booked a trailer and drove down. Text him all week stating i would be there Saturday 7th. Morning of i sent picture message with van and trailer saying 1 hour away. When actually i was 2 hours away to give him more time.
Got to his unit. No sign of carl. I went to other 3 units that were open and asked them to call him as he blanks my calls. They all said they don’t have his number. So after driving 3 hours and hundreds of pounds in fuel and trailer hire i made a start of getting my car out of his unit.
To find nothing has been done apart from stripped.
Proof from people seeing him take parts off my car to finish other cars.
He still to this day hasn’t even got my timing belt kit as he’s ordering it this week to send to me.
Cams i sent have not been touched. Still in original packaging since i sent them a year ago.
Said my cam cover was away getting painted so waiting for that. Got car back on Saturday and its not been touched with paint. Just rain water. Bird feathers and grime.
And he is saying i took 6-8 month to pay up. Wow
So, a reply to Carl saying i didn’t pay for turbo for 6-8 month....
I had paid him £1050 pound to get the ball rolling for the likes of timing belt kit and water pump and oil change etc. Quote £500
Which 18 month later hasn’t been done as he’s ordering timing belt kit this week apparently and sending it back to me with air con unit and coil packs which he couldn’t find on Saturday after i got my car.
So thats £550 left. He then said he could sell my hybrid turbo for £575, injectors for £100 and down pipe for £100. (Probs made money on them when he did)
Thats now £1275.
He then said garry who is doing manifold was out of action due to health. This was back end of 2018. So i said no hurry just leave it as no need to pressure garry. I sent him £300 via paypal in Jan. I sent carl some 172 cams to be machined and fitted.
Now we are at £1575 with no more work done.
I asked him for a bill on numerous occasions so i wasn’t just sending money for the sake of it. My friend went down with a clio 172 to get cammed. I gave him £200 cash when he went.
Now at £1775.
Still asking for a completion date and if turbo is getting ordered. Then garry began to get back on with manifold. Still asking for final bill going into march. He told me it would be done in march. It wasn’t. He then said it would be done in April. I sent him and extra £400 via paypal for the rest of bits n bobs and asked for a final bill. Still to this day had no final bill.
Then i booked the Nurburgring track day for £400 for end of April as i was told it would be done. Bought fuel system etc and sent him it to his unit. Including injectors and fuel rail.
Missed track day as wouldn’t answer phone and texts as per. Same happened month after month. I renewed my insurance hoping to get it on track after getting told it would be done.
Add this to working at sea and ringing him every time in port and at home.
August 2019 by now, i drove to Liverpool to see Carl. Confronted him as it was impossible to get intouch. He assured me the car would be done end of august/first week of September. I agreed and said no problem. Make sure its done as the next time i come down i will take my car regardless.
Back to work at sea and got home end of October. Carl said he had 3 bookings for November at efi. 9th,10th and 12th and my car would deffo be in one of them slots. 12 came and as per no answer from Carl. I emailed efi who said my car was not there.
Rang carl for rest of the month and told him to send my car home.
First week of December no answer as per. Had enough so booked a trailer and drove down. Text him all week stating i would be there Saturday 7th. Morning of i sent picture message with van and trailer saying 1 hour away. When actually i was 2 hours away to give him more time.
Got to his unit. No sign of carl. I went to other 3 units that were open and asked them to call him as he blanks my calls. They all said they don’t have his number. So after driving 3 hours and hundreds of pounds in fuel and trailer hire i made a start of getting my car out of his unit.
To find nothing has been done apart from stripped.
Proof from people seeing him take parts off my car to finish other cars.
He still to this day hasn’t even got my timing belt kit as he’s ordering it this week to send to me.
Cams i sent have not been touched. Still in original packaging since i sent them a year ago.
Said my cam cover was away getting painted so waiting for that. Got car back on Saturday and its not been touched with paint. Just rain water. Bird feathers and grime.
And he is saying i took 6-8 month to pay up. Wow
Clio 182 Trophy
172 Cup
Rojer
ClioSport Club Member
Pussy come at me 😂😂
There's no milage in any of this really, either chalk it up to experience or go the small claims court route.
I've been in the car game for years, this always happens and probably always will, you'll probably never know the genuine reason behind any of it.
And yes I've been bitten to a lesser degree before.
I've been in the car game for years, this always happens and probably always will, you'll probably never know the genuine reason behind any of it.
And yes I've been bitten to a lesser degree before.
MarkCup
ClioSport Club Member
I'm 100% neutral in all this, but wow. I'd have never gotten past that first point without a bill or some sort of formal invoice in return. I certainly wouldn't have kept throwing money at him.
davo172
ClioSport Club Member
TCR'd 172
Well of this is true its shocking !! the op has be way more patient than I would have been !!
RB 182 FF
I agree with Stu8v, this happened to my friend with a Fiat Coupe 20vt... He was having it fully Forged and tuned to silly power plus a full respray and he also regrettably trusted the guy and sent chunks of money with no invoices... He took it to a small claims court and they just laughed at him, the guilty party hired a great lawyer and he stood no chance as there was insufficient evidence.... I believe he was done out of around 5k... He put it down to experience and had to write it off, he hasn't been interested in doing anything with cars since sadly...
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