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172 Cup Turbo



  HBT 172 Cup
Straight from the Garett website (i believe). WAter cooling plays only a small part of reducing heat soak when the engine is switched off and does not play any major role when the engine is running...


Oil & Water Plumbing

The intake and exhaust plumbing often receives the focus leaving the oil and water plumbing neglected.

Garrett ball bearing turbochargers require less oil than journal bearing turbos. Therefore an oil inlet restrictor is recommended if you have oil pressure over about 60 psig. The oil outlet should be plumbed to the oil pan above the oil level (for wet sump systems). Since the oil drain is gravity fed, it is important that the oil outlet points downward, and that the drain tube does not become horizontal or go “uphill” at any point.

Following a hot shutdown of a turbocharger, heat soak begins. This means that the heat in the head, exhaust manifold, and turbine housing finds it way to the turbo’s center housing, raising its temperature. These extreme temperatures in the center housing can result in oil coking.

To minimize the effects of heat soak-back, water-cooled center housings were introduced. These use coolant from the engine to act as a heat sink after engine shutdown, preventing the oil from coking. The water lines utilize a thermal siphon effect to reduce the peak heat soak-back temperature after key-off. The layout of the pipes should minimize peaks and troughs with the (cool) water inlet on the low side. To help this along, it is advantageous to tilt the turbocharger about 25° about the axis of shaft rotation.

Many Garrett turbos are water-cooled for enhanced durability.
 
  Trophy,R26,GSXR1000
Why take the risk? Silicone hosing to pipe in some coolant costs considerably less than a new turbo
 
  172 cup, Impreza P1
To minimize the effects of heat soak-back, water-cooled center housings were introduced. These use coolant from the engine to act as a heat sink after engine shutdown, preventing the oil from coking. The water lines utilize a thermal siphon effect to reduce the peak heat soak-back temperature after key-off. The layout of the pipes should minimize peaks and troughs with the (cool) water inlet on the low side. To help this along, it is advantageous to tilt the turbocharger about 25° about the axis of shaft rotation.

Many Garrett turbos are water-cooled for enhanced durability.

You won't get a siphon effect as you will have an air gap at the top of your header tank so this will not work.
 
  HBT 172 Cup
You won't get a siphon effect as you will have an air gap at the top of your header tank so this will not work.

When the car is up to temperature there is a constant flow to the header tank, enough to cool the turbo. I know of at least 4 turbocharged clios that used the top thermostat housing outlet as the coolant feed for the turbo and have no issues, and one of them has been turbo'd since the year 2000.

I am not changing the route.
 
  HBT 172 Cup
Right everythings done now, all pipework fully bolted up, it idles high in that video because there was no aux belt on, put it on and it purrs as standard (thank god not an air leak), however it doesnt make any turbo like noises. I obviously haven't driven it anywhere (althought i wonder how long it would last on stock ECU and map sensor lol!), but revving it on the spot upto 5-6k doesnt seem to make any sort of compressor stall or anything, what have i done wrong :(
 
  172 cup, Impreza P1
There will be no boost as there is no resistance when revving the engine. You need the engine to be under load so on the road or a rolling road.
 
  HBT 172 Cup
Ah does make sense! i will wip the compressor inlet hose off tommorow and check the compressor is spinning fine while the engine running, if it is ill turn a blind eye to the turbo noise (or lack off in my case), and just get the fucker mapped :D
 
  172 cup, Impreza P1
The turbo will spool up but not produce boost so it depends on what kind of turbo noise you are expecting.
 
  Mental 172 Cup
Why don't you drive it and see if it makes a difference? May produce some sort of noise revving it but not much..
 
  HBT 172 Cup
Why don't you drive it and see if it makes a difference? May produce some sort of noise revving it but not much..

I couldnt dream of even driving it up the road on Stock ECU/MAP, i would poo my pants at the thought of melted pistons. I've desttroyed MANY engines and cant afford to blow another one up just yet...
 
  182/RS2/ Turbo/Mk1
I couldnt dream of even driving it up the road on Stock ECU/MAP, i would poo my pants at the thought of melted pistons. I've desttroyed MANY engines and cant afford to blow another one up just yet...

