Clio 172 cup rally/race/track car

[Nathan Evans]

Picked this up today.
I’ve always fancied a standard one to mint up and keep in the back of the unit

 

[massivewangers]

Nice!

I've always fancied a standard Cup. Will be rare in the future as so many have been stripped.

 

[Nathan Evans]

Nice!

I've always fancied a standard Cup. Will be rare in the future as so many have been stripped.

That’s the plan. This one is untouched apart from some stickers. Runs and drives great and weirdly feels quicker than my rally car. Plan is to mint it up and keep hold of it.

 

[Nathan Evans]

Not much of an update this week. Got the cup in the unit.
The paint work is booked in for a tidy up next week. It has had a bad spray before down one side and the lacquer has faded.
But if anyone want a cheap cup I might let is go already. The units not big enough for all the cars and spares we’ve got ?

The rally cars been treated to a new set of front callipers but I have been contemplating for brembos or hi spec 4 pots. But would like to drive a car with them to feel if it’s actually worth while

 

[massivewangers]

Paint your bloody cam cover man ?

 

[Nathan Evans]

Paint your bloody cam cover man ?

But then some of these muppets in the rally world who reckon I’ve got 240bhp in it will definitely not believe me when I say the engine is standard with a nice shiney cam cover. I’ll keep that for when I do eventually build a proper engine for it.

 

[massivewangers]

But then some of these muppets in the rally world who reckon I’ve got 240bhp in it will definitely not believe me when I say the engine is standard with a nice shiney cam cover. I’ll keep that for when I do eventually build a proper engine for it.

True. I'd just chuck some VHT paint at it or something. The OCD is strong with me though lol

 

[Nathan Evans]

New calipers fitted but still looking at going down the Brembo 4 pot route.

Managed to get on special stage rally reviews coverage of last months SMC Stages at Anglesey




Also tomorrow at 9am the entry is out for The Harry Flatters Rally on Epynt. Same place as the rally I’ve just done but using a lot more roads. 70 stage miles with a total of 170 miles all together incudling road sections. Really looking forward to this one as it’s a step up again and you get to do a recce of the stages on Saturday to perfect the pace notes.

 

[green]

I’ve got the brembo conversion. Yes they are very good and give a bling factor but for me they are that much better than the standard setup with decent pad.
There is the benefit of better cooling and weight saving...I've also have 2 piece discs as well to save some more unsprung weight.
What I want to try is the 197 master cylinder to shorten the peddle as it’s a bit longer now... I have got used to it now as I feel there’s more variation in the braking.
Even thou at the start I said they aren’t better than standard, writing this has actually made the Brembo’s a much better system than standard.
Good luck in your next rally...looks like you go really well

 

[Nathan Evans]

I’ve got the brembo conversion. Yes they are very good and give a bling factor but for me they are that much better than the standard setup with decent pad.
There is the benefit of better cooling and weight saving...I've also have 2 piece discs as well to save some more unsprung weight.
What I want to try is the 197 master cylinder to shorten the peddle as it’s a bit longer now... I have got used to it now as I feel there’s more variation in the braking.
Even thou at the start I said they aren’t better than standard, writing this has actually made the Brembo’s a much better system than standard.
Good luck in your next rally...looks like you go really well

Thanks for your input. It’s definitely something I want to try as I’m not happy with the brakes at the minute. Even with 2 new calipers the breaking has completely changed. Not sure if the pads I’m using have changed the compound slightly but they’re getting far to hot. Even put in a brand new set of pads today and it’s no better. Only thing I wouldn’t want too happen is get a long pedal though.

What size discs are you using with yours?

 

[NorthloopCup]

Thanks for your input. It’s definitely something I want to try as I’m not happy with the brakes at the minute. Even with 2 new calipers the breaking has completely changed. Not sure if the pads I’m using have changed the compound slightly but they’re getting far to hot. Even put in a brand new set of pads today and it’s no better. Only thing I wouldn’t want too happen is get a long pedal though.

What size discs are you using with yours?

Honestly mate, you won’t have longer pedal travel on a cup mc and Brembos. Mine were f**king awesome on my cup, and properly hauled the speed off. I was using ds1.11’s.

 

[green]

@Nathan Evan I'm only running a 283mm to get them under a 15” wheel as I’m to tight to pay for 16” tyres. I’ve also got the ds1:11 pads..they took a bit of running in but really good bite. I did have CL rc6 pads in standard callipers and Tarox f2000 disc which needed hardly any running in, I ran that setup for a few years...they are so great it was the tyres giving giving up after half an hour...not great for light braking as they squeal to hell but perfect for hard braking. I still have abs.
A lot on here say the rear brakes don’t do much but I found having a decent pad in there scrubbed speed off better than having standard pads.
Must admit the stopping power on the track car compared to my standard 182 is a world apart..even from cold they out perform.
Just thought sharing my experiences may help.

