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TomoTek - 182 Track Build here we come!...



Hollidog

ClioSport Club Member
  182
Hi mate, we’re running in class C again in the TDC. Want to give it another shot this year.

Supercup run in another race as the grids are two big to combine them (used to be the same race) the supercup control tyres are Yokos now too, not the Toyos

What rough power at the wheels are you running? Must be decent to run in class A?
Ah ok, on the same weekend as the others? The calendars don't seem to line up on the MSV websites lol.

Engine is being rebuilt after I blew it at Silverstone last year, hoping to get to around 220 at the fly which should come to around 190 at the wheels assuming ~15% drivetrain loss (what have you seen, out of interest?) then hoping to get the weight down to around 950kg so around 196whp/ton. Otherwise run ballast and go into B, depends on which one I'm closer to tbh.
 

Tomotek

ClioSport Club Member
Ah ok, on the same weekend as the others? The calendars don't seem to line up on the MSV websites lol.

Engine is being rebuilt after I blew it at Silverstone last year, hoping to get to around 220 at the fly which should come to around 190 at the wheels assuming ~15% drivetrain loss (what have you seen, out of interest?) then hoping to get the weight down to around 950kg so around 196whp/ton. Otherwise run ballast and go into B, depends on which one I'm closer to tbh.
They run the races independently. So the TDC and Supercup aren't always on the same weekends or tracks. Most of the time they are though.

We've been seeing around a 18% loss from fly to wheel hp.

Is 950kg your weigh with or without driver?, as the min weights include driver and fuel left over.
 

Hollidog

ClioSport Club Member
  182
They run the races independently. So the TDC and Supercup aren't always on the same weekends or tracks. Most of the time they are though.

We've been seeing around a 18% loss from fly to wheel hp.

Is 950kg your weigh with or without driver?, as the min weights include driver and fuel left over.
Gotcha. Damn 18%! I think that'll definitely put me down to B. Find out in a couple weeks once it's on the rollers I suppose.

950kg with me and post race fuel. I'm only 64kg in race kit, full jockey spec haha. Might not matter any more anyway!

If I do end up in B I think I'll go TDC as I already have a set of R888R
 

paul-h

ClioSport Club Member
  172, Fiesta S1600
Yeah he wasn’t happy, didn’t see him after the race but saw he’d written some ‘interesting’ comments about me on Facebook in the Civic Owners Page as he was after a new door (not getting dragged into all that)

Simon in the Clio pulled the same move on me the lap or two before, but I saw him coming in my mirrors and just ran wide and gave him space.. then got the cut back on him at the next corner.

As James said, R888Rs for everything


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Are they the same compound of tyre front to back?
 

Eddie555

ClioSport Club Member
  Q7 2018 & 172 Cup.
Quick question, what hot pressures are you running at Donnie? I'm gonna run my R888r there on Monday.. TIA.

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Eddie555

ClioSport Club Member
  Q7 2018 & 172 Cup.
Sorry missed this... run about 2.0bar front 2.2bar rear (kind of abit late!) how did you get on?
I use psi. I ran 30 front and 32 rear which is similar to what you run.. It was a pretty cold and dampish day so couldn't real push that hard, I had a brain fart at the approach to Craners and turned the Clio into a 100mph french lawned mower.. I just dont feel as confident on my R888R'S as I do with my AO48s...
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Tomotek

ClioSport Club Member
Well with the current situation and the first half of our season being cancelled its been nice to reflect on the last race of last season while I have been writing up the race report which is well overdue!.... The final race weekend of the year certainly had its highs and lows.

RACE REPORT- RND#7 TDC Brands Hatch Indy (16/11/2019)

The weather forecast for the weekend was looking dark and wet! typical for mid November. Friday was setup day and very wet!, so we swapped to our full wet setup, softest springs, camber and toe backed off. We didn't want to be caught out again like we were at Oulton Park.