The fuelling will go horrifically lean the moment it comes on boost as the ECU wont see any difference between boost and just normal WOT as the map sensor will be at the end of its range.

Definately not a good idea.
 
  HBT 172 Cup
Luke, KTEC will be mapping it on their GEN90.

Done quite a bit of work, its not far from completeion really. I was quite worried this morning got it all going but it was puffing quite a bit of smoke out the back when revving it at no real point (reccing, idle or overun), sort of hate these moments as a lot of things go through your mind, is the turbo oil return sufficient or the oil backing up? are the turbo oil seals shagged (always a risk when buying a 2nd hand turbo), have i damaged the engine as its had the inlet off multiple times and could of dropping something down?

Anyway it was my intention to drive the car as a small shakedown test to point out any problems, waited till about 9pm as i live on a busy tourist place and couldn't bare the shame to drive away billowing smoke out the rear.

I'm happy to report though it appears to just be residual oil from installation, no smoke at all now. The drive has highlighted a few issues. ANnoying chassis vibration needs attention the downpipe is touching somewhere, may have to take it off and wack it with a hammer, and the water feed/return doesnt appear to function theres no coolant flowing back into the tank, so may have to swallow my pride and plumb it into heater matrix lines as mentioned above (f**king hassle though!).
 
  HBT 172 Cup
I bought the GEN90 this morning.

The car is 99% done, it looks quite good in the engine bay now if i do say so myself :) Unfortunately the ECU wiped out my funds and i cant afford to have it mapped until payday at the end of september.

Just waiting for the JR filter too. How dare the factory close for 2 weeks as i decide to fecking order it, should be here next week though.

Can't wait buzzing for it now :)

I see your going down the turbo route too now?
 
  KTM 990 SD / S60 D5
That's great new's, supercharging mine, just waiting for the kit to turn up from Ktec. Going to be a few boosted Clio's kicking about now:)
 

batesey

ClioSport Club Member
  172 Cup Turbo
How many hours would you say it's took to bolt on all the turbo bits n bobs matey? Looking at doing it next year and will book a week off work to do so
 
  182/RS2/ Turbo/Mk1
How many hours would you say it's took to bolt on all the turbo bits n bobs matey? Looking at doing it next year and will book a week off work to do so

Its deffo not more than a weeks work, but the problem with booking a week off is when you get 1 day in and then realise you need a part thats going to take a few days to arrive.
So be very careful you fully understand all the bits you need in advance if doing it that way.
 
  HBT 172 Cup
How many hours would you say it's took to bolt on all the turbo bits n bobs matey? Looking at doing it next year and will book a week off work to do so

Many hours mate. Had to drop the subframe a couple of times to sort niggles, downpipe hitting steering rack heatsheild e.t.c its only the little bits that can take a good deal of time to sort really.

Fitting intercooler took me the best part of a day lol, lots of trial and error with silicon bends (2 of the Ktec hard pipes i binned off as they fitted terribly, and made up my own).

A week should be fine providing you have all the parts in fron of you to fit.
 
  HBT 172 Cup
Sent the injectors off to be checked, wanted this done as they were 2nd hand and you never know what you're buying, turns out they were perfect and didnt need cleaning, and you can see from the report 112cc @ 30s @ 50% DUty, equates to a 448cc (~ish) injector, so all good there too :) and a couple of pics of the main i pipe i heatwrapped out of boredom :) (im under no illusion it will probalby do jack s**t for performance)

MAP sensor been sent to coops so he can check it works well before i use it :)

*Still* waiting for my air filter to turn up (one in the pic is a cheapie temporary item that i wont be using)

Still waiting to take delivery of the GEN90 from Ktec which are .... out of stock :/

DSC01805Custom.jpg


DSC01797Custom.jpg


DSC01795Custom.jpg
 
  R5 gtt, R27 F1 team
i'm pretty curious on the results! why have you wrapped the boost pipe? looked far better in polished ally trim imo!.

what turbo is on?
 
  182/RS2/ Turbo/Mk1
LOL @ people caring so much what a pipe looks like.

Does it leak boost? No, cool, its perfect then.
 

Coops Mk1

ClioSport Club Member
  Lots of Scrap...
Map sensor tested and working Lainer, back in the post to sunny cornywall this afternoon ;)
 


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