Stick it up on axle stands and let it run, check for drips with a high powered torch...
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Martin's Track Clio 182 Project Thread
Right, so I checked the car last night when I got home from work. There was no leak at all, which I was surprised about. it was as clean as anything.
Thought I'd take it for a proper drive, to get the oil nice and hot/thin. So took it for a blast and stopped in a petrel garage after about 15 minutes to have a look underneath. There was nothing dripping on to the floor. But there was signs of a leak, as you can see from this photo. You can clearly see the oil staining. (Crap picture as I didn't jack the car up and just stuck my phone through the wheel)
So after seeing this I headed home and parked up. After 15 minutes I came back out, expecting to see a small puddle of oil. But there was nothing. Which is good, but very strange.
Anyway, it was getting dark so I left it at that. When I get home from work today I'll have a look underneath again, to see how much has leaked over night.
Question for you chaps. @Mini182 @sonny172cup @AlexW @Ph1 Tom Is there an oil feed to the splines of the shaft? I noticed a hole in the shaft sticking out of the box, which looked like a hole for an oil feed?
The reason I ask, is because I did pour oil onto the splines before putting it all back together, for a bit of lubrication. So I'm wondering if there is a small chance the oil I'm seeing leak, is just this oil I put on the splines and not actually coming out from the box itself. Although this would bring another question; why isn't the rubber o-ring holding this oil in!? Hope that makes sense.
Next steps, clean it up again and run the car on stands as suggested, to watch closely for leaks. If there isn't much or anything at all then great. If there is, then take the shaft back off and check the sleeve is actually fixed and not lose. If it is still leaking, and more than I can manage with top ups before track days. I'll have to start thinking about sending it back to Gripper.
Thought I'd take it for a proper drive, to get the oil nice and hot/thin. So took it for a blast and stopped in a petrel garage after about 15 minutes to have a look underneath. There was nothing dripping on to the floor. But there was signs of a leak, as you can see from this photo. You can clearly see the oil staining. (Crap picture as I didn't jack the car up and just stuck my phone through the wheel)
So after seeing this I headed home and parked up. After 15 minutes I came back out, expecting to see a small puddle of oil. But there was nothing. Which is good, but very strange.
Anyway, it was getting dark so I left it at that. When I get home from work today I'll have a look underneath again, to see how much has leaked over night.
Question for you chaps. @Mini182 @sonny172cup @AlexW @Ph1 Tom Is there an oil feed to the splines of the shaft? I noticed a hole in the shaft sticking out of the box, which looked like a hole for an oil feed?
The reason I ask, is because I did pour oil onto the splines before putting it all back together, for a bit of lubrication. So I'm wondering if there is a small chance the oil I'm seeing leak, is just this oil I put on the splines and not actually coming out from the box itself. Although this would bring another question; why isn't the rubber o-ring holding this oil in!? Hope that makes sense.
Next steps, clean it up again and run the car on stands as suggested, to watch closely for leaks. If there isn't much or anything at all then great. If there is, then take the shaft back off and check the sleeve is actually fixed and not lose. If it is still leaking, and more than I can manage with top ups before track days. I'll have to start thinking about sending it back to Gripper.
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If the diff is made in 2014 then is should be the newer type where the oil seal is a part of the shaft, (if you had the serial number gripper should be able to confirm this), so there should be no way the oil can leak down the splines. Behind the seal there will be oil splashing about all over the place, but there is no direct feed down the splines or anything like that.
Is the collar nice and smooth? No damage at all that could effect the oil seal?
The rubber o ring doesn't form any part of the oil seal, it is more of a dust cover. You can run without it no problem if need be.
I would give the seal and surrounding area a good clean so there is no signs of oil at all, then take it for another drive and inspect it after.
Is the collar nice and smooth? No damage at all that could effect the oil seal?
The rubber o ring doesn't form any part of the oil seal, it is more of a dust cover. You can run without it no problem if need be.
I would give the seal and surrounding area a good clean so there is no signs of oil at all, then take it for another drive and inspect it after.
I'm not sure I'll be able to get a serial number, as I think it was given on the side as compensation for another problem.
The collar is lovely and smooth yeah, looks brand new to be honest. When/if I end up taking the shaft off again, I'll have a closer inspection of it.
So if I put oil on the shaft splines before connecting them, could this oil have leaked out past the o-ring and be what I can see now? Assuming there is no oil feed to the splines from within the box?
I'll be giving it regular cleans now, so I can closely monitor it
Hmm yeah that could be a good idea actually.
This do the job?
http://www.halfords.com/motoring-travel/engine-oils-fluids/grease/comma-cv-lith-moly-grease-500g
If the gripper is like the Quaife then the S/N should be on the wetside, remove NS drive shaft and should be stamped there, maybe James or anyone else confirm.
