Clio 172 - slow progress project

[Radugns]

Calipers rebuild is done, have new seals and dust boots and new braided brake lines.

Next week I will receive the new pistons and start assembling the engine

 

[Radugns]

Some fence screws

 

[Radugns]

First day, I've use plastigauge to measure tolerances, everything was good. 1.5 thou on big end and 2 thou on main end.

Hope in this weekend I will have time to put the rings on pistons and assemble the bottom end.
The problem is I cannot find the OE aux pulley for sale on a decent price. Does anyone got one for sale?

Thanks,
Radu

 

[Radugns]

Head is now on. Unfortunately it will be used with 182 inlet for now because I need remap for 197 inlet and did not know where in my country. So for now the standard inlet will be just ok.
Next week I will install the cams and do the magic timing with a custom locking tool.

Bottom end is now complete. Add that black plastic plate and sump.
New tappets and followers for next week

 

[Radugns]

First pic with inlet on

Second pic

And the most important

Radu

 

[Optimista]

Why didnt you go for 197 pistons?

 

[Radugns]

Why didnt you go for 197 pistons?

The head is from a 1*2 and the ports were matched to fit 197 head. The 197 pistons witg 1*2 head will have a very high CR (12.2-12.4:1) for no forged internals.
197 pistons are match with 197head.

 

[Optimista]

I know this is 1*2 head, but you would feel much with 197 pistons. My brother had them in F7R.

 

[Radugns]

I know this is 1*2 head, but you would feel much with 197 pistons. My brother had them in F7R.

The F7R has the CR 9.8:1, so using 197 pistons will bring it to 11:1, like to stock 1*2. So this is fine.

 

[Radugns]

Clean the pins as they were in good shape, add cooper grease on back of pads and ceramic grease on the bolts. Now they should not stuck so easy.

Calipers are ready to be fitted. I wait for a pair of brackets from @OssPoop, he made some perfect brackets in my opinion. Also I will replace the master cylinder with a 23.8mm one. I've done some research about changing the master cylinder and could not get to a conclusion, so I will replace to see how the pedal will feel after.

 

[Adamxx]

Be interested to know about master cylinder, what is the bigger one off?

 

[Radugns]

Be interested to know about master cylinder, what is the bigger one off?

It was and Ate one, bought it brand new. I found to have the same number of outputs, two, like the one used in 172 with ABS. I can send you the part no. of it, but only in the morning.

 

[Usr117063]

Same bore as 197 mc?

 

[Radugns]

Same bore as 197 mc?

Yes, and plug and play

 

[Radugns]

Early Christmas. Thank you, @OssPoop

 

[Clio_fool]

View attachment 1395557
Early Christmas. Thank you, @OssPoop

You're welcome pal. Don't forget to give them a coat of something so they don't rust.

 

[Radugns]

New updates on engine:
I will made some custom cam lockers than can be set for 197 cams timing, grp N timing or what you want. Maybe I will make more of them, not sure now. I managed to get a 197 crankshaft, so I will disassemble the engine again and replace it.

 

[Radugns]

Everything was perfect with brakes, the bigger master cylinder feel just perfect, better brake travel than the stock master cylinder with 2 pot calipers. On that setup I got about 2cm of travel that didn't do anything.
The calipers are at 1mm from the wheel. I use 16mm spacers right now, otherwise the balance from the wheel hit in caliper. Maybe some thin weights solve this.
Thanks again @OssPoop

 

[Optimista]

Master cylinder of of what?

 

[Radugns]

Master cylinder of of what?

I really do not know, was from Ate with 23.8mm cylinder as 197 one, but plug and play for Clio 172 with 12mm thread.
But it is not ok for RHD Clios only for LHD.
Radu

 

[Adamxx]

For RHD cars I’m pretty sure you can use a 197 master cylinder if you get adaptors for the rear brake fittings.

 

[Radugns]

For RHD cars I’m pretty sure you can use a 197 master cylinder if you get adaptors for the rear brake fittings.

Yes, for sure, but you have to bend somehow the brake line, and that one is really strong.

 

[Usr117063]

No adapters needed for rhd 197 mc, straight fit

 

[Optimista]

This is without or with abs? Isn't 23.8 std on 1*2?

 

[Radugns]

Standard 172 mc is 22mm, with abs. I am pretty sure is the same diameter for no abs. For no abs you have to use the peugeot 406 v6 master cylinder

 

[Radugns]

Last bits for this year

 

[Jekyll]

Love this project thread so far.

Keep up the great work ?

 

[Radugns]

Last bit of this year...Whiteline rear ARB.
So next spring plans:
Fit the new engine
Fit the half cage and build some steel posts for it
Fit rear ARB
And hopefully bucket seats and Turinis. They are almost impossible to find in Romania

 

[Adamxx]

15’s might be better if you can get them over brakes? Tyres are a lot cheaper to.