We turned up Saturday morning and the rain was holding off for now but the track was very saturated and standing water everywhere.

Again we were the first group of cars out on track for qualifying. Ben started and put in some good solid laps around the 1:10 - 1:08 mark in tricky conditions. putting us P9. Due to the 24 cars flying round at some pace, a dry line started to appear and the laptimes started to drop lap by lap. Graham Hill bend and McLarens still proving to be very greasy tho!.. I jumped in and could instantly feel the car felt better in the wet conditions than it did at Oulton was was great. I put my head down and tried to find the grip. 1:08, then a 1:06, followed by a 1:05 .. P6 at this point.

Couple of our not so finest slides through Graham Hill Bend..

Ben giving full beans!














Me not so much giving it the beans, but lucky to be a bit further to the right of the track when I lost it.














With a few minutes left in the session I started a flying lap. First couple of corners felt great, The class B Clio of Honeybone catching me however. As we dropped through Graham Hill Bend I could see I was 1s up on my best time but I was shown blue flags. I wasn't going to lift off as I was on a hot lap (not normally an issue but on such a short circuit its difficult to manage).. Going into surtees I saw Honeybone come up the inside which pushed me wide off line. As I came into McLarens I had a moment and the back stepped out twice, which saw me sliding sideways off the track and into the gravel, coming to rest against the barrier. Session over! P9 at the end

Nice video of me pawing at the wheel in full panic mode haha.



















Brands Indy - Quali.png

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RACE>>>>

After spending all our prep time between quali and the race cleaning all the gravel out the engine bay and off the car. We didn't have time to make any adjustments to setup. The day had turned out to be quite nice and the track was pretty much dry by the time the race came!. We were going to have to stay on our wet setup!

We decided Ben could have another go at starting a race to get more experience, and I'd take over for the 2nd stint.

Ben had a tricky start, not helped by our lack of handbrake and having to hold the car on the brakes while trying to get revs up. (something to sort for our next race). He dropped from P3 in class to P4. It was tricky to know how far to push the car, especially as the last time Ben was out was the first few laps of a soaking wet quali session. Ben found his feet after a few laps and really began to push, catching up with the yellow Fiesta of Littlewood in P3.

10 minutes into the stint, P1 and P2 of Gay and Harrison have some contact coming through surtees which leads to Gay in the Civic having to peel into the pits with a puncture! putting us into P3

Mid way through the stint (19:50 on the video) you'll see Ben narrowly missing a Golf and some of the pitlane barriers as the Golf had a moment coming onto the pit straight and sliding into and back of the pitlane entrance bringing some tecpro barrier with him as he does! Obviously Ben was the first on the seen and immediately radio'd to say he thought they would have to bring the safety car out to clear the debris. Which they did. He rounded McLarens behind Littlewood only to see Littlewood run wide onto the grass and slide off the circuit. So Ben dived into the pits now in P2, 4s behind the Leader Harrison who also pitted this lap too.

Ben came to a stop in front of Harrison in our pit box. Putting us P1 on the road. The mandatory minimum pit stop time is 2:00 minutes. I took over and watched the dash timer counting down. The pit exit line is the 2nd line out of the pits and about 5s from the box. I saw Harrison behind who came in 4s infront still not moving at around 8s, so made the decision as he started to move around my 5s mark to go for it!. (you cant go excessively slowly in the pitlane of you will get a penalty, so i kept my speed up). The counter went to Zero as I crossed the line so I knew it would be close.

We were now P1 on the road, under safety car conditions. I pushed on to catch the train. The track went green again and I managed to hold Harrison behind for about 1 lap before I got a little tap from behind at Druids and through he went. (He was running about 1s a lap quicker so not really surprising). So back to P2.