As sudgested, totally clean up the area with spray brake cleaner to get all oil out.
All it takes is a few drips to make it look more so will have to run it for a while, otherwise you would have had a pool of it. Interesting about the collar on the gripper though, wonder what the quaiffe one looks like?
As sudgested, totally clean up the area with spray brake cleaner to get all oil out.
All it takes is a few drips to make it look more so will have to run it for a while, otherwise you would have had a pool of it. Interesting about the collar on the gripper though, wonder what the quaiffe one looks like?
I'll have a look for the serial number when I take it off, probably Sunday. Don't get that much time to do stuff mid week.
I had assumed this collar was a standard item on the standard shaft. Until Alex showed me a picture of the same part on a standard gearbox the other day an there was no collar at all.
Probably been leaking the whole time the box has had the gripper.
Needs cleaning up, and then inspecting IMO, I'd poss consider silicone on the splines, at the end of the collar, so it 100% can't be that, and then look where to go from there.
As a further thought, its not coming from speedo drive or something? I can't remember if that box is speedo drive or not, I know your car isn't obviously.
Needs cleaning up, and then inspecting IMO, I'd poss consider silicone on the splines, at the end of the collar, so it 100% can't be that, and then look where to go from there.
As a further thought, its not coming from speedo drive or something? I can't remember if that box is speedo drive or not, I know your car isn't obviously.
I looked again last night, and couldn't see one drip on the floor. So i'm thinking it must be so minor if anything. I've laid some paper down underneath it again to keep re inspecting. Or maybe it was just the tiny bit of oil I poured over the splines when connecting them.
I think the box is a speedo drive. As it is compatible with both a 172 cup and 182. No idea where this speedo drive thing is though or why that would be leaking?
One thing I'm still yet to find out, is whether the hole in the spline coming out of the box is for an oil feed, to keep the splines lubricated? I'm sure it's not! But I can't see why else there would be a hole there..
I'll give it a clean up at some point. And put some thick CV grease on the splines as suggested. That way I know, that any oil, is coming from inside the box!
As I expected then. Cheers. I'm confident now the oil must have been just what I put on the splines to be honest.
WHAT!!?? Not doing it then. lol
The splines are dry no wet feed (as Alex said no pump). The speedo drive is a black plastic sensor at the rear back of the box it sticks up so the loom plug connects to it.
I'm jealous. You going TRAX?
Quick tracking check done. Left wheel was 20 minutes toe in. Right wheel was parallel. Both are now 5 minutes toe out.
I really need to think about learning how to do the tracking myself. Hate paying £40 for it every time, especially if the parts are potentially taken apart a lot.
Plastic windows have been fitted on the front now too. With no loom to control the window motor I needed to switch over to the plastics for tomorrows track day. It could have been a sauna in there otherwise. At least now I have sliders and air scoops.
Although the sliders have started to scratch quite badly already, which is very annoying!! I've had a play around with them and made it all a bit looser so hopefully it won't be as bad now.
I really need to think about learning how to do the tracking myself. Hate paying £40 for it every time, especially if the parts are potentially taken apart a lot.
Plastic windows have been fitted on the front now too. With no loom to control the window motor I needed to switch over to the plastics for tomorrows track day. It could have been a sauna in there otherwise. At least now I have sliders and air scoops.
Although the sliders have started to scratch quite badly already, which is very annoying!! I've had a play around with them and made it all a bit looser so hopefully it won't be as bad now.
Just get to know the local tracking guys!
Mine costs a mars bar and a lucozade haha
Mine costs a mars bar and a lucozade haha
I'd need to measure up a flat spot on my drive first. But that would be good
You're in the trade, you probably take a lot more cars to them than I do?
Would be ideal but unlikely to happen haha.
True. I do have good contacts haha
Brand Hatch
So I did an evening at Brands Hatch yesterday. It was the first shake down for the car after the recent changes/ upgrades.
The car felt very responsive with the removal of the PAS and some more weight saving. The PMS linkage felt awesome too. So I was very very pleased with these changes.
However I had some nasty juddering from the n/s front wheel. See the thread below for more details:
http://www.cliosport.net/threads/new-box-serious-juddering-on-n-s-wheel-under-load-any-ideas.777884/
I'm really hoping this won't be too much of a ball ache to get sorted. I feel a bit gutted that I've still got an issue and that I wasn't able to enjoy the car to anywhere near its full potential. I was having to potter around the right handers, Druids and Clarke Curve, with barely any throttle. Paddock wasn't as bad as you don't have as much steering angle.
