My ITB'd 172 cup fast road/ track car project

[Cup_Phil]

The whole trumpet length argument is quite a tricky one

I know tuners who insist that the longer the trumpet length the lower down the torque will be - but I also now some very good mappers that say it makes no difference whatsoever - which I saw proven on a 350Z last month when we trialled various trumpet lengths and remapped each time and it made virtually identical power and torque curves with all

I'm sticking with 90mm as they fit well in the engine bay, allow enough room for an airbox or sausage filter and a few people have said they get power loss with 60mm.

 

[Dan519]

definitely makes a difference, but it's not a case of longer the better right across the board

we tried these out during mapping of a williams

made a huge difference to the shape of the torque curve, pushing the peak down the revs

Have also trialed different lengths on 2 litre zetec, and doing from a 60 to a 90 lost 5bhp.

In general though, the F4R does like length

 

[LIL B]

How much difference is there with different sized flared ends?

 

[LewisTaylor]

definitely makes a difference, but it's not a case of longer the better right across the board

we tried these out during mapping of a williams

made a huge difference to the shape of the torque curve, pushing the peak down the revs

Have also trialed different lengths on 2 litre zetec, and doing from a 60 to a 90 lost 5bhp.

In general though, the F4R does like length

That looks mental lol will definatly be in touch after christmas as I'm looking at getting cam's done so can discuss trumpet's then, reason I'm so interested in getting different trumpets is when Matt at TDF mapped and RR'd the car he said it was roughly 5bhp & 5flb's of torque down from where it should be so need to try and find where my car was loosing the power

 

[LewisTaylor]

had the day off today so decided to get my polo rad on.

firstly got the bumper off, car is only jacked up a little bit to get a bit more space to bolt for front bumper

old radiator came out really easilly tbh

compared the size's of them, polo rad is alot thicker and a bit longer, so probably isnt much difference in surface area to the original

got the new rad on, again fairly strait forward, my home made mounts worked a treat (i did put the nuts on the bolts just didnt get a picture, also cut the thread down shorter too.)

bumper back on and done was very nervous waiting to see if the fan came on and worked lol but it did in the end, very happy with this, so much more space in the engine bay, and loads more space around my ITB's.

Next weekend should see my B14's fitted, just trying to get hold of a whiteline ARB and some solid top mounts for then, do the lot at once

the eagle eyed viewer's will notice in my last picture i got some Red 8.5 Magnecore HT leads, and they are not on the car now, reason being is i'm saving them for best (CS meets, RR day's, Trackday's etc)

 

[DannyR]

I'll run that bung over to you if your about tomorrow afternoon mate?

 

[LewisTaylor]

I'll run that bung over to you if your about tomorrow afternoon mate?

Did text you back earlier, work went tit's up today as van broke down and went passed GSF so grabbed one in there so I could do it today and spend the rest of the weekend with the lovelly girlfriend =/ lol thanks for the offer tho mate

 

[Chri5]

Lewis, there's a whiteline arb for sale on here if you haven't spotted it already!

 

[LewisTaylor]

Lewis, there's a whiteline arb for sale on here if you haven't spotted it already!

I'm winning one on eBay ATM not to worried about an arb ATM as that can easily be popped on at any time, want some solid top mounts more than anything as I don't want to be fitting my front suspension then taking it off again to do top mounts at a later date lol

Thanks for letting me know though I think once this is done I won't be spending any more on car for a while, got Christmas then car insurance is up for renewal :/

Got the girlfriend on the case of getting me some 90mm trumpets, reverie carbon air box & pippercross air filter for Christmas, will tidy up engine bay over Christmas too

 

[Chris205]

I'm winning one on eBay ATM

I'm watching that, no doubt some mong will end up paying more than its actually worth, have a word with balance motorsport if you dont win that one, they're always spot on with me and have the ARB to you by next day.

I was really hopinmg you'd fit the billsteins before solid top mounts or rear ARB as I'm really keen to see how they are just as an upgrade in themselves.

With the Rear ARB on the car it will be completely transformed and it will be hard to tell if the suspension has made much improvement over standard if you put the lot on at once

 

[Darklite]

B14's are excellent on the cup, they are quite firm at low speed, but are very controlled at high speed. I think you would have to be doing something really outrageous to unsettle them.

I have them with standard top mounts.

