RB PH1 172 Rally Car Progress

[Hazza462]

Came extremely close to starting the car with the new loom & ECU yesterday.
Turned over fine, everything had power that needed it, but wouldn't start up. Ran out of time and as soon as I got home I realized I'd put in the wrong values into the crank trigger pattern table 🤦‍♂️😂 Will sort this at the weekend and fingers crossed it'll start for the first time in 6 months!

New OBP coolant expansion tank and Stant cap to get rid of the ugly Renault unit and also relocated the catch tank to the location shown in the picture below - after making a little bracket to bridge the gap between suspension turret and front of the car.
All this is in preparation for the arrival of a dry sump tank when we fit the kit in some months to come. It will go in the big gap inbetween the expansion tank & catch tank.

New baseplate ordered with custom max height offset to clear the alternator. Custom height filter will also be in the pipeline shortly.
Perks of the job!

Think the picture below is also the first of the wiring loom fitted to the car.. very pleased with how it turned out, especially as it seems to work and looks the part too!

Also removed all Rad Hoses at the weekend in preparation for some new silicone hoses to dress up the engine bay & prevent any issues with the slightly higher pressure in the system caused by the stant cap.
Went for Red MTC Motorsport hoses which landed today! Great quality and very helpful!

Looking forward to the weekend. It's all starting to come back together finally.

 

[Hazza462]

New coolant hoses fitted now, along with a new custom offset lasercut baseplate and custom height ITG filter to allow perfect fitment around everything in the engine bay, letting the filter and throttle bodies breathe.

Also fitted a new stainless braided breather hose to the catch tank after it's relocation.

I also managed to get the car to start on Saturday for the first time in 8 months and after it's new wiring loom built completely from scratch by me on our living room floor😂😮
The reason it didn't start before was because the Renault CPS doesn't get on with the Omex ECU. Omex originally recommended that I used the Zetec sensor as predicted I would have issues - so that was my first port of call when I couldn't get the Renault one to sync with the ECU.

Changed the sensor, modified the loom and it literally started straight away 🤦‍♂️😂
I was over the moon... Has a weird misfire though for some reason which I will investigate next time. I'm guessing it's something to do with the crank sensor gap to the flywheel as the plugs, coil & leads are pretty much new & the injectors were all fine last time I checked.
Will be an easy fix I'm sure!

Time to get the Aux loom underway now, I've got all the connectors ready to go just need to measure up and we're good to go!

In the meantime here's a few pics to celebrate..😂

 

[Twingo 1??]

Looking good buddy. What are you planning on doing when your back in the stages this year?

 

[Hazza462]

Looking good buddy. What are you planning on doing when your back in the stages this year?

Cheers mate, not sure if we'll be out this year tbh. Will all depend on funds as don't want to skint myself finishing the car off. Although it would be nice to do one late in the year - perhaps Anglesey or Oulton Park.

 

[Twingo 1??]

Ah cool. It should be quite potent when it all gets finished

 

[DaveL485]

Blimey, that was quite a read from the start to end...what a journey! Great thread! I found the thread from researching the compbrake brake setup you didn't get along with. I've been looking at one to use on my project as an option, along with a servo conversion and a few variations of both. OE is a non-servo electronic assist accumulator and a master cylinder with the ABS tech built in to it. Its not man enough for the big brake upgrade I am doing so the whole ABS system is coming out.
If you have the old system you took out still would you mind measuring the 4-stud stud spacing that bolts to the bulkhead? It should match my Renault 21 but wanna check. Also can you measure the protrusion of the pedal rod from the inner side of the master please?

Finally if you can access can you measure the diameter of the OE 182 brake servo unit? That's another option, I wanted to use a 197 one but its about 10mm too big and fouls the suspension turret. Thanks

 

[Hazza462]

Blimey, that was quite a read from the start to end...what a journey! Great thread! I found the thread from researching the compbrake brake setup you didn't get along with. I've been looking at one to use on my project as an option, along with a servo conversion and a few variations of both. OE is a non-servo electronic assist accumulator and a master cylinder with the ABS tech built in to it. Its not man enough for the big brake upgrade I am doing so the whole ABS system is coming out.
If you have the old system you took out still would you mind measuring the 4-stud stud spacing that bolts to the bulkhead? It should match my Renault 21 but wanna check. Also can you measure the protrusion of the pedal rod from the inner side of the master please?