I was really struggling with the car balance, it was heavily under steering at the hairpin and through the last corner. I could feel the suspension bottoming out somehow. My pace was about 1.5s off what we've done in the dry. Obviously he had our wet soft springs on and realisation hit. The car was now cornering faster due to the dry conditions and the car was rolling a lot more and the RH was too low as I hadn't compensated for the fact we had softer springs on. This meant that the outside tyre was bottoming out against the inner wheel arch! stopping the travel and causing the US. (was pretty obvious after the race as we had worn through all the paint on the inner arches).

With my lack of pace i could feel the P3 Fiesta closing the gap. I managed to hold him off. Then As we pulled out of Graham Hill Bend Littlewood pulled off the circuit with an issue (DNF), so I had some breathing space!

Unfortunately Chris came over the radio to tell me I had a stop-go penalty for a short pitstop!... 1:59.233... Gutted, but worth the shot at P1. (Harrisons pit stop was a 2:04.313 hence why so close)

I came in to serve my penalty @39:20, and back out i went. Unfortunately I had lost P2 to the Porsche and wasn't able to catch back up.

So we finished P3. But gutted to not have secured P2 but I wanted to go for the win and it didn't pay off.

Another trophy to add to the collection though!!!

Full Onboard below!..


Brands Indy - Race.png

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  Clio 182 Impreza STI
Hi, absolutely love your build and the attention to detail, I have copied the way you fitted your side windows and am currently de-wiring the rear loom as per your diagram. Did you ever get around to doing a simplified drawing for the rest of the car loom? Would be great help if you did.
keep up the great work!
 

Tomotek

ClioSport Club Member
Hi, absolutely love your build and the attention to detail, I have copied the way you fitted your side windows and am currently de-wiring the rear loom as per your diagram. Did you ever get around to doing a simplified drawing for the rest of the car loom? Would be great help if you did.
keep up the great work!
Thanks... glad it has been of some use to someone.. I never got round to sorting the other looms out and recording them properly... I'll need to do it as I have another set of looms to modify for another project!

When do we get to see the spoiler?

And find out how much they are? As I’d like to put my name down for one please 😂 cash waiting 😂
Haha nice one!... I'll do some posts soon, im just in the middle of trying to design as proper website so I can upload parts to sell like the geometry correction kit etc.
 

Tomotek

ClioSport Club Member
Well it’s taken some time to complete and a lot of man hours to design but I finally launched the teams website and online shop on Wednesday!

www.proamracing.co.uk

7877451aba16c57c8c2a8ae0450453a8.jpg


If you ever wondered what the full spec of the car, we’ll it’s now all listed in the ‘OUR CAR’ section!

Hopefully I’ll be able to start filling the shop with more products as I can turn my attention back to designing things now!

Just need to return to some normality so I can get parts made and tested


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1985michael182

ClioSport Club Member
🥳🥳🥳 about time you stared your own company!!

Site looks brilliant and extremely professional. Looking forward to seeing the products available and that wing looks purposeful. I'm guessing you guys pulled some strings for some wind tunnel testing time?

Well done Pro-AM
 

Tomotek

ClioSport Club Member
When’s the spoiler going live 😂
Quite a way off i'd imagine, takes ages to get a part in a position to do a batch run.. need to do a lot more testing too and improve it.

Website looks amazing. Well done
Site looks great tbh!
Thanks gents.. if you can think of any ideas to make it better let me know!

🥳🥳🥳 about time you stared your own company!!

Site looks brilliant and extremely professional. Looking forward to seeing the products available and that wing looks purposeful. I'm guessing you guys pulled some strings for some wind tunnel testing time?

Well done Pro-AM
Thanks!..It has been a challenging 6 months to get to this point but glad its done now and can more parts out.. tough along side an already demanding normal job, but least it means im financially stable.

haha i wish we could put it in a wind tunnel ;) .. CFD and some hand calc will have to do. (we used a BYC std element and made our own pylon mounts to position is where we wanted. I'm not a fan of the big brackets they do and they place the wing too far back for where i wanted.)