The damping is fine for road use, you feel the bumps but they don't upset the car, i don't really think that it needs to be adjustable, as the damping is well resolved.

The arb makes that car even more direct and willing to change direction, it feels like it has a little rear wheel steering. It takes a little getting used to.

I think you should try them seperately, the arb makes a profound difference, which would mask the effect on the b14's.

B14's and an arb really improve the clio, together they are a superb road setup, solids mounts are next to try.

 

[MR.172 Cup]

Loving This Thread Lewis! Car Looks Amazing! What Colour Are The Turini's? Look Like They Have a Hint Of Blue Or am I Going Colour Blind?
would you recommend getting throttle bodies? can you notice the power?

 

[LewisTaylor]

Thanks for the replies, I did actually fit the rear springs and shocks this weekend as I had a spare hour, ad I must say already it's totally transformed the rear of the car this is even though the rears need ajusting as it isn't level ATM, can't wait to get the fronts on now

Was holding out for a second hand set of solid top mounts but non came up, I saw that they all ranged from 150-200 new just for the solid top mounts so I thought f*ck it I'll treat my self and bought the pure Motorsport kit with strut brace means I do have a spare omp front strut brace if anyone wants it?

The turini's were meant to be dOne anthracite but they were done with this hint of blue in it, I didn't complain as it looked different, and that's rare on clio's

I'd totally recomend the throttle bodies so much more power, but I think they are only worth it if you do track days, as not having the electronic throttle is a bugger crawling through start stop traffic

 

[daveski]

Cars looking great.

I never found the cable throttle a pain in my old phase 1 or is the traffic thing just when you have ITBs?

 

[domsclio182]

Looking good mate glad you removed the slam panel looks much better,bigger trumpets and cams will be good.Mine is down at TDF at the moment having a new dephaser (that was what was making the noise) and cam belt will be getting it on there RR after its done hope to see a better figure than at FMS.

 

[LewisTaylor]

Cars looking great.

I never found the cable throttle a pain in my old phase 1 or is the traffic thing just when you have ITBs?

Sorry, didn't mean cable throttle's but the standard is electronic, and i dont know what they call it but all modern cars have a thing so that if there's not enough throttle while pulling away it stops it stalling, you loose all that with ITB's so you have to give it some rev's pulling away lol anyone at the fms rr meet will confirm that as rindy of fms stalled the car driving it onto dyno lol

Dom don't think cams are gonna happen for a long while as I need to stop spending on car lol gonna get my trumpets sorted, get it mapped, ITB's balanced and she should be running a treat then

You can get a good comparison between our cars at tdf mine made 192.3 there a few weeks before we were at snetterton let me know how you get on

Did I read you posted than rindy will be at snetterton on the 9th, as I'm pretty sure I will be going, would be good to have a chat with him

 

[fotofrog]

Love this car.. what a beast !

Only joined today but if i get my 172 back on the road by the 9th ill pop up to Snet and say hey !

 

[Jamiehudson]

How much for the strut brace mate? Pm me

Ps the car is amazing wish I had the spare cash you must have mate

 

[LewisTaylor]

How much for the strut brace mate? Pm me

Ps the car is amazing wish I had the spare cash you must have mate

I've got someone from Norwich offering me cash which is better, so if he doesn't have it I'll let you know

Thanks I'm no better off than most tbh! I'm just tight and buy as much as I can second hand, and as cheap as possible most parts I've had a few months just been so busy as I recently moved house and have been working away so are only now getting fitted

It also helps when your girlfriend thinks your saving to buy a house and it's really just going on the Clio haha

Love this car.. what a beast !

Only joined today but if i get my 172 back on the road by the 9th ill pop up to Snet and say hey !

Come along good to meet new people

 

[Chri5]

So who got the Whiteline arb on ebay then? I was tempted, but thought better of it for now lol

 

[Dan519]

I'd totally recomend the throttle bodies so much more power, but I think they are only worth it if you do track days, as not having the electronic throttle is a bugger crawling through start stop traffic

Sorry, didn't mean cable throttle's but the standard is electronic, and i dont know what they call it but all modern cars have a thing so that if there's not enough throttle while pulling away it stops it stalling, you loose all that with ITB's so you have to give it some rev's pulling away lol anyone at the fms rr meet will confirm that as rindy of fms stalled the car driving it onto dyno lol

yeah......thats not setup right at all

 

[LewisTaylor]

yeah......thats not setup right at all

Hmmm I really need the get my car looked at tbh... Want to come to see you Danny just a pain in arse to get to Bedford :/

I honestly dot know who won that Chris lol

 

[Jonny1*2]

what cams is it running? management etc? Seems a bit strange that.

