Trophy Track Car

[Cup_Phil]

No this was after he had the new engine fitted and remapped

There was about 6 of us in Clios having a test - we both left all the 172/182's behind by a long way but he couldn't keep up with mine - it pulled an easy 5 or 6 car lengths over him
Soon as you get over 5k the bodies pull like a steam train

But yes I agree there is a £500 difference - for me the noise and extra torque is worth it, but I get criticized for spending too much time building the car and not enough driving it - so if you just want to just get out on track and hoon about the RS2 is a cheaper option

 

[Nick172Cup]

Not that I'm so bothered about the RS2, but isn't it being put on hold for 6 months?
​so not really ideal at present anyhow.

Ill keep an eye out for a second hand one for you Kelv, will be even cheaper than a new kit. Plus I know someone on CS selling the extensions as well for less than half what Jenvey sell them at. Up to you though mate, I love a bit of carbon me, having seen some of your fleet I know youre the same!

 

[Cup_Phil]

LOL I'm not suprised Dave to be honest with the state of the map that was on it when I bought it

RS2 isn't on hold so much - they've put the group buy on hold because not enough people were interested in it. You can buy it now for £1,145 but there's a 4-6 week typical delivery timescale as each kit is ordered on demand

ITB's aren't twice the price - £2k brand spanking new, full kit including fuel rail and OMEX 600. You could run a borrowed map from someone like me on here and get a couple of hundred quid tweek so around £2,200 against £1,500 ish
And like I say if you find a 2nd hand kit the price difference isn't anywhere near that amount

 

[Cup_Phil]

What the hell - how did my posts end up out of order? Hahah

 

[Kelv]

Nick, that's not a bad shout, keep me posted please buddy.
its not as if I'm shy about cutting the car about to make it fit

must admit, I think I'd much rather the inlet housing in satin black than carbon, aiming to have zero carbon on this car... Or atleast that's how I'm aiming to keep it

 

[Chip-mk1]

Kelv, for what you want, I think ITBs would suit you better than an RS2 mate, and Ive had plenty of experience of building/mapping/driving both setups so am not just comparing from one car to another but for a good selection of both.

You dont need to worry about mapping costs either, I can do it for you on the road for just fuel money for most of the map and then an hour or two on the rollers to finish off, so you arent even talking a couple of hundred quid all in.

If it was largely a road car too I would say go for the RS2, its a lot nicer to live with than bodies, but for what you want I think bodies are better, especially as you will no doubt end up with forged bits and cams etc later on anyway.

 

[Cup_Phil]

^^ I agree with this - I don't even think you'd need the road mapping

If you took the map I have and whacked it on - when we went to map mine on the rollers it was sooooo close that it could have been done in an hour - but I wanted more work done at the time hence the £300

 

[Tony Hunter]

but I get criticized for spending too much time building the car and not enough driving ittrack and hoon about the RS2 is a

​Ooo, hello.

 

[Cup_Phil]

love you x

 

[Kelv]

Took the bottom end apart yesterday eve, I'm really thinking it was the rod bolts that let go.
where the bearings would have been between the rods and crank, the crank is still spotless, smooth as I can possibly see, apart from a few burrs on the lobes between each bearing position on the crank.
the piston has pretty much cracked, I assume where its smacked the underside of the head at a funny angle.
Piston rings are mangled to buggery, as can be expected.

looks like the head may have escaped damage aswell, from what I can see I definitely have 2 bent valves, but ill say all 4 are possibly the same.

does anyone know if these heads suffer when the valves bend, or can new guides normally cure the issue at a machine shop.
im tempted to keep hold of the head and possibly have some nice head work carried out for a later spec engine build, along with the crank/flywheel to match to some forged rods and higher comp pistons, again for a nice engine build down the line.

 

[Michael Woodford MST]

Took the bottom end apart yesterday eve, I'm really thinking it was the rod bolts that let go.
where the bearings would have been between the rods and crank, the crank is still spotless, smooth as I can possibly see, apart from a few burrs on the lobes between each bearing position on the crank.
the piston has pretty much cracked, I assume where its smacked the underside of the head at a funny angle.
Piston rings are mangled to buggery, as can be expected.

looks like the head may have escaped damage aswell, from what I can see I definitely have 2 bent valves, but ill say all 4 are possibly the same.

does anyone know if these heads suffer when the valves bend, or can new guides normally cure the issue at a machine shop.
im tempted to keep hold of the head and possibly have some nice head work carried out for a later spec engine build, along with the crank/flywheel to match to some forged rods and higher comp pistons, again for a nice engine build down the line.

Use a ph1 head and get that ported.

Have you removed the centre main cap to see if its spun?

Mike

 

[Kelv]

Ill drop the crank out later Mike and have a closer inspection and keep you posted.

 

[Chip-mk1]

Heads always survive unless its a mega high rpm failure, new set of guides and valves and away you go. Like mike says though you may as well go ph1 head while you are at it.

 

[Kelv]

Chip, Mike, what's the benefits of a Phase 1 head?
especially if I already have a spare 182 head now available?
​

 

[Budgie]

Exhaust ports are bigger iirc.

 

[Michael Woodford MST]

Exhaust ports are bigger iirc.

Correct.

 

[Kelv]

do you have one mike?
​
or, just thinking, if a head is to be sent off for decent headwork, do the exhaust port sizes matter so much?

 

[Michael Woodford MST]

do you have one mike?
​
or, just thinking, if a head is to be sent off for decent headwork, do the exhaust port sizes matter so much?

Depends if who ports it knows enough about Renault heads to port it out enough to be a ported and polished ph1 head. Would take hours tho I'd guess.

