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Burpspeed Version 2: Race Car Build



I was going to say I'm surprised mine hasn't done the same yet, but I probably don't have as much engine movement running 5 mounts. The lower-front engine one I made seemed to make the most difference, taking a lot of the load off the top engine mount.
 
  172 Race Car
17th October 2010 - Snetterton


We travelled up to Snetterton on Saturday afternoon and arrived around 6pm. This time we had been allocated a garage so setup for Sunday.


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We went for a walk of the circuit just as the sun was setting. It was completely dark by the time we had finished the lap


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Sunday morning was cold and dry. We prepared the car ready for our early morning qualifying session at 9am. I went out first and slowly built up speed, learning the circuit. My approach was a cautious one, not wanting any incidents.


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Tony took over halfway through and finished the session without drama. We managed a 1:25.8sec lap to put us 12th on the grid. We were reasonably pleased with it as neither of us had been to Snetterton before and were aiming for a top ten finish in race 1. The first race was at 11:35am. I did the first stint and lined up on the outside of row 6. I got a terrible start. I must of held the car on the clutch for too long waiting for the lights. It got hot and all I had was clutch slip through the gears. I lost at least 5 places by the first corner and it all got a little frantic ahead of me.The clutch stopped slipping by turn 2 and I started to try and regain lost ground.


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I passed a few cars on the straight but on lap 3 made a mistake into the esses and took too much kerb on the inside. It launched the car up on 2 wheels and ran wide onto the grass as I landed. I got back on the track and took a wide line into the Bomb hole, knowing there would be cars there. Bang! Bang! I got a tap from behind followed by another and I was off into the field. After figuring out what way I was facing I got back on the track dead last and could feel the car wasn't right. I pitted at the end of the lap.


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Tony and Dave took a hammer to the rear wheel arch to stop it rubbing the tyre and I rejoined 4 laps down. The car felt fine after and I handed over to Tony with 17 minutes to go. We finished in 14th place so that is where we would start race 2.



After the race we had a closer look at the damage. Its not too bad, just a little battle scar.



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Race 2 was to be a rolling start The first time we had done one.

We prepped the car ready for the start at 14:40 and had to buy some extra fuel at an eye watering price.


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Tony took the first stint and made a great start from 14th to get up to 10th by lap 2 and a lap later was in 8th place fighting with a Fiesta. The swapped places regularly until Tony managed to get ahead for a few laps. At the end of lap 5 the car jumped out of gear over the kerbs at the chicane. A slow exit gave the Fiesta got a run on him along the Senna straight and he passed into the first corner. They continued fighting for another few laps until the Fiesta pitted on lap 12. We left Tony out there, delaying our pitstop as he had a clear track in front. Most other cars were pitting at this time and we moved up the order to 4th.


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With only 4 minutes of the pit window left we brought him in for the driver change. It wasn't a bad stop and as I was strapped in Tony shouted that there was a knocking noise


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I rejoined in 7th, just ahead of the Fiesta. I noticed the clunking noise at the first corner and suspected it was an engine mount working loose. The Fiesta started to gain on me and 2 laps later, as I braked and changed down for the 2nd corner the clunk got worse and I locked up the brakes. Over shooting the corner and the Fiesta was through.



I got my head down and tried to catch up but another lock up and the clunk getting worse I decided to settle for 8th and was generous to the leaders as they came up to lap me. On the penultimate lap the battling 3rd and 4th placed cars came by and I had a great view as they came together in the braking zone for the chicane, resulting in a fair bit of damage to both cars.


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We found the source of the clunk as soon as we removed the bonnet. Lucky the engine stayed in. So that was the end of another interesting day. We packed up and headed for home. Quite pleased with our season overall.

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Daniel

ClioSport Moderator
  Whichever has fuel
Awesome work chaps.

I look forward to another season sponsoring you, but be warned, the season after that, you may have a bit of competition.... ;)

On a serious note, I know you have had a few mechanical faults this season, but remember its your first, so next season you should have a bit of experience/knowledge to overcome them.

I love you both. x
 
  172 Race Car
You must come to a race next year Mr Cole.

Yea weve had some niggles and setup issues but we had virtualy no testing with the car and racing is NOTHING like trackdays when it comes to how you want a car to behave. Were getting there slowly and have had quite a few lengthy disscusions about where to go next with it. We have some ideas and will be getting a few things sorted over the winter. Nothing too impressive just making what we have work better.
 