 

[DannyR]

Standard Cams and Omex

 

[Silent_Scone]

yeah......thats not setup right at all

lol never ever had idle problems even from cold, on full lock VERY rarely if you're dozing you can stall it - in 3 years I think I have twice!

only time you have to give it a tiny bit of gas is when it's stone cold on turn over

 

[Chris205]

I honestly dot know who won that Chris lol

Lol well done mate, the warning came up on my phone telling me it was ending soon but I was too busy doing the top gear challenge on forza lol. Glad you didnt pay over the odds for it, you'll love every minute of it

 

[Jamiehudson]

That's amazing mate think she'll find out sooner or later mate! I'm the other side of that predicament having just brought a house... But I am tight as hell and buy everything off here or eBay, the best way really cheers for giving me second dibs tho mate

 

[domsclio182]

Sorry, didn't mean cable throttle's but the standard is electronic, and i dont know what they call it but all modern cars have a thing so that if there's not enough throttle while pulling away it stops it stalling, you loose all that with ITB's so you have to give it some rev's pulling away lol anyone at the fms rr meet will confirm that as rindy of fms stalled the car driving it onto dyno lol

Dom don't think cams are gonna happen for a long while as I need to stop spending on car lol gonna get my trumpets sorted, get it mapped, ITB's balanced and she should be running a treat then

You can get a good comparison between our cars at tdf mine made 192.3 there a few weeks before we were at snetterton let me know how you get on

Did I read you posted than rindy will be at snetterton on the 9th, as I'm pretty sure I will be going, would be good to have a chat with him

Rindy did say he might go haven't spoke to him since rr day,I should be there if I get the car back in time to book up,will let you know how the cars gets on at Tdf.

 

[LewisTaylor]

Rindy did say he might go haven't spoke to him since rr day,I should be there if I get the car back in time to book up,will let you know how the cars gets on at Tdf.

Ah right would be good for him to have a look around the car if he's there, yeah keep me posted mate

That's amazing mate think she'll find out sooner or later mate! I'm the other side of that predicament having just brought a house... But I am tight as hell and buy everything off here or eBay, the best way really cheers for giving me second dibs tho mate

Haha yeah true, that will come soon for me I guess :/ should be buying next July providing nothing goes wrong between now and then

Lol well done mate, the warning came up on my phone telling me it was ending soon but I was too busy doing the top gear challenge on forza lol. Glad you didnt pay over the odds for it, you'll love every minute of it

Haha your as bad as me with forza, the girlfriend moans coz I ignore her when Im on that I can't wait to get it

lol never ever had idle problems even from cold, on full lock VERY rarely if you're dozing you can stall it - in 3 years I think I have twice!

only time you have to give it a tiny bit of gas is when it's stone cold on turn over

Don't have idle problems, but I did a few weeks ago when the car wasn't running right, a good service, new leads and plugs solved that one, mine is the same on cold, that's pretty much what I mean about the stalling, what I'm trying to say is it isn't as easy to drive as it was before. I notice this more as the Clio isn't my daily so can tell the difference when I get in it

 

[Jamiehudson]

If anything goes wrong she'll probably dump you for that! And you'll be living in your Clio!! You know what women are like no idea haha

 

[LewisTaylor]

busy day today had matt (D4vy) round to help. fitted my B14 coilovers, pure motorsport front strut brace with solid top mounts, and whiteline arb all went ok in the end, only problem was the strut brace is now where my coil pack was, so going to have to order a k-tech one to go on the side of the engine now.

no pictures as it was dark be time i finished, cant really test it at the moment as the coil pack is loose lol, really want to give it a good test now

been doing the maths tonight, with christmas, dont think i'm gonna make snetterton on the 9th December, so will save the car for the new year i think.

 

[Chri5]

Nice on on fitting all the bits......Im interested as to how the ARB performs, although it may be masked a bit by all the other bits you've added lol

D'oh on the track day!!