 

[Nathan Evans]

Honestly mate, you won’t have longer pedal travel on a cup mc and Brembos. Mine were f**king awesome on my cup, and properly hauled the speed off. I was using ds1.11’s.

Mega. I’m going to have to try them. Only other thing I’ve changed is the fluid to ATE type 200 which could be causing a problem.

@Nathan Evan I'm only running a 283mm to get them under a 15” wheel as I’m to tight to pay for 16” tyres. I’ve also got the ds1:11 pads..they took a bit of running in but really good bite. I did have CL rc6 pads in standard callipers and Tarox f2000 disc which needed hardly any running in, I ran that setup for a few years...they are so great it was the tyres giving giving up after half an hour...not great for light braking as they squeal to hell but perfect for hard braking. I still have abs.
A lot on here say the rear brakes don’t do much but I found having a decent pad in there scrubbed speed off better than having standard pads.
Must admit the stopping power on the track car compared to my standard 182 is a world apart..even from cold they out perform.
Just thought sharing my experiences may help.

Yeah the cars on braided lines running inside the car with a Tilton bias valve so I can get the rears locking up if I want to. I’ve never had a problem with the brakes before, it’s only lately I’ve started having issues and loosing the pedal. Not ideal when you’ve flat in 5th on a narrow road up a mountain and you press the brakes and nothing happens ?

 

[Nathan Evans]

The standard 172 cup lasted long. Sold on the weekend for a tidy bit of profit without advertising it for sale

And I’ve gone down the brembo route off @GrahamS.
Looking forward to trying these out over the next week or so.

I’ve also fitted a new RRS Direct plumbed in extinguisher as mine needed servicing but need upgrading at the end of the year to the bigger system with more nozzles. What a nightmare it was to fit with the dash and seats all in place.

 

[Twingo 1??]

I have the rrs Extinguishers ready to put in the Twingo when I next get a chance!

 

[Nathan Evans]

Test fitted the Brembos tonight.

The new et 38 speedlines fit with no spacers but loads of room with 5mm spacers.

Et40 set only just fit with 5mm spacers

Et38 cup racer don’t fit at all. Would need about 30mm spacer for them to fit ?.


So I either sell the callipers or sell 2 sets of wheels and buy another 2 sets

 

[massivewangers]

The standard 172 cup lasted long. Sold on the weekend for a tidy bit of profit without advertising it for sale
View attachment 1421856
View attachment 1421858

And I’ve gone down the brembo route off @GrahamS.
Looking forward to trying these out over the next week or so.
View attachment 1421857

I’ve also fitted a new RRS Direct plumbed in extinguisher as mine needed servicing but need upgrading at the end of the year to the bigger system with more nozzles. What a nightmare it was to fit with the dash and seats all in place.

Are extinguisher rules changing again, have I missed something? I have an RRS kit with six nozzles, I'm just going to let the car burn if that's now wrong lol

 

[bloke]

The brembo is just big, heavy and has expensive pads. Wilwoods are about 1kg lighter, fit comfortably under 15" wheels and pads are about 1/3 of the price.

 

[Nathan Evans]

The brembo is just big, heavy and has expensive pads. Wilwoods are about 1kg lighter, fit comfortably under 15" wheels and pads are about 1/3 of the price.

Not into the whole willwood thing. s**t disc, small pistons and pads aren’t cheaper for me when I have a big pbs sticker on the bonnet ?

 

[Pauleds]

Willwoods give nothing but trouble, had them on my 205 gti but sold them. Mate also sacked them off from his Darrian.
My AP 4 pots fit under 15" wheels with 295mm rotors and are lighter and much more compact than Brembo

 

[Nathan Evans]

Are extinguisher rules changing again, have I missed something? I have an RRS kit with six nozzles, I'm just going to let the car burn if that's now wrong lol

No that’s fine. It’s the 2.75 and the smaller handheld that’s the issue. They’re ok until 2021 I think. But was pointless me servicing them at £40 a extinguisher then having to chage them anyway when the bigger RRS kit is under £200

 

[Nathan Evans]

After seeing Skoda motorsports post last week with there new R5 evo i thought it would be a cool idea to copy their caliper temperature stickers so see what readings we’re getting.

 

[Nathan Evans]

 

[Nathan Evans]

The next part of the puzzle.

 

[massivewangers]

Nice upgrade that! Get them for a decent price?

 

[Nathan Evans]

Been a little quiet on here recently.

So Thursday night before the rally I took my car to efi to cure a few niggles. He found the throttle position sensor was loosing signal at 2 points in the rpm range. He ran an earth to the ecu and that was it. 9:30 at night and the car wouldn’t run at all.
This resulted in him taking the ecu off his 1000bhp drag car, loading my map and we were back running, and back running for the weekend as I borrowed his ecu for the event.