Rob

ClioSport Moderator
Nice little write up, those must really be a weak point on the Clio's, mine went and I've never tracked it, just snapped in two places, luckily I noticed it before the third bolt sheared.

Sounds like you got a good run at it, with limited problems this time :)
 
  172 Race Car
We have the required 6 signatures on our licences now (I have 7 due to the extra race i did at Anglesey) we can now upgrade and take off our novice cross for next season.
 
  182 trackday racer
Top work guys!

Wonder about the AST Sportlines you are using, what setup are they? Springrates, 22 or 45mm version, re-shimed, pros and cons.

Considering AST or Yozza Bilsteins.

Cheers
 
  172 Race Car
22mm Built to our own spec for circuit use only. Short travel etc. Vaved to suit our springs with future changes in mind.

Current spring rates are 100newton front and 78.5newton rear

Still developing the car but its getting better and better. We like the fact that if we need something changed/rebuilt we can just take them to him to do and he has given us A LOT of help and support. We carry his logos on the car.

Suspension setup is a very personal thing and depends what you are using the car for. We have found that the setup/balance we liked and got on well with when doing trackdays over the last few years, doesnt suit the racing enviroment where you are sometimes off line with several cars around you.

As said we are still working on it and the car is going in the right direction slowly. We have not really done much testing so its been a slow process.

For trackdays it may be better to just get a set of coilovers 'off the shelf'
 
  182 trackday racer
22mm Built to our own spec for circuit use only. Short travel etc. Vaved to suit our springs with future changes in mind.

Current spring rates are 100newton front and 78.5newton rear

Still developing the car but its getting better and better. We like the fact that if we need something changed/rebuilt we can just take them to him to do and he has given us A LOT of help and support. We carry his logos on the car.

Suspension setup is a very personal thing and depends what you are using the car for. We have found that the setup/balance we liked and got on well with when doing trackdays over the last few years, doesnt suit the racing enviroment where you are sometimes off line with several cars around you.

As said we are still working on it and the car is going in the right direction slowly. We have not really done much testing so its been a slow process.

For trackdays it may be better to just get a set of coilovers 'off the shelf'

Ok thanks,

Have a modified 'of the shelf' kit today running 100N/mm front and 100N/mm in the rear (using standard spring position in the rear but with a rally group N kind of setup). However Im not 100% pleased with it, to much roll imo. Car is about 1060kg atm but will be lightened to below 1000kg next year so that will change things considering suspention and balance.

Basically Im after a pure race setup to suit Nürburgring = a tiny bit softer than a standard race setup.
 
  Saab 93 Aero Wagon
Really impressive stuff this year guys. Its a relief that you can obviously both race a car better than you both Kart anyway....;)

Im determined to get along to a race or two next year.

Tony - see you at Brands I hope!
 
  182cup & 172 racecar
Cheers Ollie,first race we seemed all strange,hard to explain really.I know Jay didn't feel right and myself,it was like it was all happening around me with me not being there,strange.But second race managed to get my head down and get on with it and Jay did well to keep going with engine trying to get out for a walk every time he lifted off.Overall not a bad season,could have been a lot worse and it seems the only way to make it loads better is to buy either a ex Touring spec car or a Honda,both we shall not be doing.
But we are racing and having fun,:)
 
  182cup & 172 racecar
Awesome work chaps.

I look forward to another season sponsoring you, but be warned, the season after that, you may have a bit of competition.... ;)

On a serious note, I know you have had a few mechanical faults this season, but remember its your first, so next season you should have a bit of experience/knowledge to overcome them.

I love you both. x

I SHALL be in touch.xx
 
  182 trackday racer
How does the back end feel with 100N/mm on it,twitchy or not?