Finally if you can access can you measure the diameter of the OE 182 brake servo unit? That's another option, I wanted to use a 197 one but its about 10mm too big and fouls the suspension turret. Thanks

Cheers mate, unfortunately sold the setup a few months back so can't measure any of that. My servo is covered by a heat shield also and not really accessible to measure either from memory - sorry I couldn't be of any help.

 

[Hazza462]

Fixed the small misfire was a dropped injector... again, so changed it for a spare and now runs lovely. Sounds so good with the ITB's!

Finished & fitted a steering wheel panel that I designed & made completely from scratch.

Started with a Grabcad steering wheel model, drew up a panel around that to get the profile and sent it off to a contact from work to have cut out of 5mm Gloss Black perspex. Then wired up everything using Raychem DR-25 heatshrink & created a curly cord, using appropriately gauged wire unlike the ones commonly found in 'off-shelf' curly cords. TE Connectivity CPX series connector on the end too for a positive, reliable connection with a twist lock for peace of mind it will never pull out, even if the curly cord was under any stress. Finished the panel off by sealing the back of the buttons with a black adhesive to prevent any water ingress on the terminals & wire.

Really happy with how this has turned out, especially for a first go!

CAD Model designed around steering wheel.

Printed 1:1 to check dimensions are all correct.

Finished pictures:

And finally fitted! 😍

Also made another rope mockup loom for the Auxiliary harness yesterday, so will get onto this ASAP! After that there's not a great deal needs doing before the car can be tracked & mapped.

 

[Hazza462]

Also fitted a new BRT Motorsport quick rack which I appear to have completely forgotten about mentioning on this blog, a good couple of months ago now 😂
Hence the need for re-alignment.

 

[DaveL485]

Cheers mate, unfortunately sold the setup a few months back so can't measure any of that. My servo is covered by a heat shield also and not really accessible to measure either from memory - sorry I couldn't be of any help.

No worries, I actually stumbled on a Renault 21 Manual brake servo last week, snapped it up and the 197 brake master is a straight fit...which is nice haha!

 

[MaddRT]

what rad are you running with the bodies Haz?

 

[Hazza462]

what rad are you running with the bodies Haz?

Just had a look back through my purchases on eBay and it's a Golf III VR6 Direnza alloy one

 

[Hazza462]

Pretty much finished up the wiring jobs yesterday at the car. Managed to finish the second loom thanks to the lockdown and surprisingly everything on that one works too!
Very impressed with my planning of everything , did final tests of everything yesterday and everything seems to work perfectly!

One of the final jobs yesterday was mounting the fusebox/ECU plate that I had laser cut last week - happy with how thats turned out too.

Labels on the fuse box lids - documenting which relay/fuse is for what component and their ampage rating.

Couple pictures showing the tidyness of the new custom looms compared to the ragged old Renault one! Definitely the best thing I've done to the car, very satisfying designing literally everything electrical related from scratch and putting it into use - knowing it will be 10x more reliable than the Renault stuff 😂

Couple of tidying up jobs to do like re-painting sections of the inside and think I will re-do the fire extinguisher hoses to neaten them up also.
Both extinguishers need servicing so thats fun!

Will be contacting EFI Parts in a month or so to book it in for a day of mapping once everything is finished up with the car again.

 

[Hazza462]

Interior of the car has been freshened up with a few patches of paint here and there and is looking good as new again after much trampling in and out of messing with wires.

Messy extinguisher pipes are only temporary as they will be removed and replaced neatly with a brand new kit from SPA (Massive thanks to my friend Tom who works there!!) and a new SPA Handheld too. Literally done 2 rally's with these extinguishers and one of them is good as scrap and the other needs a service.. gotta love MUK regulations!

View attachment 1489920

I've also booked the car in for a remap at EFI on 26th October - hopefully will be no issues! Need to buy and fit some 225 injectors before then and I think we're good to go after that!

 

[massiveCoRbyn]

Looking good in there

 

[Hazza462]

So much to our amazement everything at EFI went to plan yesterday and looks like we've got a strong engine!

The car made 191Bhp/165Lb-ft which I'm chuffed with for an engine that's only had AT Power ITB's, Group N timing & 225 Injectors - with no port work etc.