I think I have one. I'd have to look and see tho.

 

[Chip-mk1]

The difference is pretty massive. Would need to be port bored to equal it I suspect rather than spending half a day with a due grinder.

 

[Kelv]

Gotcha.

so from a escort Cossie angle, its a clear cut difference the same as a BT or ST head.

 

[Chip-mk1]

Yes mate. Although this is the same casting its greatly different how they are machined from the factory.

 

[Kelv]

With the engine now out, and 187k of road grime taking root around the engine bay, it was time to attack everything with the ste cleaner and plenty of degreaser.
its come up quite well.

and once everything was clean and a bit easier to work on, the standard steering rack, PAS pump, PAS resevoiur ad pipe work has been removed to make way for a DCI non power assiste rack.

 

[BIGASH]

Christ I always forget how much stuff is in the normal engine bays! Don't forget the patch of heavy tar on the drivers side wheel arch (Below and to the left of the engine mount)

Would be rude not to get rid of the ABS while the engines out

 

[Kelv]

I want to get rid of the ABS aswell James, just not sure I've got time to sart running complete new brake lines, nor am i 100% certain what parts i need to source in order to do so.

new engine won't be going in until Monday/Tuesday so it gives me time so get new rack mounts, tidy up the new engine and fit ARP bolts courtesy of Danny @ 519.

just the pickle of the ABS.

my valeting mate questioned that spot in the bay, I wasn't sure if it was or not.... I shall now hop on to it

 

[BIGASH]

Realistically with the engine out it should only take 2-3 hours. You would need a 172 cup master cylinder, 172 cup load valve (goes under the car near the rear beam), copper pipe, a few m10 brake unions and a few m12 ones too. Flaring tool for the lines and a pipe bender and p-clips if you want it to look tarty

If you get stuck trying to find a master cylinder speak to Fred@BTM as I left my spare one there in September so you are welcome to that and just replace it in your own time (If he still has it that is lol)

 

[Kelv]

Thanks buddy, I shall give him a shout tomorrow and see what he has available.
obviously I will replace it as soon as possible.

i have oodles of P clips, I borrowed a few bags from work, each bag as a quantity of 100 and I'm sure they are bags of 4mm, 7mm, 9mm & 12.8mm.
being tarty never hurts

 

[Michael Woodford MST]

I'm DIEING here! Did the centre main spin???

Progress looks good mate. Just rip all the lines out and run new copper. Willwood make an adjustable bias valve so you can get your front and rear correct and don't need the parts from a cup. I have one somewhere actually. I did it on my PH1. Sadly I broke it before I had a chance to see how we'll it worked. But on other cars I've done it too (non clios) it's been fine.

Mike

 

[.J.a.m.e.s.]

Looking good

 

[Kelv]

Mike, I haven't touched the block since, but I will let you know.

​you don't fancy coming over and doing the brake lines do you?
or, if I loaded the car up and dropped it to you Saturday, how long would you need it for to do the lines?

wilwood parts I can source easily if you can't find yours to sell!?

 

[len_beach]

Kelv, buy the lines etc from Jean-Paul S Cup racer. They're good to go and you just need to blank one of the rear ports on the Cup master cylinder.

 

[Kelv]

Len, I'm thinking if the brake lines are easy to manipulate then the state of them after being posted from holland could be disastrous, and to be honest I want the car usable again ASAP as the next trackday is only 3 weeks away.

id do the lines myself, but I haven't a clue what is supposed to go where.
i have a fear with brakes, not knowing what would go where, only because over the years its one thing I've just never had to get involved with.
dont get me wrong, I know know caliper makes and models, along with pad choices with my eyes shut, but even when bleeding them I'm left that to a mate to conquer for me for fear of screwing it up.

on this one, if rather pay someone to fit the new setup, but I'd need it done ASAP.

 

[Martin.]

That bay looks seriously clean now!

 

[Kelv]

Cheers Martin, it was pretty rotten before we started, luckily it was just a collection of several miles of grime building up, and the majority of it came off with ease.
atleat its clean to work on now

 

[len_beach]

What are you doing with the PAS lines Kelv?

 

[Kelv]

Bin them I guess.
as said mate, I don't know what needs to be removed or kept

do I keep my current master cylinder or do I need to change over to a cup variant?

 

[len_beach]

Bin them I guess.
as said mate, I don't know what needs to be removed or kept

do I keep my current master cylinder or do I need to change over to a cup variant?

I'll take them if they're going begging bud. I want to have a set shortened for my Saxo pump. Don't think you need them at all with the DCI rack.

 

[JonC219]

I could be chatting out my ass... But I'm sure I read somewhere you can use a Peugeot 406 (iirc) master cylinder as it uses a bigger master cylinder.

More brake pressure for less effort?

 

[MG cup]

Kelv, buy the lines etc from Jean-Paul S Cup racer. They're good to go and you just need to blank one of the rear ports on the Cup master cylinder.

Len did you buy a set of lines from Jeanpaul? I was toyed myself but didn't think they would travel well tbh.

 

[Chip-mk1]

I could be chatting out my ass... But I'm sure I read somewhere you can use a Peugeot 406 (iirc) master cylinder as it uses a bigger master cylinder.

More brake pressure for less effort?

A bigger diameter cylinder requires more effort to move but needs to move less distance.

 

[len_beach]

Len did you buy a set of lines from Jeanpaul? I was toyed myself but didn't think they would travel well tbh.

I bought some from the Martin a while ago. They travelled really well and don't stress when bent. Well worth it as I paid about £175 when a bias valve alone is £100.