It is not very hard tbh. Think its about as hard as yours considering the differences "leverage"

I use 1 degree camber shims in the rear and Whiteline ARB on its hardest setting and never any problems. In the wet its a bit tailhappy with the R888's would probably be a good idea to step down the ARB in such conditions or use other tires ;)


Actually went on a 6000km trip to the ring and along the alps with girlfriend and all this summer.Went well :D
 
  172 Race Car
It is not very hard tbh. Think its about as hard as yours considering the differences "leverage"

I use 1 degree camber shims in the rear and Whiteline ARB on its hardest setting and never any problems. In the wet its a bit tailhappy with the R888's would probably be a good idea to step down the ARB in such conditions or use other tires ;)

D
Dont forget that using the springs in the stock location gives a 1 to 2 ratio (approx) so they will be acting like 50newton on a coilover
 
  182 trackday racer
Dont forget that using the springs in the stock location gives a 1 to 2 ratio (approx) so they will be acting like 50newton on a coilover

Yes that what I ment by "leverage"

I glanced at the Clio Group N rally cars and they use 1:1 ratio on front / rear suspention (standard rear position as well). From memory I think 80N/mm is their tarmac setting. Much lighter car than mine though,
 
  TrackCar & F30 330d
A great read once again :)

What size fan do you guys run? 10" or 12"? And when it kicks in does it cool the car sufficently?
 
  172 Race Car


2010 Season Stats:


Best Qualifying: 5th, Anglesey/Mallory

Best finish: 4th, Anglesey

DNF's: x1

Hours On Track: 13.5

Quickest Pitstop: 18 seconds, Mallory Park

Racing Laps: 194

Dead Alternators: x5

Off Track Excursions: Lost Count

Fun: Lots
 

Rob

ClioSport Moderator
Brilliant write up as a whole and I really look forward to the next season.

Thanks for bothering to keep us updated with everything, very good and interesting reading :)

If I come into any money over the next few year I'll definitely be looking at going into something like this myself.
 
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  182cup & 172 racecar


2010 Season Stats:


Best Qualifying: 5th, Anglesey/Mallory

Best finish: 4th, Anglesey

DNF's: x1

Hours On Track: 13.5

Quickest Pitstop: 18 seconds, Mallory Park

Racing Laps: 194

Dead Alternators: x5

Off Track Excursions: Lost Count

Fun: Lots
Yes it was,but you forgot the 5,000 hrs in the workshop:dapprove:
 
  TrackCar & F30 330d
Did you ever find out what was eating your alternators? I have the brackets you use but am worried about using the alternator you were using as 5 is quite a lot for only 500ish miles of driving.

Which car were the alternators from?
 
  172 Race Car
Yes. We know what the alternator problem was. And yes 5 is a lot but we had one that did 3 meetings and a test day before the casing broke (it still worked) and the 5 dead ones all lasted a max of a few laps before packing in. It was a supplier issue, were sure of it.

(So its 6 dead alternators really

They were from a Volvo 440. We are using a 172 Cup one now as they are just as cheap as the Volvo ones and fit the Volvo brackets


Dave: That includes trackdays and testing too
 
  TrackCar & F30 330d
Thanks for the information mate.

Sorry to be a pain, what size belt do you use with the 172 cup alternator?

I read earlier in the thread you changed the pully size when you were using the Volvo alt to slow it down so try match the slower speeds the alternator would be used to.

With the cup alternator are you just using the normal size pully that comes with the alternator, and therefor using a 5 rib x 850mm?

Sorry for al the questions :eek:
 
  172 Race Car
2010 Season Review


Over the winter of 09/10 we built a Clio 172 Phase 1 race car to compete in the CSCC Tintops series.


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The races are 40mins in length with a mandatory pit stop. We had many ups and downs during the build but by mid February we ready enough to do some testing.

We booked a trackday at Bedford but the track was snowed under when we arrived.

We didn't get a chance to do the official series test day or the first race meeting at Snetterton. Our first race would be at Brands Hatch, on the 9th of May. We desperately needed to get some laps on the car to make sure everything was ok, so went along to the Spring Action day at Castle Combe. Not ideal testing for the car but the best we could do

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We both managed 2 runs and were reasonably happy with the car but 2 alternator failures ended our day early. A brand new alternator and a bigger battery were fitted. We also improved the cooling to the alternator ready for Brands hatch, Our first race meeting.



The day was cloudy and cold but remained dry. Tony went out to qualify first and instantly found the new tyres we had fitted had drastically affected the handling. Causing massive understeer. 5 laps into his run he ran wide at the last corner and understeered into the gravel. We were out of qualifying and that left us 20th on the grid. It was a rush to get me into the race as I had not completed the mandatory 3 laps to qualify. The car was checked over and cleared of gravel for me to do the required laps behind the safety car during a break


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The race was fun. Tony started and made a few places up before we decided to pit mid race as the safety car came out. It was a bad call as we lost a lap being held at the pitlane exit. We were pleased to make the finish of the race, the car didn't miss a beat but the setup needed some big changes to suit the new tyres. 18th place at the end was a start.