Chris said the cams & 172 manifold would now be the restricting factor power wise but that he was happy with the results.

Sounds absolutely incredible and from my short drive up the industrial estate the throttle response is night and day over standard. The quick rack is also very very responsive! Exciting to drive the car again for the first time in over a year.

Few little bits and bobs to finish the car off and we will be ready to go in the new year. Possibly thinking of doing Agbo Stages at Weston Park , hopefully if Covid allows anyway.
Can't wait to give it a good drive out somewhere and enjoy it with its many many upgrades since last time it was out.

 

[Chambers_RS]

nice work 👍
is the dry sump on yet?

 

[Hazza462]

nice work 👍
is the dry sump on yet?

Thankyou!
It's not no, still in two minds to sell all the bits or eventually build a second 'proper' engine up slowly out of the car to replace the current one.

 

[Chambers_RS]

Thankyou!
It's not no, still in two minds to sell all the bits or eventually build a second 'proper' engine up slowly out of the car to replace the current one.

🙋🏻‍♂️ I’d still be interested if you sell

 

[Hazza462]

🙋🏻‍♂️ I’d still be interested if you sell

Sent you another message about it mate, guessing you accidentally missed the first one as never received a reply from last time?

 

[Hazza462]

Not updated this for ages as usual for some reason!

We've been using the time spent in lockdown with no events on to do some upgrades to the car.

First one was we never really were a massive fan of the fuel tank firewall, due to the pain in the arse it was always to remove and not really being able to see a great deal of what's under it.
After the dyno session we noticed a small leak from the fuel filter while sprucing up the underside of the car. We thought this was the ideal time to take it all out and make something a lot easier to work with.

After removing the tank/pump/filter/lines etc we were left with a blank canvas to work with to make a new firewall that would be easy to work with quickly on rally's and easy to take the tank out or anything inside the firewall should there ever be a problem.

We started by making a framework out of steel box section, welding the frame together off the car and then welding it to the chassis in various places either directly to the body or via small sheet metal joiner sections to ensure everywhere was sealed. Any small gaps were then sealed up with tigerseal and everything will be painted over.

Few pictures below sort of half way through the process before it was welded and sealed in fully, didn't take any while it was all still bare metal -

Once it was all welded and sealed in, everything was given another covering of paint before re-fitting the tank and everything else within the new firewall.

The plan for the lid of the firewall and front piece, is to have clear 5mm Polycarbonate with some gasket foam to ensure a seal. This way everything will be nicely visable should there ever be any issues and it needs to be removed quickly. Rivnuts that have been put into the box section on the top and front of the frame will allow us to bolt through the polycarb sheets and have a nice tidy easily removable solution - much better than before and it also looks much nicer!

The polycarb has been cut and drilled, just not had chance to sort out the gasket foam yet and bolt it on. There's also a couple of areas that need a bit of paint squirting on them before putting the lid back on, where we've tigersealed some last little bits where there were gaps. Overall very happy with the new firewall!

 

[Hazza462]

Other stuff in the pipework for upgrades is the suspension which will be up for sale in the near future if anyones interested. To swap out the Gaz Golds we've decided on going for some proper rally suspension in the form of the Clio Group N Bilstein setup. The Bilsteins I'm hoping will be much more compliant than the Gaz which are a more circuit orientated setup. With the Bilsteins being designed bespoke for the Clio Group N cars, I'm fairly confident this will be a MUCH better suspension setup for rallying!

I've managed to source the rears as per the below diagram brand new from a seller in Switzerland who purchased them straight from the RenaultSport factory in France, have original invoices etc that were included in the parcel. Our 'Ragnotti' set has the 6kg Tarmac rear springs and the 5mm bump stop spacer for reference. Everything still brand new in the original boxes and all still sealed which was pretty cool!

Interesting that Renault chose to use what seem like standard rear top damper bushes, compared to an uprated material. Think I'll stick to the standard Renault units and shelf the powerflex ones that are currently fitted for now and see how we go to keep the kit original when fitting it all.

The plan now is to buy the front Bilstein set from either RenaultSport or Optimiz Access, dependant on who will do the best price!
Ideally hoping to use the lower struts from a Twingo R2 (60mm Spacing) to retain our 60mm Hubs, rather than having the faff of refurbishing our 54mm hubs which the off-shelf kit will be - we'll see. Then as mentioned our Gaz Golds will be up for sale.