 

[Radugns]

I need to mill 5mm from calipers, maybe I would do it for the price of the tyres. I will not be used so much on track.

15’s might be better if you can get them over brakes? Tyres are a lot cheaper to.

 

[Clio_fool]

I need to mill 5mm from calipers, maybe I would do it for the price of the tyres. I will not be used so much on track.

And 5mm off the bracket to go down to 280 discs. If your not building a track car then you'll not be buying expensive track tyres in 16". I'd stick with 16's because turini's looks ace!

 

[Radugns]

And for this year I am done.
I ended up changing the oil and put new winter tires, also remove the 16mm spacers and try to balance with 2.5 grams weight on the edge. I don't like how it handles with spacers, this was the reason I remove them. et37 is just fine, et21 was too much.

So this is all for this year with my daily Clio.
Thank you again to @NorthloopCup, @OssPoop, @Mbeau and @adir and some friends from Romania, Mihai and Alex. You always help me with all I need. Thank you a lot!

 

[Clio_fool]

And for this year I am done.
I ended up changing the oil and put new winter tires, also remove the 16mm spacers and try to balance with 2.5 grams weight on the edge. I don't like how it handles with spacers, this was the reason I remove them. et37 is just fine, et21 was too much.
View attachment 1397813

So this is all for this year with my daily Clio.
Thank you again to @NorthloopCup, @OssPoop, @Mbeau and @adir and some friends from Romania, Mihai and Alex. You always help me with all I need. Thank you a lot!

Good to see positive progress despite the set backs you had ?. Looking forward to next years updates mate.

 

[cliokanmk1]

Hi Radugns, Why don't you keep using the 2 pot calipers? and is it really work with 300mm disc? because I read another threads that said 300mm is too big for the 2 pot calipers and must to reduce to 290mm.

Thanks!!!

 

[Radugns]

Hi Radugns, Why don't you keep using the 2 pot calipers? and is it really work with 300mm disc? because I read another threads that said 300mm is too big for the 2 pot calipers and must to reduce to 290mm.

Thanks!!!

Hello mate,
Well, tbh the 2pot caliper also need a bigger master cylinder, although the brakes were solid with standard master cylinder, I have around 2cm or a little more of free movement of the brake pedal and because of that the brakes not really bite as stock ones on an emergency brake.
I managed to get a cheap set of brembos and rebuild them, so why not use them.
The only real advantage of Brembo is wide range of racing pads. But for a daily is not the case.
And no, you need 300mm discs, the outer edge of the pads was exactly at the diameter of the disc, not even a mm lost. At least in my case of 2pot calipers.

Thanks,
Radu

 

[Clio_fool]

Hows the pad coverage looking with the brembo's on Radu? Any lip on the disc's?

 

[Radugns]

Hows the pad coverage looking with the brembo's on Radu? Any lip on the disc's?

Hello mate,
There is no lip, are perfect to the diameter of the disc. Only close to hub is a "lip", but that is due to disc size. Also that one was present on 2pot calipers. So you've done not a good job, but a perfect one!

Thanks,
Radu

 

[Clio_fool]

Hello mate,
There is no lip, are perfect to the diameter of the disc. Only close to hub is a "lip", but that is due to disc size. Also that one was present on 2pot calipers. So you've done not a good job, but a perfect one!

Thanks,
Radu

Awesome, I'll stick with those dimensions then!

 

[cliokanmk1]

Hello mate,
Well, tbh the 2pot caliper also need a bigger master cylinder, although the brakes were solid with standard master cylinder, I have around 2cm or a little more of free movement of the brake pedal and because of that the brakes not really bite as stock ones on an emergency brake.
I managed to get a cheap set of brembos and rebuild them, so why not use them.
The only real advantage of Brembo is wide range of racing pads. But for a daily is not the case.
And no, you need 300mm discs, the outer edge of the pads was exactly at the diameter of the disc, not even a mm lost. At least in my case of 2pot calipers.

Thanks,
Radu

Thanks Radugns, I would like to know the 2cm free movement of the brake pedal, is it still have that free movement when using the 197 brembo ?

Thanks!!

 

[Radugns]

Thanks Radugns, I would like to know the 2cm free movement of the brake pedal, is it still have that free movement when using the 197 brembo ?

Thanks!!

The 2 pot caliper has one 40mm diameter piston and one 45mm diameter piston. The volume of brake fluid to move them is smaller than the brembo one where are four 40mm diameter pistons. Although I have never use them with standard master cylinder, the free play 99% should be there. With the bigger master cylinder there is no free play and brakes bite quite well.

Radu