Kit purchased! (y)
As promised, I’ve ordered my kit
Cheers boys!.. I know @a17vts has his already!, hope you enjoy them!.. when we can
 

Tomo3292

ClioSport Club Member
  Clio 1.6 K4m
#50
Final chapter on the wiring!

Thought i'd put up a quick post on the switch panel I made. I started out by listing all the switches I needed and might need in the future and then positioned them in excel where I would want them on the panel.

I intend on making some custom stickers to easily identify each switch, following the basic colour scheme below:

View attachment 1340145

I ordered various styles of push button off ebay. These included blue/black illuminated latching buttons as well as green/black momentary push buttons. Each one chosen for its required function.

View attachment 1340146

View attachment 1340147

I then taped up my carbon panel and marked out where I would drill the holes for the buttons

View attachment 1340148

Then using a 12mm wood drill bit I drilled through the carbon sheet (a wood drill bit makes a clean single cut which works well on carbon)

View attachment 1340149

I then mounted all the switches in the desired locations and stuck some labels on (labels I took from an old MSA sticker sheet i had lying about, hence why some of them don't make sense. I intend on doing my own stickers at some point)

View attachment 1340150

After that was all mocked up I started to cut some signal wires ready to solder to the switches. I used the same colour code as the excel sheet to help me identify which wire is which when I connect them to the plug on the chassis loom.

View attachment 1340151

Halve way through the wiring process.

View attachment 1340152

Wiring all finished, with the signal wires and earth wires done for the main switches and then the power wires for the internal LEDs.
These wires are then secured to the switches with a section of heat shrink, then hot glued over the terminals to insulate them and prevent the wires from being damaged.

View attachment 1340153

Switch Panel bolted to the frame:

View attachment 1340154

Heat shrunk and pinned into the connector and connected to the chassis loom. (just need to secure the connectors to the tunnel)
I temporarily wired the LED power wires to the battery cut off switch to check everything worked as it should.

View attachment 1340155

Switch Panel Done.

View attachment 1340156

View attachment 1340157

With the wiring all done it was time to setup the car and get it on track!!!!. . . .
In awe at the workmanship throughout this build. Lockdown has had it perks, mainly reading through your thread. Firstly massive kudos on the build, the racing season, and the new business adventure your embarking on.

Would I be able to pick your brains on a few of the electrical issues on my build. at present I am making a switch panel, and have taken all the sensors from the monolever to the panel. Decluttering the wheel in the process. now my question is on the switches how have you wired them in? Signal wire and 12v ? any grounds?
 

scullyg40

ClioSport Club Member
I'm not a fan of the big brackets they do and they place the wing too far back for where i wanted.)
I can understand your not a fan of the big brackets, but regarding position of the wing, doesn't placing the wing further back give more clean air, and more moment/torque (I don't know the correct English word)?
 

Tomotek

ClioSport Club Member
I can understand your not a fan of the big brackets, but regarding position of the wing, doesn't placing the wing further back give more clean air, and more moment/torque (I don't know the correct English word)?
Hi mate, yeah correct the further back you put the wing the larger the moment and equivalent torque/load the wing produces... I didn't want to go too far backwards as I wanted the aero balance still be predominantly forward biased... essentially too far back and we'd still have understeer.

Regarding the 'clean air' there is a balance again.. you have to go far enough back, or high enough up to be out of the wake of dirty air caused by the sudden void that the 'hatchback' design of a clio produces. As we are limited by the roof height in MSA/FIA regs too so we can't go upwards, so ours is positioned close to the spoiler to allow the airflow to still be controlled by the roof at the point the air hits the leading edge of the wing., and giving the aero leverage we wanted.
 

scullyg40

ClioSport Club Member
Good posting, I like that. I'm still working on my mechanical grip, still have to test the Roll centre kit for example. But as the car was, with the splitter, I never felt the need for a wing.
 