Apart from that there's not a great deal that needs doing to the car until it's ready to go rallying again (when we're allowed!). Might just need to take it to a scrutineer to give it the all clear on the new firewall and ITB's, in case they need to take any pictures or note any amendments in the car's passport.

 

[Pauleds]

What was wrong with using a standard plastic tank with a decent guard? Seems a lot of faff just to use an alloy tank which takes up spare wheel access and has a higher centre of gravity at the rear rather than a low cog in the middle??

 

[Hazza462]

What was wrong with using a standard plastic tank with a decent guard? Seems a lot of faff just to use an alloy tank which takes up spare wheel access and has a higher centre of gravity at the rear rather than a low cog in the middle??

Not a lot in particular! Fancied doing something different as don't mind 'faffing', at the end of the day this is much more secure and fairly confident this weighs less than the plastic tank with a proper guard so COG isn't really going to come into play here in the grand scheme of things. It's much of a muchness really, we're not exactly competing at WRC level lol. Doesn't particularly impact spare wheel access either tbh, and persides if you're rushing to change to the spare wheel on stage at a clubman level I think you need to take a chill pill!

 

[Hazza462]

Tank cover is all now complete and back together - happy with how it's turned out and is much more functional than the previous one we made.

New Bilstein Group N suspension is finally on all round and everythings bolted up again good to go. New top mount bearings pressed in and re-fitted as noticed a bit of play in them when fitting up the new front suspension.

Just the tracking to do now and I think it's time for some testing!

Looking good sat in the sun a couple of weeks ago after a full machine polish and removal of the stickers.

Wont be doing any rallying this year... can't bring ourselves to pay the licence/club fee's for what's left of the year. Instead the plan is to do a couple of tests, have some fun and then get some events under our belt next year once Covid has gone!

 

[Twingo 1??]

Looking good. I have shelved my plans for doing any rallying this year also. Still got our accommodation booked for Mull so still going for a few weeks holiday. I am struggling to find a navigator to work with also.

 

[Hazza462]

Looking good. I have shelved my plans for doing any rallying this year also. Still got our accommodation booked for Mull so still going for a few weeks holiday. I am struggling to find a navigator to work with also.

Nice one mate. Don't blame you for not competing either, may aswell enjoy the holiday though haha. Ah that's no good, bet Covids not helped that too!

 

[Hazza462]

Been over a year since this was updated so thought I would post something while I'm bored...
I guess buying & renovating a house puts a damper on playing with cars, but we've still been tinkering away in the background!

The Clio's biggest weakness has always been the dairy milk standard gearbox, which has now finally been replaced earlier this year with an X65 Cup Racer Sadev bought from @Nathan Evans

Box had a refresh at SWR before purchase & has now been installed with the new subframe, mounts, shafts, lever etc & new Helix 6 Paddle clutch/cover.

After the installation, the (massively) wider front track meant the alignment needed tweaking. My good friend Tom @ Cornering Performance is one of the best in the game - so naturally got him to come and set up the car for us.

corneringperformance

corneringperformance.com

Front camber & toe was set & rear camber/toe was measured - to order shims. The rear axle was toeing out one side & in the other, so made for a tail happy experience at Donington which was our test evening for the new goodies.

Off to Donington we went shortly after to test everything. The box is mint & the car has been completely transformed with the diff and gearing. It flys up the box and has stupid levels of grip now compared to what it was like with no LSD. It gives so much confidence under braking, that you can just smash it down the box and turn into the corner.

No issues all night, apart from my lead foot on the throttle pedal, which resulted in a snapped throttle cable... I got a bit carried away hammering the throttle down after clutchless shifting - need to get flatshift mapped in next to remove driver lack of skill!

When we got back, as mentioned - the car was a bit too tail happy due to the rear geo. So I worked out/purchased some shims to correct the axle. We've gone for 1mm toe out each side, so still should be lively enough, but just not in one direction like before! (It was 4mm out NS, 2mm In OS).

Obviously had to cut off every bolt on the stub axle as all the threads had rusted away!

Hopefully can get out again before the end of the year doing something, but we'll see!