Mk1 F4R/172'd Track Car Project [Year 3 - Engine and Chassis Rebuild]

[Christopher]

Re: Mk1 Hybrid Project

Pisser

 

[f0xy]

Re: Mk1 Hybrid Project

ok, just compression tested all cylinders....

150PSI from every cylinder, surely that means the timing is correct?

Just about to test the ignition order with some little thing from halfrauds, im guessing thats right too

the engine has stopped turning over now, think the starter motor is fucked....can hear the starter going round but it dosent turn the flywheel/crank over.....

arghhhhh!!!

 

[Mark One]

Re: Mk1 Hybrid Project

have you got a new starter on your other engine?
I take it the coilpack is the one from the old working setup? You checked that little cold start injector on the bottom of the manifold?

keep at it mate! you'll get there

 

[f0xy]

Re: Mk1 Hybrid Project

yeah double checked cold start injector earlier, all good

the coilpack was the one i drove there on, so it was working

i have a spare starter yeah, so thats not a problem, just a pain

just tried to test firing order, but batteries flat again lol

 

[JD]

Re: Mk1 Hybrid Project

mate you are having a mare with this damn car!

 

[f0xy]

Re: Mk1 Hybrid Project

just had the cam cover off.....

thats at TDC, not sure which line its meant to line upto like on the box casing?!?

 

[mini-valver]

Re: Mk1 Hybrid Project

IIRC, its supposed to be between the 3 + 2....

 

[dunlop]

Re: Mk1 Hybrid Project

nope its supposed to be on the 2nd line from the front of the car. so it looks correct there.

 

[f0xy]

Re: Mk1 Hybrid Project

used a renault timing pin through the front of the block when we timed it up, dropped in, and there was no movement in the crank at all when tried to move it by hand....so i must have locked it in the right position, and the cams must be right in time with it

 

[Mark One]

Re: Mk1 Hybrid Project

so if its timed up ok, you know it's getting fuel, you know you've got compression, that leaves spark.
Have you checked it's getting a good spark with one of those cheap plastic spark testers?

 

[f0xy]

Re: Mk1 Hybrid Project

i have a set of those four LEDs, that go inbetween the HT Lead and dizzy cap, is that what you mean? Im going to test that when someone gets here with a car so i can hook some jump leads up to my battery to start it

 

[dunlop]

Re: Mk1 Hybrid Project

just looking back on the pictures, it looks like the cams fitted are after market ones. as they have an orange loop around cylinder ones lobes.

 

[f0xy]

Re: Mk1 Hybrid Project

:S hmmmmm, im sure the numbers on them were the renault ones id seen over on clio16valver

 

[dunlop]

Re: Mk1 Hybrid Project

which would make sense about the lobes being in the wrong place...

as some can be used with standard timing but will struggle to start, and even idle.

if i'm right [enter ace venturer] Damnnnn I'm goood[/ace venturer]

 

[dunlop]

Re: Mk1 Hybrid Project

pull the cams out and have a look on the end of the cams it'll either say nothing if they're standard or they'll have something like BP270 or something.

 

[f0xy]

Re: Mk1 Hybrid Project

surely there has to be pics of an open williams head somewhere for me to compare, as I dont want to be taking the belt off and cams fully out and then find out it wasnt the timing?

im 99.99999% sure they are standard, as the guy took the head off his williams which the bottom end had gone, and said he had never done any work to the engine, and it was standard...

 

[dunlop]

Re: Mk1 Hybrid Project

its just confusing that the lobes are very far apart almost like its timing is way out, but, the timing marks are bang on.

have a look for pics of the cams.

 

[f0xy]

Re: Mk1 Hybrid Project

from williamsclio.co.uk

thats the dizzy end, and it looks like the same sort of timing as mine is, same angles to each other i mean

 

[dunlop]

Re: Mk1 Hybrid Project

those coloured bands usually indicate aftermarket. my mate had a set of pipers in his williams and they had the coloured bands as did the ones in my almera gti. do you know if thats in the timed up pos?