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2 weeks later we made the long trip to Anglesey, North Wales for our next race. We arrived on Friday lunch time and spent the afternoon testing, Tony doing the driving and me making the adjustments. We improved the car setup and dropped the lap times considerably. Later that evening we walked the track so I could learn the layout from Tony. We were much more prepared than before.


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The next morning, practice went well and we qualified 5th, the car felt great. We had a slightly different strategy for the race as we planned to pit as late as possible. Tony was up to 2nd when we pitted and I rejoined in the race in 3rd. 29 mins gone, not far from the 2nd placed car. After a fight with him I tried to fend off the car behind but lost out up the hill so we finished 4th. A great result.


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Oulton Park was our next race but we were unsure what to expect as we had to change to a different type of tyre. The type we had set the car up for were no longer available. In practice the car was lethal. Massive oversteer. Not helped by a leaking coolant hose. We only competed 7 laps between us but qualified 8th. We made a setup change for the race and it helped a little. It was an uneventful 40 mins, apart from a broken alternator casing and we came home 7th.


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During the summer, the racing club were off to Spa in Belgium and Cadwell Park, 2 rounds we had decided to miss, so we had a long break to make some changes to the car. We did the Renaultsport trackday at Silverstone to give some of our friends and sponsors a ride and the car felt much better than at the last race. We were looking forward to racing again.


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Mallory Park was our next circuit and after a wet/dry qualifying, we ended up 5th on the grid. It wasn't all plain sailing as we suffered yet another alternator failure. A replacement regulator didn't last either, and 10 laps into the race the battery light came on again. There was nothing we could do but hope the battery had enough charge to get us to the finish. It didn't and whilst in a strong 2nd place, with 3 laps to go, the car lost power. We crossed the line 6th. Gutted!


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Less than a week later and with a brand new alternator fitted, we travelled the short distance to our home circuit, Silverstone. The car didn't feel as well balanced as it had at Mallory and we finished the practice session 8th on the grid. Right in the middle of a very close group. Tony started the race and had a big battle with one of the MG's, but managed to break away before our stop. We messed up the driver change but I still exited the pits ahead of the MG. A lap later the throttle cable snapped. Our first DNF.


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Our last race meeting of the year was at Snetterton. It was to be a double header with 2 races on the same day. A steady run in qualifying saw us 12th on the grid and I took the start. Holding the car on the clutch too long made for a really bad getaway and I dropped to 17th place. 3 laps later whilst making a little progress through the field, I made a mistake and ended off the circuit. As I came back on I was tagged from behind and had to pit with damage to the drivers side rear arch. We rejoined 4 laps down and eventually came home in 14th place


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Race 2 was a rolling start and it was Tonys turn to take the first stint. He was quickly up into the top 10 and going very well. He was involved in a big scrap with a Fiesta and once that had peeled off into the pits, we left him out there on a clear track and pitted late. I rejoined 7th just ahead of the Fiesta but the car wasn't well. There as a loud clunk every time I slowed down and a lap later I missed my braking point for turn 2. The Fiesta got by and I decided to get the car to the finish. The noise was getting worse and there was a lot of engine vibration. 8th place at the end was quite a good result. The cause of the noise turned out to be a broken engine mount.


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So the end of our first season and we have enjoyed it. We have been developing and learning about the car all year and know what areas we need to improve. We have some plans and testing to do over the winter. Hopefully we can start next year from a better base.

A massive thank you to all our sponsors. We couldn't of done it without you all.
1st Call Auto Rental, Banbury Heating Supplies, Stealthsport, Iseki Compact Tractors and Colshe Motor Company.

Thanks to Curtis at AST for putting up with the constant phone calls and questions.
Matt at Tour-De-Force Power Engineering for the many hours and late nights calibrating.
ATS Banbury for all the tyre fitting, Ady at N2Grafix for the excellent service and Cherwell Edge Golf Club for their support.

And finally a big thanks to everyone who has helped us at the meetings this season. Bomber, Mike, Dan, Aaron, Keith, Andy, Photographer Dan and Matt.


See you in 2011
 

Daniel

ClioSport Moderator
  Whichever has fuel
Amazing write up jay!!

Hopefully I'll still be able to sponsor you again for next season. :)

(That fcuking picture is going to haunt me for years to come.... )
 


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