For some reason the mother wanted to come along and see what all the track day fuss was about. She brought my little sister along who jumped in with the old man for a passenger lap on his permitted session. She really enjoyed herself which is good.
I also managed to give @AlexW @sonny172cup and @GrahamS passenger laps. This was also helpful so they could feel the juddering first hand and offer opinions and suggestions. Cheers for that chaps.
I still have an oil leak from the gearbox too which is annoying. So this also needs to be investigated further and dealt with.
I still enjoyed the evening though, even with the issues. So it wasn't a complete waste. There was plenty of Clios there too, although I didn't have any time to go and say hello to anyone.
So I did an evening at Brands Hatch yesterday. It was the first shake down for the car after the recent changes/ upgrades.
The car felt very responsive with the removal of the PAS and some more weight saving. The PMS linkage felt awesome too. So I was very very pleased with these changes.
However I had some nasty juddering from the n/s front wheel. See the thread below for more details:
http://www.cliosport.net/threads/new-box-serious-juddering-on-n-s-wheel-under-load-any-ideas.777884/
I'm really hoping this won't be too much of a ball ache to get sorted. I feel a bit gutted that I've still got an issue and that I wasn't able to enjoy the car to anywhere near its full potential. I was having to potter around the right handers, Druids and Clarke Curve, with barely any throttle. Paddock wasn't as bad as you don't have as much steering angle.
For some reason the mother wanted to come along and see what all the track day fuss was about. She brought my little sister along who jumped in with the old man for a passenger lap on his permitted session. She really enjoyed herself which is good.
I also managed to give @AlexW @sonny172cup and @GrahamS passenger laps. This was also helpful so they could feel the juddering first hand and offer opinions and suggestions. Cheers for that chaps.
I still have an oil leak from the gearbox too which is annoying. So this also needs to be investigated further and dealt with.
I still enjoyed the evening though, even with the issues. So it wasn't a complete waste. There was plenty of Clios there too, although I didn't have any time to go and say hello to anyone.
Good day yesterday Martin, shame about the problem hopefully will get to the bottom of it soon, if you ever need a hand give me a shout
I might have to take you up on these offers :blush:
GrahamS
ClioSport Club Member
335d
Brilliant evening none the less. Can't wait to get them both out next month so we best get mending yours and finishing mine.
You mum is quite an avid photographer!
@sonny172cup good to meet you yesterday mate.
You mum is quite an avid photographer!
@sonny172cup good to meet you yesterday mate.
@AlexW came down this weekend to help me sort out the recent issues.
After speaking to Gripper (who actually phoned me back on a Saturday afternoon - very impressive customer service) we confirmed there was an issue with the diff. The metal sleeve and the splines had become detached. When the shaft spins, the splines just spin within the sleeve and not with it. Which obviously means there is no oil seal what so ever and is why the oil has been pissing out between the splines non stop.
Anyway, upon instruction from Gripper, Alex removed the sleeve and glued it back in place. With Gorilla Glue. He then fitted a brand new seal kit and that's how we left it. Which will allow the glue to bond properly without any contamination from oil, or vibration/movement from refitting the shaft.
Whilst I was faffing around getting the old seal out, he did also change my nearside drive shaft over to a shorter Ph1 one. Which I can confirm was about 10mm shorter. Thanks @Mini182 for confirming this issue. It did look as though the shaft was bottoming out in the diff, you could see some small marks. Hopefully now it'll be sweet and not too short though.
I just need to bolt everything back up and refill the box with oil and hopefully that will be the leak and knocking issues sorted. Roll on the weekend.
Cheers
After speaking to Gripper (who actually phoned me back on a Saturday afternoon - very impressive customer service) we confirmed there was an issue with the diff. The metal sleeve and the splines had become detached. When the shaft spins, the splines just spin within the sleeve and not with it. Which obviously means there is no oil seal what so ever and is why the oil has been pissing out between the splines non stop.
Anyway, upon instruction from Gripper, Alex removed the sleeve and glued it back in place. With Gorilla Glue. He then fitted a brand new seal kit and that's how we left it. Which will allow the glue to bond properly without any contamination from oil, or vibration/movement from refitting the shaft.
Whilst I was faffing around getting the old seal out, he did also change my nearside drive shaft over to a shorter Ph1 one. Which I can confirm was about 10mm shorter. Thanks @Mini182 for confirming this issue. It did look as though the shaft was bottoming out in the diff, you could see some small marks. Hopefully now it'll be sweet and not too short though.
I just need to bolt everything back up and refill the box with oil and hopefully that will be the leak and knocking issues sorted. Roll on the weekend.
Cheers
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Great news Martin, hopefully thats that sorted.
So was I mate.
Maybe it was made years back and was just sitting on the shelf past the threshold..