Tomotek

ClioSport Club Member
In awe at the workmanship throughout this build. Lockdown has had it perks, mainly reading through your thread. Firstly massive kudos on the build, the racing season, and the new business adventure your embarking on.

Would I be able to pick your brains on a few of the electrical issues on my build. at present I am making a switch panel, and have taken all the sensors from the monolever to the panel. Decluttering the wheel in the process. now my question is on the switches how have you wired them in? Signal wire and 12v ? any grounds?
Cheers mate, appreciate you taking the time to read it all. Yeah its been an interesting few years! Glad to see all the work starting to pay off.

All our switches are switched to ground. So we took the signal wires from the stalks and routed them to the switch panel and out the switches to a ground point in the chassis.

There are a few switches on our switch panel that controls the low voltage side of a few relays to turn the high power side on.. things like the ignition switch, heated screen.. this was done because we routed new wiring relays that didn't exist in the normal loom.
 

Tomotek

ClioSport Club Member
Good posting, I like that. I'm still working on my mechanical grip, still have to test the Roll centre kit for example. But as the car was, with the splitter, I never felt the need for a wing.
Yeah will be good to re evaluate the balance after fitting the RC kit... we had a pretty good balance before fitting our splitter. So after fitting it we did about 2 laps before coming in to fit the wing!.. was very tail happy.. the wing brought the balance back to how it was before, just better overall grip
 

Tomo3292

ClioSport Club Member
  Clio 1.6 K4m
#46

Finally sorted all the pics out for the wiring so here's the first lot!..

I started out with making the main battery cables.
I ordered some 25mm² black power cable with various sized crimp terminals and also ordered a 175A Mega fuse before the master switch to protect the system. The standard battery terminal has a built in fuse but due to the battery relocation and style of battery a replacement was needed.

I bought myself a terminal crimper. The hex style ones are a little more expensive, but they are the best tools ever when doing battery cables.. you get a perfect connection and can make the cables in minutes.

View attachment 1337575

I made a short earth cable from the battery to the main chassis earth (which i pre-welded a threaded top hat into the cage base)

View attachment 1337576

Mega Fuse bolted to the tunnel under the gearstick frame.

View attachment 1337577

Mega fuse to battery kill switch

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Battery kill switch cable to starter was then bolted to the tunnel

View attachment 1337579

View attachment 1337580

The battery cable was then passed through an earls rubber firewall grommet

View attachment 1337581

The cable then runs over to the LH chassis rail to the 2 pin terminal block that I installed to allow one cable to run to the starter motor, and the other one runs up to the main engine bay fuse box for the main 12v supply to the car.
I covered the cable in some heat resistant sheathing to add some extra protection from the heat in the engine bay.

View attachment 1337582

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I managed to carefully separate the old starter cable crimp terminal from the standard cable so i could re use it.

View attachment 1337584

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I crimped the cable coming from the terminal block and also an additional cable that will run to the alternator into the starter terminal. I then heat shrinked the end to prevent it contacting anything and shorting out.

View attachment 1337586

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Starter to Alternator cable routing around the block.

View attachment 1337588

The other cable from the terminal block spliced into 4 power cables going to the various main fuses.

View attachment 1337589

I then gave the inside a clean out ready for the next stage of the electrical work. 🆙 - really happy with how all the power cables came out.. Next up was the engine bay and rear end looms. (Update to follow soon!)

View attachment 1337590
I don't suppose you could remember what guage / size wire you used for the alternator/starter circuit. I have cut mine out as it's in a bad way and looking at replacing something similar to your idea. Struggling to find the size of I am honest.
 

Tomotek

ClioSport Club Member
I don't suppose you could remember what guage / size wire you used for the alternator/starter circuit. I have cut mine out as it's in a bad way and looking at replacing something similar to your idea. Struggling to find the size of I am honest.
Hi mate, i used the same 25mm² black power cable from AES

 


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