 

[LewisTaylor]

Nice on on fitting all the bits......Im interested as to how the ARB performs, although it may be masked a bit by all the other bits you've added lol

D'oh on the track day!!

from what i've read on here it makes a big difference hopefully i can sort a coil park mount next week/week after then i can give it a good test should be able to tell the difference as i fitted the rear coilover's last week so will report back after i've tested. it was only the fronts i done this weekend, as i was waiting to get solid top mounts.

i may still come as yet, but the girlfriend wants to do christmas shopping next weekend so i shall be skint after that lol

 

[Chri5]

I keep umming and arring about getting one but I need my sensible head on for a few weeks at least while getting this house malarky sorted. Or Ill be in trouble with the girlfriend haha

It can be your present from her

 

[LewisTaylor]

I keep umming and arring about getting one but I need my sensible head on for a few weeks at least while getting this house malarky sorted. Or Ill be in trouble with the girlfriend haha

It can be your present from her

she's buying me some 90mm jenvey trumpets, reverie carbon airbox & pipercross airfilter

 

[LewisTaylor]

was bored today so decided to 'bodge' a coil pack mount so that i could test the new handling parts i fitted yesterday all i can say is i'm absolutly amazed by it, car isn't much worse than standard for casual driving was hard to notice the difference, but when i nailed it through the corners, the steering felt so much more direct and accurate, the whole car felt absolutly solid and handled like it was on rail's.

FAO chri5, as said before i'd already fitted the b14 rear suspension, but fitted the whiteline yesterday, and that made a hell of alot of difference.

i'm so pleased with my car really need to get it on a track day now

here are the pictures, sorry about quality, poor light & iphone.

Bodged coil pack mount, puremotorsport strut brace & solid top mounts

Whiteline arb & b14 rear's

New low's, would go lower, but already catching front bumper on my drive lol

that's gonna be the last of new parts now untill after christmas, need to save some money now. the current spec of my car is:

Engine & exhaust:
-Jenvey ITB's, 40mm trumpets & ITG airfilter
-Omex 600 (require's remap atm)
-Magnecore red 8.5mm leads (track day's only just so i know i have a set of leads that won't fail)
-Mocal oil cooler
-Polo rad and slim fan
-182 heatwrapped manifold
-Decat
-Oreca group N race exhaust
-k-tech solid engine, gear box mount's
-polybushed dog bone mount

Chassis:
-Bilstein B14 coilover's
-whiteline ARB
-Puremotorsport strut brace & solid top mounts
-omp rear strut brace
-Team dynamic pro race 1.2's 15" et36

Brakes:
-Brembo HC disks
-Brembo braided lines
-Ferrado DS2500 pads
-Super blue racing brake fluid

Interior:
-Stripped rear of car
-Cobra monaco s seats
-TRS harness
-Momo steering wheel boss and EK steering wheel
-Uniroyal RS2 tyres

Exterior:
-Anthracite badges & bullets
-TRS tow strap
-Aerocatch's
-Trophy spoiler
-CTR aerial
-silvertec bulbs
-3/4 front plate

as said i'm done untill after christmas, when my girlfriend is getting me trumpets etc, will hopefully then get it booked in for a remap.i also have a refurbed gearbox in my garage that i will hopefully get fitted in the new year.

any spare time i get now, i may remove front carpets, headlining, door card's and de tar all the interior. would also like to tidy up the engine bay with some VHT paint.

Future plan's are (in order of i'd like to get them done):
-remove sub frame, wishbones and front arb, get it fully pollybushed and paint it up.
-roll cage
-catcam's 421's
-Carbon fibre bonnet
-respray front and rear bumpers
-perhaps some better seats in the future, but that's least of my priorites

thanks for looking

Lewis

 

[d4vy]

Good to see the arb the right way mate.

 

[Chri5]

Looking good! I think I might have to get me an ARB for sure, but will have to weigh up current funds

 

[dmallett]

I like! Where did you get the exhaust from? Kinda fancy one for my ph1!

 

[LewisTaylor]

I like! Where did you get the exhaust from? Kinda fancy one for my ph1!

its from k-tec, i was brave in getting it as a lot of people of here gave them a bad review, saying it was poorly made, but mine is made really well, also the sound is lush

but for £10 less you can have a JP exhaust from them, but the oreca i have includes a decat, and only has one silencer don't forget tho CS members get 5% off from them too

Looking good! I think I might have to get me an ARB for sure, but will have to weigh up current funds

do what i'm doing to try and make snetterton on the 9th, i've had a clear out and put a few bits for sale on here and ebay fingers crossed lol