 

[Christopher]

Re: Mk1 Hybrid Project

FFS! No luck!

Dunlop's idea sounds plausable though! Phone the engine builder and ask him?

 

[f0xy]

Re: Mk1 Hybrid Project

i bought the head from someone on clio16valver, and ive built the engine u numpty lol

 

[Christopher]

Re: Mk1 Hybrid Project

Meh, oh aye. LOL

Phone Winston about the banding on the cams then? He's seen a few OE Willy cams in his time!

 

[Djw John]

Re: Mk1 Hybrid Project

Check the strength of the spark by taking a plug out, re-connecting it to the HT lead and grounding it on the head. Get a mate to turn the engine over, should be a blue spark, its its yellow the the spark is too weak. Oh and dont hold the metal on the plug itself

 

[f0xy]

Re: Mk1 Hybrid Project

I think i have found the problem....thanks to someone over on clio16valver, will try now and see if it fires up...

 

[dunlop]

Re: Mk1 Hybrid Project

whats been suggested?

 

[f0xy]

Re: Mk1 Hybrid Project

The actual timing marks are in the red circles, why the f**k anyone would put white marks on the pullies if they were not for timing i dont know, the little indents on the pullies (circled) are the timing marks....so each pulley is 90 degrees out....

Im going to re-do all that now, and see what happens, this could explain it.....didnt hear any noises when cranking to suggest bent valves, and the compression was good, so we shall have to see...

 

[dunlop]

Re: Mk1 Hybrid Project

oh aye, i just assumed your white marks were correct!

having said that, 90 degrees cam wise is quite a bit! you wouldnt hear valves bending.my mate when he was mucking about with his timing advanced it too much and it clipping valves and was very tappy.

but from the timing marks you've retarded it so you should be fine

 

[f0xy]

Re: Mk1 Hybrid Project

so did i dude, the other head that was on had white marks painted over the OE ones now i come to think of it, so i took that as granted this time round

 

[dunlop]

Re: Mk1 Hybrid Project

easy mistake, but its this mistakes where you get off lightly that make you remember more imo!

 

[Daz Clio Cup]

Re: Mk1 Hybrid Project

I knew it was a timing problem, cams just looked wrong to me

 

[Mark One]

Re: Mk1 Hybrid Project

FFS! after all that. Good spot by the guy on Clio16valver. It's an easy mistake to make. I had assumed you'd put the white marks on tbh!

I've got my fingers crossed for your valves fella. Hope it's ok.

 

[iimushroomzii]

Re: Mk1 Hybrid Project

Hope the valves aint fuckered mate! Cant understand why there would be white marks and timing marks though! Confusing!

 

[dunlop]

Re: Mk1 Hybrid Project

by the looks of where the marks are i'm guessing it's where the bottom of the rocker cover would be.

 

[f0xy]

Re: Mk1 Hybrid Project

ok ive timed it up, just going to get some pics up of the cams for someone to verify now its properly in time, then will put it back together

 

[Jay Payne]

Re: Mk1 Hybrid Project

is it timed up properly?

Told you

lucky not to bend all those lovely new valves

 

[bmh.01]

Re: Mk1 Hybrid Project

Don't think you've bent valves if you've managed 150psi compression personally. Heres hoping!

 

[f0xy]

Re: Mk1 Hybrid Project

my other engine had white marks on the pullies, and looking at those closer someone had put the white on top of the OE marks, so it worked....this time i just took it for granted....

now its retimed, im told cylinder one should be exactly like it is...

and the pullies line up to the cam cover perfectly...

now to put it back together

 

[Jay Payne]

Re: Mk1 Hybrid Project

Obviously someone has done a cambelt change before and not used the standard timing marks, just made their own

 

[Mark One]

Re: Mk1 Hybrid Project

the tension is killing me

 

[Jay Payne]

Re: Mk1 Hybrid Project

Don't think you've bent valves if you've managed 150psi compression personally. Heres hoping!

I was just saying he was lucky, those painted marks could of been anywhere on the pulleys