So the rally itself was the Harry Flatters rally over eypnt. Was my 2nd time there now after my good result there a month earlier. This time we were using a lot more of the roads, 70 stage miles in total and around 100 road miles.

Recce of the stages on the Saturday really helped with the Pacenotes. Now I could fully commit to the notes. Where previously we only had a dvd to go off which can be deceiving especially when you’re heading to a blind crest at 90mph. It was hard to fully commit.


The rally went really well, car didn’t really miss a beat. Only little niggle I had was the throttle linkage. The split pin fell out where it holds the spring. 1 stage with the throttle not returning wasn’t to much of a problem. Luckily in service we opened the bonnet and the spring and linkage was resting on top of the bodies.

I drove the car to the limit all day and came 14th overall, 4th in class and 2nd fastest fwd car behind a 300bhp maxi micra.

Onboard of the last stage which was 13 miles

 

[Mbeau]

That is so cool!!! Love the pictures and on board video. Car looks to be going really well and awsome driving. Takes some balls to drive like that ?

 

[Nathan Evans]

That is so cool!!! Love the pictures and on board video. Car looks to be going really well and awsome driving. Takes some balls to drive like that ?

Thanks mate. Always feel like the onboards never really show the real speed over there.

 

[Tomo3292]

@Nathan Evans whats the engine spec mate?? seems to pull very well indeed.

 

[Chambers_RS]

Massive Balls ?????

 

[Nathan Evans]

@Nathan Evans whats the engine spec mate?? seems to pull very well indeed.

It’s only a standard engine with Jenveys bolted to it, 182 manifold and pms exhaust. 194bhp and 170 lbft, has a lower final drive so gets through the gears a lot quicker

 

[Nathan Evans]

 

[Nathan Evans]

So if you follow me or Evans rallying on social media you’d of seen what happened yesterday.

Started car 17 which with the results I’ve been getting was laughable but i went there to get top 3 overall. Some would say it’s impossible with the cars there but I felt I had the pace on the tight twisty roads as it’s suits the clio over the bigger subaraus. I’d never been to the event before but watched a few onboards on YouTube and felt fairly confident.

Stage 1 went ok. I felt a little to cautious but set the 6th quickest time overall with plenty in the tank to push on a lot more.

SS2 started super fast and was on it from the word go, but soon all went wrong. My co driver called a 4 Right over crest. I come in fully commented flat in 4th to find out the corner was a slow 2 Right whilst on top of the crest.
No way could I get the car round the corner and went straight one hitting the bank at around 60mph. It was some hit.
Back was fairly sore yesterday and my co driver had a bad shoulder but both feel ok today.
Car has some damage but not as bad as first thought. It’s pushed the passenger side of the car back around 5mm creasing the roof, radiator was bent in half, obviously bumper, bonnet and wing but it ripped the two bolts out the front of the box on the lower subframe mount.

It’s been on the jig today getting straightened. Then it’s just a few panels and a fix up. Subframe looks ok, the sumpguard has kept it square. But I’m going to take it off and try the spare just in case

 

[Twingo 1??]

Bad luck Nathan, at least your both ok and walked away.
By the sounds of it the cars not to bad for an off at speed. Keep your chin up as you were setting some very good times.

 

[Nathan Evans]

The shell has now been pulled back straight. So time to inspect the damage, as the car was dropped off to be jigged straight after the event.

2 bent trumpets

Shell was straight but the wheels weren’t

Subframe was bent badly. Probably weakened by the amount of rivnuts needed for the pms sumpguard.

Luckily the £200 clio earned it’s money

Subframe is on along with new wishbone on the passenger side. Just waiting on wings, bumper, bonnet and radiator coming back from having the custom bits welded on it as it’s a golf mk1 rad.

New Jenvey trumpets fitted also but slightly different in shape to what I did have on.

 

[Nathan Evans]

Back in business

All ready for Theee Shires closed road rally on Saturday

 

[massivewangers]

Glad you got it sorted. Good luck for the weekend, should be a good one.

 

[Nathan Evans]

Glad you got it sorted. Good luck for the weekend, should be a good one.

Thanks Jon You venturing out to any rallies over the weekend? Got a few to pick from. I’m going to watch the prom on the Friday night straight from recce

 

[massivewangers]

No don't think I am this weekend. My mate isn't doing the prom this year (for the first time in years). There seems to be quite a few on this weekend, but I am just going to play with the 197 and plot my return lmao

 

[Nathan Evans]

Another small update.

Last minute checks I noticed this

Omp subframe was bent and torn. I seriously wouldn’t like a major off with these. I’ve replaced it with another for this rally but that’s not ideal


New stickers on the service van

The finished car